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CluelessDrifter's Replies
Season 9 was a chore for me too. There was a decent set up for Season 9 with the angels falling, but they didn't adequately follow through on it. That season is the reason I think angels are now a joke, and the way they destroyed reapers really annoyed me. The manufactured angst was ridiculous, and I think the 'on the nose' parallels in Thinman were embarrassing to watch. Yes, season 9 gave us the MoC, but there was so many things about season 9 that I didn't like that not even the MoC could make up for them.
Yeah, that's generally what I thought when I saw this. It's so annoying. Curing Claire is just the thing to make Dean trust the BMoL more. I'm still hoping they have Mr. Ketch go after Claire at the end of the episode like he did the girl at the end of American Nightmare. Not because I want Claire's character gone necessarily (although if they continue to write her as a bratty teenager instead of a young woman, I wouldn't mind), but for me the Winchesters have to start catching onto what's been going on behind their backs all season, and having Claire go missing because the BMoL want to do experiments on her or kill her, seems like a good way to do that. Besides, when was the last time we had someone of importance who wasn't a monster die on this show? Season 10?
That makes me feel bad for her. It'd be one thing if Mary was supposed to be a villain. If you're playing the part of a villain, then I'm guessing that you know people aren't going to like your character.
I'm all for complex characters, but they're not giving us anything about Mary to make her anything other than a one-dimensional cold, female hunter (I'm not including her previous stints on the show, which I think gave her more depth, but the current season).
I really liked the Alpha Vampire. I think he brought gravitas to the role of Alphas and monsters in general, but I think it's primarily down to the actor. If they could get similarly talented actors for the other Alpha roles, kept the Alphas intimidating, dark instead of comedic, and almost all-powerful, then I would be onboard with seeing more of them. The only problem is that now the Colt is back in play. It takes the intimidating factor away from them.
I guess that the writers will have to come up with something creative to make the Colt useless again, or nothing is going to be a threat anymore. Obviously, archangels are on that list of 5 things that the Colt can't kill, and possibly his spawn is also on that list. We don't know the other 3 (Possibly Death if the only thing that could kill him was his scythe). Maybe whatever the other two things are could be 'big bads' in the future, but as of right now, there's very little that will be a challenge as long as the Colt sticks around.
Because when hellhounds are let off their leash, I guess they want a chew toy, and that guy was it. I think they said it was because the dead boyfriend ran away from it.
Why did they send Sam and the GotW off in the car? Stupid plot contrivance. There was no reason for it. Dean and Crowley went to do the 'oh so much more dangerous job of tracking it in the woods,' instead of staying with the girl. They found its den. Of course the hellhound went after the girl. That's what it was after most of the episode.
Yeah, and I'm expecting some kind of fracturing. I guess it could go a few different ways. Toni representing the 'old men' in London vs. Ketch and Mick (with Winchesters), Toni and Ketch vs. Mick (with Winchesters), Toni and Mick vs. Ketch (Winchesters), Toni and Mick (with Winchesters) vs. Ketch.
I don't want to see any of these things, but I'm thinking that by the end of the season one of the BMoL will be on board with the Winchester way of doing things. How else could the writers possibly make Sam and Mary right in supporting the BMoL if they didn't have at least one BMoL who was good(ish) (I'm thinking it'll be Mick depending on what happens with Claire)? I don't want to see that either, but the way this season is shaping up to be the 'Mary can do no wrong' season, that's the way it'll probably go (Sorry, if you like Mary, but I've had an extraordinarily bad week and don't particularly feel like being impartial).
I also think that Lucifer's spawn will be something that the two sides will disagree about (whether it should be killed straight away or allowed to live, since it hasn't done anything wrong.) I know Cas has said nephilim are abominations, but the angels said the same thing about Sam. The other nephilim we were shown wasn't destroying worlds, and she'd presumably grown up to full strength. The same goes for Jesse, who Cas also said was an abomination, and Jesse turned out to be good.
I know Lucifer is an archangel, and that could mean that his child will be vastly superior in the power department, but for me the Lily Sunder episode was all about how angels aren't necessarily the most reliable when it comes to intel and how easily they are led around by things they're told from other angels. Maybe if they gave specific examples of nephilim destroying worlds instead of saying what angels have been taught to believe for eons, I could get behind Lucifer's spawn being a threat, but at this point, I don't think it is. Unfortunately, I think next season, we'll be seeing the Winchesters trying to protect the kid by having Mary take off with it somewhere (and this will put the Winchesters and Lucifer vs. Crowley, possibly Cas and the angels, and the BMoL).
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think I remember Mark P. campaigning a little to get his part as Lucifer back either last year or at the start of this one. I don't think he's being wasted on the character if it's what he wants to do. I think for me the problem is that Lucifer is here at all. I don't know why they insisted on bringing him back last year other than to maybe give Misha something to do. But still, they brought him back, and then they had the perfect chance to get rid of him again when Amara pulled him out of Cas, but they didn't do it. Now we're stuck with this ridiculous baby storyline.
I'm going to be annoyed if the child grows at an expedient rate. Amara all over again. I'm also going to be annoyed if they age the baby up to being a child or teenager child, and we're stuck with a recurring kid on the show or if said child goes and rescues his father from Crowley as the article suggests.
Also, I know it was just one episode, but we've already seen nephilim, and she wasn't bad by nature. She didn't have all these superpowers and wasn't the greatest evil ever known. I think she had supernatural strength and could see angels in their natural form rather than as the vessels they were inhabiting. That's it. They're probably going to wreck, I mean 'add' things to that lore the way they have everything else though. Honestly, I'd rather someone just take off with the baby and have it disappear into Jesse, the anti-Christ land, but then we'd have to hear 'what about Lucifer's spawn?' all the time the way we do Jesse.
I agree with what both of you have said, but I'm not even sure that Luicfer being played by Mark will do much of anything for me. Remember that Misha was basing Casifer off of how Mark advised him to play Lucifer, so I'm thinking Mark tends to think the imaginary Lucifer in Sam's head from season 7 is the real Lucifer as that's the way he played him most recently. Ah, but Lucifer in season 5 was fantastic. Le sigh.
It's nice to see some optimism. I really like Glynn as a writer too. It should be interesting.
I'm wondering if Claire is going to make it out of the episode or if she's going to go wind up like the girl at the end of American Nightmare. Maybe she'll be cured, or not cured, but given something to 'take the edge off the bloodlust' or something, and Mr. Ketch will clean up the problem. Fast forward a couple of weeks, and Dean or Sam get a phone call from Jody wondering if they've seen Claire. They'll start looking into it and see all the people who have gone missing after they thought a case was finished, and that will put them directly against the BMoL.
I'd like it more if they had Claire stay a werewolf, had Mick saying they need to put her down, and then had Sam and Dean come into direct conflict with the BMoL by the next episode, but I'm willing to let it play out over a few episodes as long as Sam and Dean are not with the BMoL for long.
I know! As soon as I wrote it, I got excited too. I would love that. I'm imagining the bouncy emoticon if that helps.
Yeah, global carnage would really be the interesting way to go. I know the show doesn't have the budget for it, but the universe set up in The End played out with Dean and Sam together (as in Sam not being Lucifer's meatsuit) would be an unbelievable way breathe life back into the series. Maybe they could use the props from the 100 and split the costs.
Moving the series to Netflix would be great. I don't know about 4-6 episodes. Maybe 10? At any rate, having something darker, like Jessica Jones or Stranger Things or whatever, that you could binge watch would be amazing. I also wouldn't want Dabb to be at the helm. I think they need to completely get rid of everyone associated with writing the show on CW and get a new bunch of quality writers to watch all the other episodes, so they could get the rules of the Supernatural universe down and go with it.
I just thought of another way they could reset Lucifer and make him a threat again. They could kill the nephilim at the end of the season, either the BMoL or angels or a combination of those, and it'll set Lucifer on a course for revenge next season. Would that mean that this entire season has only existed to be a set up for next season?
I'd also add that another truly dreadful scenario would be if the BMoL somehow eliminate Lucifer, as in he sacrifices himself for his child, when the sacrifices of Sam and Dean in season 5 were so massive to lock him away.
Personally, I see a rehash of season 4, 5 and 11.
Season 4 with the lying about working with someone the brothers know not to trust, slowly trying to convince Dean to go along with it, he does, and next they'll find out it was a bad idea.
Season 11 with the baby and possible accelerated growth. There are two ways the nephilim storyline could go. It's either evil or not. As much as they're talking up the need for it to be killed, much the way did with Amara in season 11, then I'm thinking the baby won't be evil.
Season 5 . . . I don't think they can ever undo the damage they've done with Lucifer. After you've seen Lucifer throwing a temper tantrum and listening to rock music in Sam's bedroom, because he's mad with Daddy Chuck, he'll never seem like the threat he was in season 5. I know he's gone from meat suit to meat suit this season, and I know he was bored and wanted to wreak havoc on an ever increasing scale just because, but that's all changed with the prospect of fatherhood in front of him. How are any of those things as evil as anything he threatened to do in Season 5? No horsemen. No apocalypse. The only way to really make him enough of a threat for the kind of sacrifice that happened in season 5 would be to get Michael out of the cage and threaten another Apocalypse.
Maybe Lucifer will steal his child at the end of the season, disappear, and actually be turned into a sympathetic 'father' next season who only wants to save his offspring and raise it to make up for any shortcomings in Chuck's raising of him. Worse, they'll have someone like the BMoL or (still hopeful we'll see Michael again) Michael take the baby, and Lucifer will be a sympathetic father next season looking for his child and enlisting the help of the Winchesters. (Don't get me wrong. I think those sound like truly dreadful scenarios, but I think that's where it's going).
Keep commenting, so the board doesn't feel dead. I think the word is out there enough, so when people stop by here to have a look, it has to look like a busy board. That's the only thing I can think to do at this point, and I think, personally, that people here are doing a good job with that.
I see what you're saying. The illusion of impropriety is what they should be concerned about. I hadn't thought of it in the way you suggested, but I guess I too have wondered if there is something going on behind the scenes at times and especially lately.
Conspiracy theories aside, I generally tend to think the writers are threatened by Dean. It seems like they want to punish him and make him non-existent in the storyline because of their own perceived status in society. They don't watch the previous seasons, so they come in with this idea that Dean is a stereotype they've grown up hating when in fact he's very layered and an overall fantastic character, something they would know if they took the time to get to know him, but they don't, which is a shame, because Jensen can create gold out of very little, so it seems like they've decided to take it a step further and give him nothing . . . that's when they aren't writing Dean as OOC. Like Dean would drive around for days in blood and guts, or throw said blood and guts on the floor of his house. He doesn't like gross things, and if a gum wrapper on the floor annoys him, I'm sure monster tissue being on the floor would annoy him more. He certainly wouldn't be the one to put it there.
Do you really think somebody's agent is calling the storyline shots? I think it seems like the writers don't know how to write an alpha male, like Dean.
Yeah, Claire definitely suffers from 'I have no idea how to write a teenager, so let's make her snarky and rude and whiney and have her roll her eyes all the time. Oh yeah, and we'll have her cry about something sometimes too, because we need to soften her image.' There are a lot of problems with that all on it's own, but when you take into account that Claire isn't a young teenager and is actually of an age where she should be in college, then it becomes worse, because she's actually a woman the writers don't know how to write, so they revert back to writing her as a younger teenager.
Going forward is difficult from where it is now. Ideally, they should've had a better plan going into this season. I don't think Mary is going anywhere. I think if she did, it'd be a waste of a character and a season. If they want her to be a good guy, a Winchester, then they need to have her learn some kind of a harsh lesson with the BMoL. I don't know what.
Maybe have Dean and Sam vs. the BMoL, Mary sticks with the BMoL, and either the BMoL get destroyed with her being the sole survivor or she stops the BMoL from killing the nephilim, because I don't think it's going to be evil. When she shows up on the bunker's doorstep looking for help, she needs to be contrite, and then they can start building her relationship with her sons next season the way they should've done at the start of this season.
I'd love some dialogue on what happened in those 10 years between when she made her deal and when it came due. I'd love for her to take an active interest in finding out about her sons lives. We've heard the tail end of a couple of discussions they've had with her, but I'm thinking those conversations didn't even scratch the surface of what their lives have been like. I don't mean entire episodes, just little bits of dialogue here and there. I'd also like for them to acknowledge that she's younger than her sons, which means they have experience in hunting and life she doesn't. Basically, I'd like for there be something of a reversal of the parent/child dynamics.
If we're going to keep introducing more hunters, I'd like more like the ones we've seen this season, like the hunter/witch twins and Wally or Eileen from last season. I'd much rather see more of those kinds of characters than the BMoL, and I'd like for at least one hunter to fanboy or girl over Dean.
I'm sick of Lucifer and don't see the point of him being on here again, so I obviously want them to wrap up his storyline. Lucifer or Crowley. I don't think they should have both, and I like Crowley.
What else? Uh, Cas . . . I don't really know what they're going to do with him. If I suspect that Lucifer's kid isn't going to be evil, then I guess Cas will find himself on the side of the angels and by extension the BMoL, so he'll be in direct conflict with the brothers and have to make a choice. I'm thinking the baby won't be born until the season finale, and this will be the set up for next season.
For MotW episodes, I would like new monsters. Last year they at least tried to do some new monsters. The same goes for the 'Big bad' next season. Try something new. It doesn't have to be something bigger than Amara to be interesting, just something that's cunning, maybe something that's found a way to bind Chuck and Amara and the ramifications from that.
Above all else, I want horror back on this show, no corporate angels and demons, and I want them to stop taking rules that were established in previous seasons and tweaking them or changing them entirely.