MovieChat Forums > For All Mankind (2019) Discussion > It's kind of interesting that they twist...

It's kind of interesting that they twist history as they do.

posted 3 years ago by TrentnQuarantino (9187)
18 replies | jump to latest

One the one hand it is interesting to think about ... for a few seconds,
but all in all it's pretty irritating, and I think some younger people will
not really know or bother to find out what is right and what is wrong.

It was interesting how they had the Soviets landing on the moon first,
and of course they had to show the Russians to be less human than we
are - doing it to advance world socialism or some such, while we in the
real reality did it for all mankind.

Then the attacks on Werner Von Braun with what we know about him
today. What would we or should we have done differently?

I don't know where this is going, but to replay and tweak history to be
full of memes from today is an interesting idea, but not exactly having a
point or making sense.

[–] huwdj (4567) 3 years ago

I like the twists of history but I wouldn't be surprised if some people, not necessarily younger one, thought this is how it was. Apparently many Americans believed Britain broke the sound barrier first because of The Sound Barrier (1952).

[–] TrentnQuarantino (9187) 3 years ago

I think it is interesting, but I don't like it. It's a cheap gimmick that it just wrong.

[–] duckofprey (1557) 3 years ago

I didn’t like some of the twists. Especially knocking off Gene Krantz, who still is walking the Earth IRL. I thought that was unnecessary and bordered on poor taste.

[–] TrentnQuarantino (9187) 3 years ago

I don't see any point that it, and I don't like it, but it did get my attention. It's like today there is a whole culture about scrambling people's understanding of reality ... and this doesn't help anything,

[–] RoloTony (1287) 3 years ago

I liked Season 2 a lot better. I'm surprised this show never really has caught on. Season 1 was a bit of a slog at times.

[–] TrentnQuarantino (9187) 3 years ago

I think I got this confused of conflated with the idiotic Sean Penn series. I didn't even know there was a season 2, and at this rate I am not sure I will want to watch it. This fictionalization of what is one of the only really unconditionally great American historical achievements is just weird.

[–] brux (14724) 3 years ago

Give it a chance, it gets good pretty fast.

[–] TrentnQuarantino (9187) 3 years ago

It actually has indeed.

[–] PrimeMinisterX (8719) 3 years ago

It's a work of "alternative history." In this way, it could be likened to Harry Tutledove's book "The Guns of the South," in which the South during the Civil War got their hands on modern weaponry via time travel. It's a form of fiction that asks "what if?" and is speculative by nature.

Overall I have thought the show is quite good and surprisingly classy. Even though it has some obvious woke vibes, it handles those elements in a more acceptable, less offensive way than a lot of other shit being produced today (mostly because it doesn't constantly disparage the men for being men and the white people for being white).

I have enjoyed the show thoroughly and it's easily one of the better things I've watched in television in recent memory.

You may be right that ignorant kids would somehow confuse the show with actual history, but frankly that's the fault of their parents, their educators and themselves. They really should know these things. I grew up in the 80s and 90s and certainly every kid at that time knew that America was the first to the moon and that Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin were the first on the surface (in that order).

[–] TrentnQuarantino (9187) 3 years ago

I really have yet to understand why Republicans/Conservatives think it is effective to refute and oppose change by thinking up a sarcastic word, like "woke" and then to call things that work towards positive change for different groups; races, genders, sexual preferences, etc WOKE, and think that discounts or discredits them.

I like woke. I was woke in a good way long before the term woke was used and abused, and I will be woke long after the next and the next and next stupid Republican word twisting debuts.

Did the show exaggerate to make a point in some aspects? Yes, probably, but I think just the right amount. It was a smart, clever, and yes, classy show that made a lot of good points, and I agree, this fantasy version of history was like a new genre that finally made it out of the gate, because most of what i have seen like this before has been downright bad.

[–] PrimeMinisterX (8719) 3 years ago

First off, Republicans/Conservatives did not make up the word woke. Lefties started telling people to "get woke" and conservatives just repeated the term that they used.

There is a difference between fighting for positive social change and fighting for destructive social change. To put it in perspective, it's the difference between the positive feminism of the 60s and the destructive variation known as third-wave feminism.

Or to use another example, it's the difference between the positive and just fight for civil rights for blacks in the 60s and the nonsense known as critical race theory today.

It's telling that MLK fought for equality. Everyone is equal, with equal rights and equal opportunities. But today equality is no longer the goal or acceptable; now we must demand "equity."

It's all bullshit.

[–] TrentnQuarantino (9187) 3 years ago

Republicans have appropriated the word in a negative way, same as Liberal, same as Socialist, same as everything, with the dominating power in media they can Orwellianize any word that means something positive and spin it negative.

In fact all of your "examples" are merely vapid dishonest claims with no backing or logic behind them.

Also, "Lefties" did not make up the word woke. Some subgroup did. I am a Liberal Lefty, and I have never used the word, nor would I ever. It is one of the poor messaging words the Left sometimes comes up with that the Right grabs on to and used to discredit the Left, like "Defund The Police" ... and honestly, I have a hard time thinking this is not some Right-Wing Think Tank that does this in reality.

I also reject your division of feminism. Nothing has changed, just a few new voices with some new ideas and different ways to express them. It is not destructive. If you want to talk destruction, look at what has happened to the Republican party ... that is far far far far far worse than any bad slogan on the Left.

Critical Race Theory is another one you are misusing too. It is finally casting the injustices and problems with the American system and its failure to live up to the Founding Father's visions because it is tied so closely with exploitation, racism and slavery - and teaching that in school is just a threat to Republicans who support slavery and oppression in its 21st century guise.

What is BS is you and your dishonest and vicious spinning of these issues.

[–] PrimeMinisterX (8719) 3 years ago

LOL

[–] acidraindrop (3055) 3 years ago

The term "woke" was used by the left.
The right uses it derogatively in disagreement.

But "woke" was thought up by the left.

[–] TrentnQuarantino (9187) 3 years ago

No, woke was not used by "the" Left, meaning a movement or philosophy that is aware of and cares about social and racial issues.
It may or may not have come from some sector of the Left,
I don't know, and you don't know. Whatever it is or was it is a slang term, to me it sounds like a "blackism" If I Google it, here is what it says:

The phrase "stay woke" had emerged in the United States by the 1930s. Developing within African-American Vernacular English, woke referred to an awareness of the social and political issues affecting African Americans, especially racial prejudice and discrimination.

The Right is obsessed with any and every term that blacks use or that pertains to African-Americans, especially anything they can disparage or ridicule.

I think the term you want to employ is derogatorily or derisively. The fact that the Right does this to try to cast ALL of the Left as being black or non-white is just another racist thing the Right does to mindfuck the Left and inject racism into their rhetoric. The Right tries to associate the Left with only "uppity blacks" to make whites feel like these issues are not their fight.

[–] Ranb (9700) 3 years ago

The Russians rushed Sputnik into orbit to prove how superior they were. JFK wanted a way to toot the American horn by landing on men on the moon first; not really for all mankind.

In the end it is just an interesting alternate history.

[–] TrentnQuarantino (9187) 3 years ago

> JFK wanted a way to toot the American horn by landing on men on the moon first; not really for all mankind.

Well, that is a critical and negative thing to say that you cannot really know or back up. There are a lot of arguments that the US did accomplish the moon landing for all mankind.

Conversely, what you are comparing it with is this movie, which is highly partisan and Anti-Russian. the opening frames of the movie show the Russians landing on the Moon and claiming it in the name of the global Marxist revolution or some such ... which is a device used to drive this series. You know it didn't really happen.

What did happen was the downing of the Korean KAL Flight 007.

The more I think about this the more deflated I get by the fact that it was all a big Reagan commercial, in a sense subimiinally whitewashing, and I do mean whitewashing Reagan. It was interesting to see the scene with Lee Atwater trying to get the NASA director to run for Congress. Atwater was truly a scumbag.

[–] Ranb (9700) 3 years ago

The Apollo program was not much good for anything else than landing men on the moon. Other than Skylab, it got no other use. Since the Russians did not successfully launch their first heavy boost rocket until 1987, the race was rather one sided. But then hindsight is 20-20.

I think if the USA had not spent so much racing to the moon and wasted so much time/money/lives in Vietnam, our space program would be much better today.

I know that lots of real events are depicted in the series, some changed, others not; such as John Lennon living to the present day, an early end to the Vietnam War and Pope John Paul II dying.

Reagan does get treated with kid gloves in this series.