The Vanquishers


Enjoyed having the doctor split up in different locations but too many things left unanswered.

Yes the flux might have been stopped but most of the universe seems to have been destroyed. I'm glad they didn't just reverse everything but will this be addressed or ignored?

I was never a fan of the timeless child stuff, and this is part of the issue. Why bother to even do it if you'll never explore it. I mean it would ruin the mystery but in general it feels like we don't know anything more than we did at the end of series 12.

I also think the ravengers where never fully fleshed out. I don't really understand them fully. Is time now also sentient?

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It was a real slog to get through. Boring. and didnt deliver on the Doctors origins at all (figured all the multiverse talk last time would lead to a cgi Cushing cameo)

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I kind of seen something like this happening, as if the doctor remembered too much it would ruin the mystery, but then if this was the plan, why bother?

I don't know if we will get more. A lot of people think Ruth will still be between 2 and 3 as it would probably be easier to explain why she called herself the doctor and had a police box design for the Tardis. Surprised she didn't appear in the final, as it was hinted she wasn't done, making me wonder if this has been saved for the specials. The big hint of the master returning was a bit in your face to.

I forgot to mention how in the sontaran episode the doctor was mad at the general guy (can't remember his actual rank), for basically blowing them all up. Yet here she allows the sontarans to trap the daleks and cybermen without any issue but also traps them to.

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It seems that Chibbers has painted himself into a corner with this. If we're getting Daleks in the New Year episode where are they going to come from? We've just seen them all destroyed.

As you say most of the universe has been destroyed, so where (literally) can anyone go now? Where are the enemies going to come from? Where are Vinder, Bel and Karvanista going to explore?

The alternatives are some kind of reversal, timey wimey Bobby Ewing in the shower style, or going on with a very limited box of toys to play with.

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This is the issue with this type of episode - Take series 3's finale with the master - Earth was close to being destroyed, and in the end the whole thing was reversed and only those on the ship thing remembered the year that never was. Felt like ending with, and they woke and it was just a dream.

The problem with doing something big like this is the consequences - Doctor who often lacks consequences. I don't hate The Rings of Akhaten as much as some, but the doctor basically destroys the peoples religion and then leaves. The Monk trilogy thing ends with Lie of the Land, with everything basically sorted and everyone forgetting, which kind of makes it feel pointless. I get that you can't destroy something like the Earth, Universe or so on properly. Earth being properly destroyed doesn't work as it's what keeps the show grounded - but I don't think the show should attempt it then - why destroy something if it is only going to be fixed later, as it then has no real impact.

While it wasn't explored as much as it should, in the 4th doctors last serial Logopolis, the master actually destroys a galaxy, and one of the people from that galaxy managed to escape and becomes one of the 5th doctors companion, Nyssa. It is explored a bit more in the Big Finish audio ranges - this actually works well because we see their are consequences. While Nyssa does end up visiting her planets past in one audio, she knows she can never really go home, but it makes her who she is.

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I can't believe you and the others replying to you are even hinting at considering taking this complete BULLCRAP seriously whatsoever!

Doctor Who is complete CRAP now, has been for several years, and people still watch this rubbish?

I only watch it now to see how much further this car crash of a show will go on (TV rubbernecking) and when will it end for good??

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I do kind of agree with you AMJF, I want to see how Chibbers gets out of the mess he's got into; and if RTD can rescue anything afterwards.

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I don't think it is always as bad as some claim - The flux was a mess, but there where interesting ideas. I enjoyed series 12 overall, but there where some too on the nose political episodes and I didn't like what they did with the reveal about who the timeless child was.

It's a show that I have loved for years and will always watch - But I will be glad when Chibnall leaves.

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The middle episodes of Flux were pretty good. But the finale felt rushed and seemed to promise a lot and delivered nothing. If Chibnall had used the 3 episodes he used for the new years and spring specials for Flux instead maybe the storyline would have been better. Oh what am I saying Chibnall would have still found a way to screw it up. I actually wanted Chibnall to leave and Whitaker to stay, so that maybe we could get a good full series for her. But she is sticking by her friend and ruining what chance she had at having a good story arc.

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Yeah, I'm not the biggest 13 fan but I feel it's often the writing that really lets her down.

The middle of flux was okay. I did like the Village of the Angels, but on reflection I found it also problematic - The Weeping Angels, certainly in Blink, seemed very mysterious. I suppose because they didn't communicate, they seemed so different, no real motives etc. Seeing them communicate but also finding out the Division used them, just kind of ruined that - They just seemed like yet another monster, one that you can hire and use rather than something unexplainable.

I did enjoy the mystery part of once upon time, but would have loved to see more of the Ruth doctor. I wouldn't be surprised if we saw her in one of the upcoming specials, but it's a shame that we may never see her again, as she is probably the best thing for me in Chibnall's era - and that's coming from someone who hates the Timeless Child arc.

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