MovieChat Forums > Raiders of the Lost Ark (1981) Discussion > Why nuking the fridge and not riding the...

Why nuking the fridge and not riding the sub?


Just to be clear: this is the greatest action movie ever, and one of the best film in history.
Crystall Skull is a giant turd not worth even mentioning in the same post.

But I wanna play the turd's advocate and ask you: why is nuking the fridge jumping the shark, while riding the sub is, instead, almost cool?

I admit, the fact that he holds onto a submarine never bothered me that much, I thought when I saw it when I was 8 "that doesn't make sense, did he go inside? What happened there". But then he's in the sub base and I was already thinking "how's he gonna get the ark from there?". I kinda brushed it off as an awesome stunt that he pulled off somehow.

But to be frank, it's as much BS as nuking the fridge, it's not realistic inside its movie world. So why do you think one is internationally ridiculed as an epic fail and the other is barely mentioned?

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Short answer...different time.

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Another short answer. The rest of the movie around the scene is better.

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EXACTLY. It's also way deeper into the movie where you're caught up in the story and action.

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OK but most people barely even notice it, while the fridge almost everybody thinks it's idiotic.
I doubt it would look better if it happened after 90 minutes.

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Because the movie around it is not within the realm of good.

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Nope. Because it's cartoonish, put that fridge scene in Raiders instead of the sub, and people will boo it anyway. But you are making me argue against my OP.

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There's nothing like a stranger telling me I'm wrong about my opinion.

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Ahahah.That feels awesome, doesn't it?
But let me introduce myself, so we're not strangers any longer and I can tell you how wrong you are about your opinion.
Hi jekporkins, my name is Heisenberg. Pleased to meet you.

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Howdy partner. :)

Glad to know you can make up my mind on such heavy burden matters as nuking the fridge. Maybe we can discuss my haircut at some point. I think it looks great but I obviously can't be sure anymore.

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I think your haircut could be a bit more porkin.

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I barely remember the nuked fridge scene.

I don't have an answer for you, but on a related note, it bothered me he rode on top of the sub. How did he know it wasn't going to submerge, and then what would he have done?

Also it never showed how he managed to get off the sub without being seen. That sub base was swarming with Nazis.

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Frankly I agree with Nostalgia Critic that the scene in Temple of Doom of them jumping out of an airplane on a raft and falling thousands of feet and surviving is just as unbelievable as the nuke fridge scene.

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Yes, that scene with the raft is also over the top.
But now that you point this one out too, I think I have an answer to my original question:
the real difference that every Indy fan sees, between nuking the fridge and every other Indy over the top stunt, is this: nuking a fridge is NOT a stunt.

All the other moments are stunts. Which beautifully fits with the core element of the series: awesome stunts and action sequences. Jumping off a plane and landing a raft with the right angle and speed to bounce off the snow, is a stunt; so is riding a sub (assuming that sub never went underwater, of course), etc, they all reaquire phisical skills and timing to be pulled off.

Surviving a nuclear explosion inside a fridge is not a stunt, it's magic.
And Indy is not a magician.

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Riding a submarine is not a stunt either, and its completely cut out from beign shown. They just assume he did it and hope the audience gets it.

Actually you would have more chances to survive in that fridge than from that fall according to mythbusters.

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Nostalgia Critic is a complete and utter joke, he actually put Last Crusade on the same level as Raiders and Temple on the same level as Crystal Skulls. He doesn't know what he's talking about. Not to mention he criticized Interstellar when he then 2 seconds later demonstrated he didn't even understand it.

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I don't agree with him on everything. I like Last Action Hero and the Pagemaster. But frankly I do not like Temple of Doom and think Raiders and Last Crudade are vastly superior.

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Last crusade is a complete mess of a film. Raiders and temple are quite good. He also asserted that Interstellar asserts that we didn’t land on the moon and Interstellar says no such thing (we the audience are not supposed to agree with the characters who say that). He reviews movies and trashed them when he doesn’t even get them, he’s great when he’s reviewing garbage like 3 ninjas or Patch Adams but when he’s trying to review things that actually have depth to them he fails completely

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You just didn't "get" what nostalgic critic was saying, kid. last Crusade wasn't a mess you just didn't understand it. Stick to The Young Indiana Jones Chronicles; that seems more in line with your level of understanding.

See what I am doing here?

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LOL nice try except I have demonstrated that I understand everything about Last Crusade, I can point to many instances where you don't get TDKR, not a legit comparison. There's nothing to get about Last Crusade, it's a kiddie film for 4 year olds.

Epic fail kid.

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Last Crusade is a masterpiece and just don't get it I proved time and time again how perfect the film is and pointed to specific examples and you just ignore them and double down on your ignorance and low intellect. What is your home address; I'll send you my VHS copies of Young Indy? That is more on your level of understanding.

See I can be a complete and utter lower asshole that relies on nothing but utter bullshit too. Your life is an epic fail.

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Oh I get it completely, there's nothing to get and Raiders is a vastly superior film. You think you're giving me a taste of my own medicine but you're plan is just falling flat on it's stupid face.

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There is nothing to get about Rises either. Last Crusade is a perfect masterpiece and literally everything you say about is wrong and a sign you just don't get it. Stick with Young Indy; it suites you better.

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Apparently there is because I had to explain the entire point of the film to you.

Last Crusade is a pile of garbage, it's not emotionally deep, it's a kiddie film.

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There is nothing deep or in need of explaining from Rises; and you didn't explain anything. You just tried saying exactly what happened on screen and then say that was deep; that is like the exact opposite definition of deep; it was shallow and spoonfed. It was garbage.

You still not getting it. YOu B.S. non-argument can be easily applied to literally any film. The Room is a deep and brilliant movie and you just didn't. Kindom of the Crystal skull was perfect and the themes were deep but you were just to simple to understand them, kid. See my point.

Maybe if you weren't a condescening pathetic little twerp and actually could formulate a coherent argument without trying to belittle or intimadate others; we could have had a conversation. but instead you descided to be a loser demented incel and offer nothing but attacks and B.S. condescending "you didn't get it" "stick with x,y,z movie, kid". Such a B.S. way to try to make any kind of point.

Rises is a pile of garbage; Last Crusade was the weakest until the 4th came out but it is lightyears better than the lazy ass film you call "perfect'.

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There is considering you didn't even understand the main theme of the film, I had to explain it to you repeatedly. Last Crusade however is not deep, is not thought provoking and it has so many problems the first two didn't. No one is belittling you, I'm trying to help you, I'm trying to educate you but you just can't stand the fact that you're wrong, it's very pathetic.

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As I said in the other post; the more you try to explain the more it sound like YOU didn't understand the themes; embracing fear is not the same as using fear as motivator. Clearly this was way beyond your understanding.

I agree LAst Crusade is NOT deep; clearly my mocking of your condescending attitude went literally right over your head (or maybe through it because you have no brains). Your B.S. non argument "you just didn't get it" can literally be said about any film.

You are not trying to help anyone you lying piece of crap; this stuff about 'kid' and 'you didn't get it' condescending ad hominems. You are trying to call people dumb without actually saying the word 'dumb' You concession is noted.

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Kid they spoon fed this information to you, Bruce lost his fear of death and that didn't make him strong, it made him weak because you aren't going to fight as hard when you don't care if you live or die. When he took the rope off he regained his fear of death, that's how he made it across the jump, that is how he was able to rise from the pit and that was his character arc. I seriously don't know how to make this any easier for you.

Thank you, I'm glad you concede, I accept your concession.

I am trying to help you, clearly you aren't smart enough to appreciate this great film and I'm merely trying to educate you and help you appreciate what Nolan did for you. I never once called you dumb, that was all you, you've said far worse things and I'll remind you flaming the board is against the rules.

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I didn't concede you freaking moron I was sarcastically making fun of your crap B.S. non argument and trying to show you how you can say it about any film. Clearly it went right over your head just like you can't tell the difference between embracing fear (which paralyzes action) or using fear as a motivator (which can inspire drive). You didn't get the theme of Dark Knight Rises at all, no wonder you liked it.

You are helping me you demented liar; you are being a condescending prick and have no argument to back any of your points and want to continually harass me because I called you out for the dumb, pathetic, demented incel loser you are. Life must be hard; got covid-19 and no one in your life even cares. I would pity you if you were such an ass; now I am pleased your life is worthless.

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LOL nice try I'm the one who had to explain it to you, he had to regain his fear of death in order to make it out, that's why he didn't use the rope, that's why when he comes out of the pit he is rejuvenated and is now the Batman that we are all familiar with, he was reborn, he rose out of the pit.

You are a complete disgrace, even though I disagree with you I would never wish Covid on you, but instead you seem to be happy that I have a life threatening condition. Your family must be very proud of you.

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the rope represented the fear of death; letting go of the rope is him using the fear of death to push his limits. this went right over your head apparently. I didn't realize I needed to explain the film to YOU, since you are the one that had enough superman intelligence to get the 'deep' themes. Man, give me a break. You are not special and you do not have special in site in this film. In fact you appear to be quite dumb and you totally misconstrued the themes.

I wouldn't have been; but because are such a ridiculously pathetic and harassing jackass; I don't feel bad for you one bit. It actually seems like some kind of cosmic justice being applied for the way you treat people.

My family is great with me; lots of love and devotion; except my wife gets pissed at me when I do moviechat too much; so gotta go for now. I would say get well soon, but I actually don't care if you do.

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LOL I understood this completely, I even had to explain it to you and you didn't know anything you just typed until I educated you. You know you could just say thank you.

Wow so do I have this right: Because I disagree with you on a movie I deserve a life threatening condition? That's pretty messed up kid.

I doubt your family even exists.

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" Because I disagree with you on a movie I deserve a life threatening condition?"

Deserve has got nothing to do with it. And it has nothing to do with disagreeing with people; it is because you harass, attempt to intimidate, name call, belittle, condescend, mock and obsessively go after anyone that disagrees with your view of it being a perfect film. This is the result of your behavior not mine. But you are too demented and deluded to ever do even the slightest bit of self reflection; and because of that having a terrible virus seems to be a sort of poetic justice. If it is really life threatening maybe take some stock and look at yourself and make a change for the better; but as I said; I don't believe you have it; I think you are demented about getting attention.

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No one harassed you, all you had to do was not respond

No one intimidated you, all I did was discuss the film with you, you are the one who hurled insults at me (but I don't care because I'm far more mature than you are)

I didn't call you any names, that was all you kid

I didn't belittle you, I just tried to educate you.

HAHAHAHA you act like I'm the one bullying you then you turn around and call me "demented" and "deluded", again I don't care but if you're going to do that don't play the victim because you're the one dishing this out son. Not only that but you seem to be taking joy in the fact that I have a life threatening virus which is a really horrible thing to say and shows how little integrity or class you have, I really think you need to take a break from this website, it's getting you all riled up and stressed out, it's not healthy.

FYI: You are the one who keeps bringing up the virus, I mentioned it once, ever since then every time I mentioned it was in response to someone else, you aren't too bright are you?

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You concession is noted, request is denied. :)

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I didn't request anything nor did I concede anything genius.

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" really think you need to take a break from this website, it's getting you all riled up and stressed out, it's not healthy."

Concession noted; request denied.

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That was a suggestion, I was merely looking out for you. I don't care if you take a break or not it was just some helpful advice kid.

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Your concession is noted. Your lie is official called out. Your goal is not to 'look out for me' your goal is to 'defeat' me and push me off this site so you can have free ran to insult and harass others. therefor your request (suggestion) is denied.

My goal is to get you to never contact me, ever. if something outside this website enables that to happen; I really don't care so long as I don't see you damn name in my notifications ever, for any discussion at any time in the future.

I am perfectly fine with almost everyone on this board. You are an immature, condescending jerk that is trying to bully people. I hate bullies.

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Naw I'm just trying to help you. I have tried to educate you on TDKR since it was abundantly clear you didn't get it, then you seemed to be getting all bent out of shape so I suggested you take a break, if you don't want to then that's your decision but I'm giving you good advice. No one is bullying you, I have been very polite to you and in exchange you have hurled profanity at me and pretty much wished death upon me. You easily could have just ignored me but you didn't because you like the attention. If you aren't going to take my advice then don't but don't complain to me later that you're being harassed because you'll have no one to blame but yourself.

Also watch what you say, flaming the board is against the rules.

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Are you really so delusional you actually believe this or you just trolling to continue to try to get a rise out of me?

BTW I had 3 different users send me private messages specifically about your bullying tactics. you are a bully; you harass and belittle (claiming someone "just doesn't get it" IS equivalent calling them stupid, repetitively calling them "kid" IS a pathetic attempt at you feigning superiority, constantly replying to literally every single comment and then going out of your way to follow and inject yourself into other conversations not involving you IS harassment) because you can't win an argument through merit. I like to pick on bullies and put them in their place. You pathetically trying to 'inflate' your own internet ego is just so telling of the loser you actually are in real life.

I didn't wish death on you; I just want you to never reply to me and I don't really care how that happens, so long as I don't see your name in my notifications ever again. At least I have enough integrity to be honest; unlike you. You don't like me, you say I am flaming? Guess what You are 100% equally able to not reply to me. Difference is I won't reply to your other discussions you are having with others; which is what you have done to me when I try to ignore you.

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Son I'm trying to help you, if you don't want my friendly advice then just stop replying it's that simple, but the truth is you enjoy this which is why you reply, you have some weird craving for attention and it's kind of disturbing.

I don't believe anyone has PMed you, they would have said something to me. This is an open forum, I can reply to whoever I want to, I never once bullied you, simply replying to you in an on topic post is well within the rules of the board. You just don't like it that someone has a different opinion than you because you're a fragile little snowflake, hate it break it to you kid but you're not that special.

You wished Covid on me, you said it was poetic justice, that's pretty much in the same ballpark as wishing death on me which is a pretty sadistic thing to say but don't worry you didn't hurt my self esteem, my feelings aren't as fragile as yours are.

I'm not the one playing the victim, I'm not the one complaining, you are. Since you say you're being harassed you could choose to just ignore it yet you don't. Again you get off on the attention.

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"Son"

This is belittling. I am not your freaking son.

"I'm trying to help you"

Bull, you are trying to bully me off the site.

" the truth is you enjoy this which is why you reply"

I reply because I want your damn name to never appear in my inbox; but you enjoy bulling and harassing so you will not stop; probably because online is the only place were you can bully; every where else you're a push over.

"You just don't like it that someone has a different opinion"

I don't care if you like a stupid movie and ignore the flaws and pretend is perfect; what I care about is you being condescending and belittling people that disagree with you.

"you're a fragile little snowflake"

careful, flaming and name calling is against site rules.

"You wished Covid on me, you said it was poetic justice, that's pretty much in the same ballpark as wishing death on me which is a pretty sadisti"

Dude, covid has a death rate of like .0003%; you will be fine (unfortunately) Jesus get over yourself.

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I didn't mean you were literally my son, I'm just talking to you the way you deserve to be talked to.

Nope I'm trying to help you, I tried to help you with your anxiety and to help you understand TDKR and you rejected my help both times.

Get over it, if you just ignored it then it wouldn't be an issue and I can reply to whoever I want to, no one is bullying you you just have a persecution complex.

I'm not being condescending, I'm speaking to you the way you deserve to be spoken to. It's like talking to a 5 year old, you aren't going to use big words or talk to them as if they are on the same level as you.

That's not flaming, you are a snowflake and you constantly playing the victim is evidence.

Covid has killed people and you said you were glad I had it, that's far worse than anything I said to you, also your reaction is very unbalanced, you claim I condescend to you so you wish life threatening illnesses on me, what's the matter with you?

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"I'm just talking to you the way you deserve to be talked to."

Belittling is a bullying tactic. You are a bully; and a pathetic one too.

" to help you understand TDKR and you rejected my help both times."

Maybe if you didn't start with "you just didn't understand it" which is condescending as hell, I might have respected your view on the film; but since you started with being a jerk and tried belittling me and others; you point went unheard and we just assume you are a demented fanatic, which you have only proved to be true more and more.

"if you just ignored it then it wouldn't be an issue"

You keep replying to me on other discussion. I can't use the ignore feature because you still reply to me and it hides my discussions with other users. I can't ignore your replies because you follow me and reply on other discussion. You are harassing me and trying to push me off this site. It's not going to work.

"That's not flaming"

Yes it is; or is it only flaming if people do it to you; you are too superior so you are exempted? I am sure you think that is the case with how delusional you are.

" that's far worse than anything I said to you"

Escalation of force bro; you won't leave me alone so I am not exactly upset by the idea that you vanish from the internet. .0003% and if you don't count the nursing home numbers it is like .00017%. You are going to be fine; get over yourself.

"what's the matter with you?"

Nothing is the matter with me, I just want you to go away and never talk to me. I just honestly don't care how that happens. If it is of your own will or something outside your control stops you.

Just leave me the freak alone, don't reply to me here or in any other discussion; and we won't have a problem. If you do keep replying to me here or any other board; I will continue to be as nasty as I can possibly get away with until you do stop.

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It's not belittling, it's just meeting you at your level.

That's because you don't understand it, again I had to explain to you the significance of the rope which in essence was the whole point of the film. Who are you to say the movie is bad when you don't even understand the underlying message?

You also could have just ignored it without using the ignore feature if that upsets you so much. Again no one twisted your arm to get you to reply, that was all you kid.

I called you a "snowflake" you are a snowflake, you on the other hand called me "asshole", "demented", and you wished death upon me, you're the only one flaming here.

First of all you are the one who brought up Covid in this discussion that was all you, secondly tell that to the families of the people who died, I bet you won't though because you're gutless and you only act tough when you have the luxury of hiding behind an anonymous username and behind a computer screen.

There is a lot wrong with you, you seem to have a sense of entitlement and you love playing the victim, you need to get over yourself. I can reply to whoever I want to, this is an open forum and I don't have to do what you say, again you aren't that special or significant. Either ignore or leave the internet but don't reply and then call harassment when you get the short end of the stick, that's what cowards do.

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"It's not belittling, it's just meeting you at your level."

deluded idiot; you didn't (and don't) know my 'level' on your very first comment. Your very first post on this discussion was belittling and condescending.

"you don't understand it,"

You are the one that doesn't understand it. You think it is about embracing fear; that is incorrect; it is about using the fear to push yourself. So YOU DIDN'T UNDERSTAND IT but you feign superiority.

"You also could have just ignored "

Tried that but you kept messaging me anyway.

"I called you a "snowflake" you are a snowflake"

this coming from the guy that gets all upset about someone online not caring about their lives. Accuse them that which you are guilyt of i guess right.

"of hiding behind an anonymous username and behind a computer screen."

says the guy that is an online bully. I would love to see what you were like in real life; cowardly most likely.

"There is a lot wrong with you"

I have me issues like anyone else, but compared to you I am damn near perfect.

"you need to get over yourself."

stealing my condescention now? running out of your own?

"Either ignore or leave the internet"

Your concession is noted; your request is denied. Until you leave me alone I will not ignore you or let you bully me off the website. You don't like what I have to say? Good, then YOU DON'T REPLY TO ME.

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No I am meeting you at your level and I am speaking to you at your level. It's just like how you wouldn't speak to a 5 year old the same way you'd speak to a 34 year old, it's common sense. Also calling me a "deluded idiot" is flaming and against the rules. (I personally don't care if you call me that, you aren't hurting my feelings but you're the one who wants to get on his high horse about harassment).

I clearly explained to you the meaning of the pit and yes he embraced his fear, before he was rejecting the fear and didn't care that he might die. When I say embrace the fear it means he now values his life and that gives him the adrenaline to make it across the pit. You are attempting very pathetically to turn the tables on me and it's blowing up in your face. You can choose whatever verb you want to, it doesn't really matter, he made it across the pit because of his fear of death and because he valued his life. This went right over your head and you didn't even get it until I explained it to you. Don't worry no charge for your education.

Then just don't reply genius, no one twisted your arm to get you to talk to me, you did that on your own.

First of all I quite clearly said I don't give a good crap what you think of me or if you want me to die, if you are going to be vile I understand that's the kind of person you are, but what I don't accept is your hypocrisy as in you wishing death upon me then getting all pissy pants when I call you a snowflake. You can't have it both ways son.

Not a bully at all, I tried to help you and if I upset you so much either A) don't respond to me or B) take a break from the internet. I'm just trying to look out for your mental health.

You are nowhere near perfect, you are an entitled snowflake who gets all bent out of shape whenever someone dares to have a different opinion, you have a persecution complex and a sense of entitlement. You need to grow up because the world is not going to conform to the way you want it to.

I don't need to "steal" anything, you didn't invent that phrase. Also I didn't concede to anything nor did I request anything. You feel free to reply to me all you want but don't play the victim when you get the short end of the stick, you'll have no one to blame but yourself.

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"No I am meeting you at your level "

That is condescending and insulting, you worthless low life. How about not be a pathetic weasel and call it like you see it. You are playing the 'rules' of the board to insult people and harass them and get away with it. YOU ARE PATHETIC.

"Also calling me a "deluded idiot" is flaming and against the rules. "

Suggesting I am a 5 year old intelligence is also flaming; and against the rules.

"I clearly explained"

your explanation is incorrect, you moron.

"Then just don't reply genius,"

I tried that and you keep talking to me on other boards. That is harassment. Leave me alone of pathetic weasel loser low life.

" You can't have it both ways son.

Neither can you, and don't calll me son; "I'm not your fucking Son" - Bruce Willis Last Boy scout.

"A) don't respond to me or B) take a break from the internet."

Your concession is again noted; your request is denied. You should take a break from life for a while; that Covid must be taking its toll on your brain.

" You need to grow up because the world is not going to conform to the way you want it to."

But most of the time people have the common courteous to leave someone alone when asked. Only a truly demented loser would keep bothering them like you do.

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Dude you need to chill out, it's common sense, you don't talk to a 5 year old the same way you'd talk to a 34 year old, two different intelligence levels. I didn't insult you I just explained why I talked to you the way I did.

I didn't call you a 5 year old I just explained why I talked to you the way I did, maybe your intelligence level is higher than that of a 5 year old I don't know I'm just explaining my reasoning because you asked, if you don't like the answers then stop asking questions, again you have no one to blame but yourself here.

Nope my explanation is correct, you just don't get it which is why I speak to you the way I do kiddo.

Then ignore those messages if they bother you so much. I know you won't though because you love the attention I give you, again no one is putting a gun to your head and making you reply, that's all you kiddo.

You're trying to have it both ways son, life doesn't work that way, you are going to get a huge wake up call to reality one day and it's not going to be fun for you.

I'm not requesting anything, nor am I conceding anything, I'm just trying to help you and give you some helpful advice, you won't take it so don't play the victim.

I don't have to respond only to who you want me to, you're not running the show here nor is anyone required to walk on egg shells to make sure we don't hurt your fragile little feelings, again you're not that special.

Also you are flaming the boards which is against group rules.

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Let me try this again; I will ignore your replies after the time of this post but if you start any new conversations with me you are admitting you are loser lowlife scumbag, moron that has absolutely no intention of discussing any topic in good faith.

So go ahead an reply to my post here, I won't count that. I will attempt to ignore you again but if you seek me out and enter into discussions I am having on other boards, you are officially admitting all the above descriptor do indeed apply to you.

I will also take it as consent that you are fully open to being insulted and name called and that nothing I say is off limits; You consent to me private messaging you the most depraved and threatening things you can imagine. If you start any new conversations with me on any discussion board or any other posts besides this one I am considering it consent that I can say whatever I want to you. Moderators will be informed that you are consenting, so they can't apply the rules anymore. Be prepared: "it's gonna get fucking ugly" Clint Eastwood

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You do whatever you want kid but I don't have to abide by what you want. I can reply to whoever I want to and you can either ignore it or respond, but you don't get to play the victim and act like you're being persecuted because you aren't.

Naw I'm not admitting anything, I came to this forum to discuss movies (hence the name moviechat) and I can reply to whoever I want to, you however are admitting that you love the attention I give you because obviously you aren't getting it elsewhere kiddo. You're just making up whatever rules you want and from where I stand you're just pulling nonsense out of your anus.

And LOL that's so cute that you think that not only you get to set the rules but that the moderators will give a good crap what you think, sorry kiddo once again the world doesn't revolve around you, all of us on moviechat operate under the same rules and we don't just make special exceptions for you.

From here on out though every time you reply to me you are admitting that you are a pathetic, lonely lowlife who craves attention so bad that he actively seeks others to put him in his place and make a fool out of him, see how easy that was?

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You have officially consented to me private messaging you. Moderators take not. He was warned.

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I'm not scared.

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[deleted]

How narrow will these comments get?

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Nostalgia Critic is a complete and utter joke, he actually put Last Crusade on the same level as Raiders and Temple on the same level as Crystal Skulls.

And? For most Indy fans, it's a toss-up between Raiders and Crusade for the top position. Temple is generally considered a solid number 3, but there are plenty of fans who think Temple gives Skulls good competition for last place. If you think these are untenable positions, even though they are majority positions, then clearly you are the one who doesn't know what he's talking about. And since you are very much alone in your opinion, UltimateHippo, it means you really don't have much ground to stand on. Especially your fanatic obsession with calling Crusade a "kiddie" film for "four-year olds", that just shows how unbalanced you are. And when you exalt slapstick fest Temple as being aimed at a more mature audience, it really makes you look quite insane.

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Last Crusade is a kiddie film for 4 year olds, it is a bad movie and it's actually below Crystal Skulls, while Raiders is a cinematic classic and Temple is a solid #2. Last Crusade is made for people who don't enjoy thinking and don't mind a film riddled with plot holes, lazy writing, character flaws, bad pacing, etc. Yes Nostalgia Critic very much doesn't know what he's talking about, this is the same guy who said Interstellar asserted that we didn't land on the moon.

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Last Crusade is a kiddie film for 4 year olds

On what grounds? And if your answer includes "Mickey Mouse", you are a moron.

it is a bad movie and it's actually below Crystal Skulls

According to YOU, and ONLY you.

while Raiders is a cinematic classic

So is Crusade. Small wonder, seeing as it follows the same formula.

Last Crusade is made for people who don't enjoy thinking and don't mind a film riddled with plot holes, lazy writing, character flaws, bad pacing, etc.

Again, you are the ONLY person who thinks that way. And the ONLY reason you think so is because one minor character uttered the name "Mickey Mouse". Never mind the fact that loads of R rated movies mention Mickey Mouse as well.

Yes Nostalgia Critic very much doesn't know what he's talking about, this is the same guy who said Interstellar asserted that we didn't land on the moon.

I have no idea what you're talking about. I do know, however, that it has no relevance here. Neither does this discussion, for that matter. It is called poisoning the well, a fallacy which you seem very fond of.

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But I wanna play the turd's advocate and ask you: why is nuking the fridge jumping the shark, while riding the sub is, instead, almost cool?


My mind has been systematically deleting all memory of the unfortunate fourth installment, but I'll comment on the sub issue. Of all the things that border on (or actually are) impossible that happened in the film, the submarine is the issue? If anything, the sub is the least unbelievable of all the unbelievable things that happened in the films.

With no war going on, there would be no reason for an air-breathing diesel sub to submerge. Underwater, it would need to run on batteries with electric motors. It would be far better to make the trip at the surface. All Indy had to do was put out a lawn chair on the deck, crack open a Meister-Brau, and enjoy the ride.


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They were going to a secret base, carrying secret cargo, so submerging to reduce chance of being followed would still be likely.

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Who would follow them and why? It wasn't wartime, there would be no reason for anyone to follow the sub or have any clue what they were carrying.

But still, with other things like the Ark melting Nazi faces and flying spirits, OP is complaining about the submarine not submerging.

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I like your theory about the peace time, it actually makes sense.
But there are two problems with that: the choice made in the first place of using a submarine and how it was handled. I'll elaborate:
1- were it just another nazi ship travelling to the island with the ark, there would be no questions raised. But it would look less "awesome" for an idiot watching the film (I mean, somebody that wants to be amazed rather than convinced). Since that's a big target audience for Spielberg, he deliberatelly opted for the sub, with all the unanswered questions that this choice implied.
2- if that's what actually happened, that the sub just never submerged because it was peace time, then I wish the director handled it differently and made us understand that fact. But again, he was going for "I'll leave them amazed", unfortunatelly.

PS: Strntz don't be uno strunz now...you wrote twice a silly complaint about my op being about this, rather than "all the things that border on (or actually are) impossible" happening in the film: those things, and I'm surprised I have to explain it on a Raiders forum, are part of what we expert connoisseurs of filmmaking secretly call "supsension of disbelief". A regular person surviving underwater, is not.

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Well, they left the ship they took the cargo from who has pressumably already called the americans (before they even got boarded, the movie shows this) so they have significant reason to expect competition.

Furthermore, even if noone was to follow, there would be a chance of accidental meeting not to mention someone finding out where their secret base is. It may not be war (yet) but secret base should remain secret.

Ark melting peoples faces is magic. Its a plot device that the movie unfortunatelly chooses to use as deus-ex-machina. It isnt a logical fallacy because its not supposed to follow logic in the first place (being magic). Sub movement is.

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Sub movement is [logical fallacy].


But it's not really in this case..

Running a WWII diesel sub under water is no small deal. When submerged, the air-breathing diesel engines are shut off and the sub runs on electric motors and batteries. The sub runs at considerably less than half the surface speed while submerged, and can only do so for maybe a hundred miles before the batteries are fully exhausted. The sub must then resurface to start the diesels to run the generators in order to recharge the batteries, which took a long time to charge. Even if they decided to submerge, the fact is that they would have had to surface a considerable amount of time anyway. If you're in a hurry to get somewhere in a VII U-Boat, you don't want to be submerged.

The tramp steamer that Indy and Marion took with the Ark was not a government or corporation vessel; it was a privately owned ship run by a crew that was described in the movie as "pirates". Who would they call, and for what reason? Even if anyone responded, the sub would be long gone. I doubt the arrogant Nazis feared anyone at that point.

The only time they would have been concerned about being spotted on the surface was near the entrance to the sub base. With no aircraft around, they could stay surfaced or, if they were extra careful or paranoid, dive to periscope depth for the last couple of miles. It wouldn't have been fun, but at the slow underwater speed of a VII U-Boat, Indy could survive by holding on to the periscope.

The most likely scenario is that, given the circumstances of the trip, the sub would have stayed on the surface unless attacked or unless it was going to attack another armed vessel.

Now if there was a plot device where the sub was forced to dive below periscope depth and Indy showed up alive later, then we'd have to call Houston.

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Thats fair enough on the U-Boat, which certainly would encourage them to stay above water.

The tramp steamer captain has informed Indy that he has "already contacted the american friends" when they were being boarded. They were clearly guys hired by the american letter agency to help Indy get the cargo out.

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Except that the captain actually gives the order to dive: "Tauchen. Tauchen das Boot." ("Dive. Dive the boat."). The order is repeated by the crew, which shows that they have heard and understood the order.

And in any case, uboats would perform at least one trim dive each day, to make sure the ballast tanks contained water of the same density as the surrounding body of water. And when surfaced, there would be 2-4 crew members as lookouts topside. The only reason why there were exactly zero crew topside when we see Indy on the uboat, is that they were preparing to dive.

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Maybe it cruised at periscope depth with the scope raised and Indy hung on for dear life from the periscope. Perhaps using his whip as an aid.
Far fetched, but that is kinda Indy's schtick.

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That is what Spielberg initially intended, and they even started shooting that scene. I guess he decided to omit it because of how ridiculous it is, and just let it go unexplained instead.

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Yep, that's the backstory.
But even unexplained, it is quite ridicolous.

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It's strange, but despite seeing this movie a thousand times, I always forget the submarine scene is even in it. It surprises me every time. Oh yeah, this happens too. However they made the movie, they managed to handle that scene in a very low key way, where as the Fridge is very much a centerpiece of absurdity.

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Strntz and TandyMan, you both make good points.
I agree that the sub could have been on surface level the whole trip, it makes sense, maybe they could have explained it outloud in the movie. But I guess that would have looked like trying to iron out a plot hole, which brings us to TandyMan's observation: they handled it in a low key way, which was definitely the way to go.
PS:
"The Fridge is very much a centerpiece of absurdity", that's a genius phrase right there, thanks man!

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He and the Nazis knew the sub wouldn’t function on batteries under water while carrying the Arc. 😄

As someone else stated, the raft scene and fridge scene were lame because their movies were super lame.

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Rewatched this tonight and there was a LOT of bullshit ideas in this movie (and generally bad calls like the Marion and corpses scene) in what looked like they were still trying to find the genre they were actually wanting to do (which makes sense for a first movie). I think that suspension of disbelief is needed for both to be passed.

Btw, mythbusters did the nuking the fridge thing. The fridge would survive. But the force of impact would kill anyone inside it.

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The nuke fridge scene doesn't bother me. There is plenty of stuff that happens in other action films that is just as unbeleivable that people don't even mention. Like John and Zeus surviving falling several feet onto a hard surface in Die Hard with a Vengeance. Or in same said movie, them surviving a car flipping upsidedown without wearing seatbelts.

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