MovieChat Forums > Batman: The Dark Knight Returns, Part 2 (2013) Discussion > they really went overboard with the abs...

they really went overboard with the absurdity with this one ....

posted 12 years ago by brian_alleyne
44 replies | jump to latest

I know its a classic comic story and it is just a comic, but some points were ridiculous beyond belief. I CAN SEE WHERE THE all stAR Batman AND Robin CAME FROM IN THIS

1) The Joker get a batarang IN HIS EYE- no scream or shout or reaction of pain just an "are you insane?" Really?As Alex Ross once said about Sin City- Millar really needs to be more realistic about how people react to pain (non verbaim)

2)An aging, past his prime, Batman got shot and stabbed multiple times by the Joker, goes under an operation and as soon as he wakes up, jumps up, gives a little groan and goes off to battle riding a HORSE??? Even Wolverine wouldve needed more time to rest and recuperate. See previous end note.

3) (this comes from part 1) Carrie Kelly- little girl can beat hardened criminals. With at least the original Robin we can say he got some training but she didnt. but can run through battle field knocking over the Mutants ,who dont seem to bother to stops her. Secondly, if shes Batmans assistant, shoudnt he have given her ,ya know A MASK rather than just keep her in a Robin suit and the same glasses she wears in her normal identity. Wouldnt someone you know RECOGNISE HER EASILY.

4) The Joker- violent murderer, killed hundreds spend years in a TRANCE. Wakes up and they let him have vistors, unmonitored??? Mix with the general population at Arkham AND GO OUT TO GO ON A TALK SHOW??? Maybe it'd have been a little more unDerstanding of his rehabilitation if TWO FACE DIDNT GO BACK TO CRIME A FEW MONTHS EARLIER!!!!!!!!!!

5 The Nazi chick with the swastika pasties, nuff said.

6) Over 6 foot tall batman can somehow lose body mass and disguise himself as a 5 foot tall old man without hunching

[–] hannibalk 12 years ago

I kinda liked the over the top stuff.

Go ahead, make my day

[–] alpha128 12 years ago

All of the story elements you're complaining about are from the graphic novel and were adapted to film more or less verbatim. I agree with many of your points, but here are some things for you to consider.

1) The Joker get a batarang IN HIS EYE- no scream or shout or reaction of pain just an "are you insane?" Really? As Alex Ross once said about Sin City- Miller really needs to be more realistic about how people react to pain (non verbatim) - brian_alleyne

In this interview (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEwf7Lk3URo) actor Michael Emerson states that the Joker in this film is "not strictly human". You could say that his insanity gives him an incredible resistance to pain. Furthermore, if the filmmakers had the Joker scream or cry out when the batarang struck his eye, that could have tipped the movie over to an R rating.

2)An aging, past his prime, Batman got shot and stabbed multiple times by the Joker, goes under an operation and as soon as he wakes up, jumps up, gives a little groan and goes off to battle riding a HORSE??? Even Wolverine would've needed more time to rest and recuperate. - brian_alleyne

I agree, but it was that way in the book. What were the filmmakers supposed to do? Have a fully recovered Batman show up to save the Gotham City after it had been destroyed?

3) (this comes from part 1) Carrie Kelly- little girl can beat hardened criminals. With at least the original Robin we can say he got some training but she didn't. but can run through battle field knocking over the Mutants ,who don't seem to bother to stops her. Secondly, if shes Batman's assistant, shouldn't he have given her, ya know A MASK rather than just keep her in a Robin suit and the same glasses she wears in her normal identity. Wouldn't someone you know RECOGNIZE HER EASILY. - brian_alleyne

If you watch closely in the scene (in Part 1) where Carrie is putting on her Robin costume, you'll see a poster on her wall that reads "Gymnastics Rocks", and several medals and trophies in her room. So the filmmakers recognized Carrie's lack of training and addressed it by giving her a background as an amateur gymnast. As for her not wearing a mask, I agree with you.

4) The Joker- violent murderer, killed hundreds spend years in a TRANCE. Wakes up and they let him have visitors, unmonitored??? Mix with the general population at Arkham AND GO OUT TO GO ON A TALK SHOW??? Maybe it'd have been a little more understanding of his rehabilitation if TWO FACE DIDN'T GO BACK TO CRIME A FEW MONTHS EARLIER!!!!!!!!!! - brian_alleyne

You raise very valid points. However, in Miller's "future '80s", the authorities take a very different approach to the treatment of criminals like the Joker. Hence the renaming of "Arkham Asylum for the Criminally Insane" to "Arkham Home for the Emotionally Troubled". The authorities consider their new approach to be "enlightened". Furthermore, Dr. Bartholomew Wolper has a HUGE ego and thinks he can handle anything. In addition, the Joker's crimes were ten years ago and the public has largely forgotten about them, or at least forgotten how bad they were. Finally, the Joker is a master manipulator, and easily dupes Dr. Wolper into getting him on the TV show.

5 The Nazi chick with the swastika pasties, nuff said. - brian_alleyne

Here I have to disagree. Compared to photos of some actual gang members (http://more89.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/yourchildrensfuture.jpg), Bruno's look is positively restrained.

6) Over 6 foot tall batman can somehow lose body mass and disguise himself as a 5 foot tall old man without hunching - brian_alleyne

Actually, Batman was disguised as an old woman. But I agree with you, I don't know how Batman pulled off that particular disguise.

[–] Koosh_King01 10 years ago

Actually, Batman was disguised as an old woman.

I think the OP meant when he's pretending to be the plainclothes detective at the Congressman Noches death site. But O'Halloran seemed like a robust enough guy and reasonably resembled Bruce enough that impersonating him wasn't too much trouble.

I mean, really, how many times will you look under Jabba's manboobs?

[–] qdfqdf 12 years ago

7) Little girl Robin can reprogram a high tech helicopter in mid flight without having any possible knowledge of its operations whatsoever.

8) Trained police officers, including the butt ugly "I wanna be a man" retarded female commissioner, can't shoot straight or hit a target at point blank range.

9) Little girl Robin when climbing the roller coaster to fight fattie doll-maker was jumping upwards from beam to beam, she has super human strength.

Lots of stupid annoying points like this that didn't need to exist. Overall though I enjoyed the 2 movies. I hope they make more from the comic sequel.

My other complaint from these movies is that Superman is a complete and utter retarded stooge.

[–] alpha128 12 years ago

7) Little girl Robin can reprogram a high tech helicopter in mid flight without having any possible knowledge of its operations whatsoever. - qdfqdf

In the book they establish that Carrie learned to be good with computers at her school. In the movie they foreshadow Carrie's reprogramming of the Batcopter in Part 2 by showing her trying to log into the Batcave computer in part 1.

8) Trained police officers, including the butt ugly "I wanna be a man" retarded female commissioner, can't shoot straight or hit a target at point blank range. - qdfqdf

You've got a point. At least the female commissioner had an excuse for missing because she lost her glasses. As for the other cops, well, I guess they went to the Imperial Stormtrooper Marksmanship Academy.

[–] Steve_2 11 years ago

Speaking of "Imperial Stormtrooper Marksmanship Academy," the entire U.S. Army can't stop a one-armed senior citizen with a bow.

[–] HellboundHero 11 years ago

Isn't this all the superhero genre in a nutshell? The reason Batman and Green Arrow never get shot here is the same reason they don't often get shot in the entirety of their 70 year existences, or any other popular action hero in various media escape heavily armed men with their lives on a regular basis.

[–] justafu 12 years ago

I'm in agreement with the the OP! Check out my opinions.

"It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it."

[–] pcbjja 12 years ago

I get what you're saying and don't totally disagree with you. But you're watching a Batman movie. You must suspend your disbelief in most things. I mean...he smashes his fists through a wall and pulls a man through it. The very concept of Batman is an impossibility. Who, in a single lifetime, has the ability to become an Olympic level gymnast, master every martial art, become a master detective, purchase..build..or buy all the crap he has (most of which is also impossible.

If you try to rationalize Batman at all, it breaks down pretty darn quickly. My advise is don't try.

[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] BrunoAntony 12 years ago

Haha ... so true!

[–] vortexrider 12 years ago

I think its pointless to point out these unbelievable aspects of Dark Knight Returns since if you analyze it with real world standards the whole premise of Batman, in any comic book, movie, or animation is absurd.
You're picking on parts that are actually less absurd than the whole concept of costumed vigilantes, super villains.
I'd find much more issue with plain fact that Batman and Robin have wear their costumes all the time, which by any real world standards would be ridiculous, would immediately reveal them in crowds etc.
How about batman and robin hopping from building to building and knowing martial arts. All of it is a fantasy world. You either go along with it or not.

[–] kataang020 12 years ago

It is possible to analyze the movie with real world standards. Most movies can have a bit of unrealistic effects here and there. It comes down to how often and how much. With Dark Knight Returns Part 2, there's just so many that it draws me out of the movie and view everything with skepticism.

One scene that made me highly skeptical was the scene after the "Love Tunnel", where Batman is cornered by cops and the commissioner and female Robin is trying to get him into the helicopter. Batman drops so much blood all over the scene but gets away. You mean to tell me that forensics simply overlooked the blood which would identify him??

[–] jamieparsons1 12 years ago

Why would they have Bruce Wayne's DNA on file?

[–] kataang020 12 years ago

Why do you think they collect blood at crime scenes and take it to the crime lab for analysis?

[–] jamieparsons1 12 years ago

To find what blood type it is. They don't have a giant computer where they put a drop of blood in and it immediately identifies any single person on earth.

[–] amh1219-589-37887 11 years ago

Actually, they do have a giant database like this. Only certain criminals are in it though, so Bruce's DNA probably wouldn't be on file.

[–] darkahsoka 11 years ago

To match for DNA. But you need to have that person's DNA in the database in the first place, for you to be able to make a match.

[–] BrunoAntony 12 years ago

Do you analyse all cartoons using real world standards? That must be exhausting.

[–] bud380 11 years ago

"With Dark Knight Returns Part 2, there's just so many that it draws me out of the movie and view everything with skepticism"

If you willfully watch an animated movie, in which animation is typically used as a stylization choice to exaggerate or create events that are simply absurd, coupled with it being a super-hero movie, you have no right to complain or bitch about being "drawn out of the movie" due to it lack of realism.

I mean, what the hell do you expect from a movie where exo-skeletons exist (the US, the most advanced military on earth, is still in prototyping stages for them) that are capable of drawing enough power from entire city blocks without overloading the circuitry of the suit itself? Or where Superman even exists AT ALL?

Complaining about a lack of "realism" in a Batman movie is borderline literal mental retardation. There's no other way to put it. You're dealing with characters like Mr. Freeze, Poison Ivy, Killer Croc, Clayface, and the Man-bat. Even the Nolan movies were incredibly unrealistic at times.

[–] Lord_Vittles_VI 12 years ago

It's absurd because the comic was written as a satire of the other comics at the time. At least that's how it comes across to me.

Seems in his later years old Frank forgot it was a joke and started writing/drawing this way in earnest.

[–] bud380 11 years ago

"the comic was written as a satire of the other comics at the time"

Don't be an idiot.

Other comics at the time weren't "dark" and "gritty", that didn't happen until after Dark Knight Returns and Watchmen, the only satire in Dark Knight Returns is political, in which he lambasts Reagan, Liberals, Conservatives, and the Media.

If you've seen any clips of Frank Miller talking about Dark Knight Returns, the actual portrayal of Batman, and the tone of the comic, was NOT satire, he was trying to be as realistic as he could for the characters sake, and even one of the Dirty Harry movies served as inspiration for the comic.

It's utterly WRONG to say that the comic itself is a "parody" or "satire" of other comics and it's an insult to Frank Miller AND the Dark Knight Returns.

[–] spectrx 12 years ago

haha they are some very good points, especially the second and last one.

[–] Apathy4progress 11 years ago

From a realistic standpoint, all those points are certainly valid, but you're forgetting that you're analyzing a comic book character. Just because Batman is considered more "realistic" than Superman, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, etc. doesn't mean it follows the rules of reality. Action/adventure stories from 30-40 years ago use the same formula. Ever watch a James Bond film? Even the ones today where they try to make it more plausible still have the bad marksmanship and villains who always stall when it comes to killing the hero. It's purely entertainment. And most people watch stuff like Batman for the love of the characters, not the plot.

"Ignorance does not equal innocence"