MovieChat Forums > 12 Years a Slave (2013) Discussion > so... basically the US were worse than t...

so... basically the US were worse than the Third Reich?


Considering how slavery was a rather casual matter in the US, with everybody knowing about and most people positively advocating/endorsing it, while Nazis did their best to keep their crimes hidden, it seems to be a valid thesis after all.

Like even today, modern "Nazis" are denying the Holocaust, even though one might assume that it's something they should supposedly be proud of...

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The blacks were valuable, the Jews were expendable. Therefore, most Southern slave-owners had to make concessions to a degree, the Nazis, on the other hand, just worked people to death.

However, slavery was worse in Haiti, and some other places, than was in the US.

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I think people think that the Holcaust was worse because in general they don't consider blacks having the same value as Jews.


Maybe for some people, tragically. But I would guess a bigger reason is that Holocaust is way more recent. There are still people alive who survived it. There is no one alive from (Western) slavery era.

Not saying which is worse, both slavery and Holocaust were horrible.

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Considering how slavery was a rather casual matter in the US, with everybody knowing about and most people positively advocating/endorsing it, while Nazis did their best to keep their crimes hidden, it seems to be a valid thesis after all.


The grandparents of the Third Reich owned slaves themselves. Everyone who was not African pretty much participated in slavery.

Nazis certainly did not keep what they were doing hidden. They were very open and challenged the world to stop them which really is what lead to that war.


Like even today, modern "Nazis" are denying the Holocaust, even though one might assume that it's something they should supposedly be proud of...


Germany, US, whites everywhere are trying to deny everything from slavery, to the Holocaust.

Cults like the National Socialist Movement certainly aren't helping this denial.

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Nazis certainly did not keep what they were doing hidden. They were very open and challenged the world to stop them which really is what lead to that war.


World War II certainly wasn't about the Holocaust, it was about wars of aggression waged by Hitler. The Nazis would've never even gained power without the bitterness over the lost war a few decades before. The Nazi regime didn't even have the so-called Final Solution, the extermination of the "Jewish race" before the Wannsee Conference in 1942 January, and the last major Allied nation had already declared war to Germany in December.


Germany, US, whites everywhere are trying to deny everything from slavery, to the Holocaust.


My impression is that you have to be pretty fringe element to actually deny slavery or the holocaust. I think the modern Germans are very conscious about the dark shadow of the Holocaust, and you can't really say that there is much support to the crackpot theories that there was no genocide. In case of USA, I'd be more worried about notions that "slavery wasn't so bad", but I suppose 12 years as a slave is an example to the contrary, considering how much applauded it was.

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And let's not forget. The Holocaust wasn't the only genocidal sh!t going on in that period. Everyone just likes to use Nazi Germany is the ultimate example of evil. Do these people have any idea what Stalin was doing in Russia around this period? OMG.

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Most people in the US don't deny the fact that slavery existed here (and existed, and continues to exist in various parts of the world today.) We fought a war in which 2% of our population died in order to end it..

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Maybe not worse, but equivalent, with the systematic and relentless slaughter of the entire civilization of the Native Americans and the enslavement - for centuries - of millions of Africans.

This is how the US built its nation.

Yes, the US is an empire built on blood and the backs of slaves. You know, like most empires throughout the millennia. The amazing thing is all those references to being "special" (City on a Hill) and somehow favored by God that persist to this day - and actually seem amplified in the last thirty years.

Invoking God's name makes for anything goes. As it always has. The US is probably not worse than other empires, but it sure as heck isn't any better.

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Yes, the US is an empire built on blood and the backs of slaves. You know, like most empires throughout the millennia. The amazing thing is all those references to being "special" (City on a Hill) and somehow favored by God that persist to this day - and actually seem amplified in the last thirty years.



You know why that is? Because we can't achieve anything if we're constantly trying to fight nature. You can't become the leader of any civilization if you spend whole days trying to make, and scrub your own clothes clean.

You're coming from a very spoiled and ignorant perspective on every day life.

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The OP is very confused about a great many things.

"Don't drink that @$$hole, you'll get malaria!..."

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In the course of history there have been many different horror nations and periods.
The important thing about Nazis is that happened recently, many survivors are still alive, and happened amidst a continent and a civilization that condemn these atrocities.

Other civilizations don't care about genocides and atrocities, such as the Islamists.

Anyway the bigger genocides in recent history were Stalin and Mao Zedong, who killed 25 and 70 million people respectively. (vs 12 million Hitler).
A little bit earlier, the Mongol empire killed 60 million people.

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You are either incredibly naive or didn't pay attention in history class or to the news. It was not just the US. When Europeans went to Africa, they did truly horrible things. I read accounts from primary sources at the time... 7 years ago and still remember almost all of them.

Japan also did horrible things during war including genoide and human experimentations. Rape of Nanking is the most well known although not enough well know. Some of cruel games Japanese soldiers made Chineses play during it... shudder. AND they committed unspeakable war crimes in other numerous Asian countries.

Also, have you watched Hotel Rwanda, a movie based on genocide that happened in Africa.

Lastly, you do know Columbus, right? The guy who "found" Americas? Personally, I was really shocked when I read what he did to the island he first landed and its people in my history class.

Even now, there are crime organizations in Southeast Asia and China that I don't know what to call, cartels in South America, gangs in the US and Europe.

Not all of them are made into movie, but they happened and are still happening all around the world not just the US.

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