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Being gay or a pro-gay christian doesn't condemn you to hell

posted 17 years ago by laeuferin
93 replies | jump to latest

Looking at some of these posts, I don't know which is worse: the anti-gay Christians or the anti-Christian pro-gay people.

First off, I'm just going say that I am a Christian baptist AND I support gays.

I'm tired of anti-gay Christians using the bible to back up their reasoning for deny gays the right to equal treatment. Being gay alone won't condemn you to hell. It is completely possible for gays to live godly lives, and more of them probably would *if* right wing whites would stop throwing Leviticus in their faces.

The bible also says that adultery, stealing, and lying is wrong, and yet many are more willing to forgive this than homosexuality. There is no such thing as a perfect human being; even after accepting Christ, we never stop committing sin, even if we try.

All sin is equal to god. That is to say that homosexuality is equally bad as lying, which is equally as bad as stealing, which is equally as bad as adultery, which is equally as bad as murder. All sin is equally detestable, because god is a sinless being.

BUT God forgives sin. All sin. The requirement for getting into heaven is:
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son, and WHOEVER believes in him shall not perish, but have everlasting life."

This covers lairs, adulterers, and yes, homosexuals. It covers you, me, your parents, every stranger on the street, every person, every age, every skin color, and every sexuality. We are all sinner, but we are all loved equally in gods eyes. Therefore, homosexuality alone isn't a one-way ticket into hell. Homosexuality doesn't define your worth as a human being and shouldn't deny you of equal rights.

And those of you that are slamming Christians... you are just as bad as those prosecuting gays. I don't care if you share my beliefs or not. I'm sure you wouldn't make a laundry list of reasons why Buddhism is wrong to Buddhists like you do for Christianity to Christians. Christianity in itself isn't wrong, but its the people using it to falsely persecute others and cover up their prejudices that are wrong.

You should note that there are tons of Christians that support gays because they see them as normal people. Don't automatically lump us all into the same category and think that just because we believe in the bible that it makes us unable to accept those different than us. We aren't all "bible-toting jesus freaks".

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] thakid 16 years ago

lol how can God forgive sins that people arent sorry for...

[–] sjtuplin 16 years ago

9.You know that wicked people will not inherit the kingdom of God, don't you? Stop deceiving yourselves! Sexually immoral people, idolaters, adulterers, male prostitutes, homosexuals, 10.thieves, greedy people, drunks, slanderers, and robbers will not inherit the kingdom of God.

BUT!!! What people(even Christians, unfortunately)seem to forget is the last part of this chapter:

11.That is what some of you were! But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of our Lord Jesus the Messiah and by the Spirit of our God.

To be a Christian you must believe and love God. If you love God, you will strive to live for him. Yes, Christians DO still sin. But, we as Christians must strive to NOT sin. To desire to put it all aside. Excepting you're a homosexual is no different than excepting you're a thief. Or a liar.

Can a person be gay and be a Christian? Sure. If, they strive to turn from their homosexuality and repent, they shall receive the kingdom of God. Jesus loved the people but hated the sin.

I don't hate homosexuals. I hate the sin. A person is a person. As am I. It's your life. Not mine. God gave everyone choice. We can choose to follow him and be obedient, or we can choose to live our life without him.

[–] Lilithdemilo24 16 years ago

Excepting you're a homosexual is no different than excepting you're a thief. Or a liar.

Right, so getting past the fact that you obviously got so carried away with your righteous anger riff that you forgot the rather amusing differences between 'accepting' and 'excepting'...let's try and deal with this venom that you're spurting out.

The basic difference, allow me to spell out, between what you so poorly underlined above is as follows.

Liars and thieves create misery. They hurt, they steal - they make people unhappy.

Who are we hurting by loving? Because that is all we're doing, at the end of the day. It's all just love, sex and connection - the same as everyone else, but we're just that much more interesting. The only people who are made unhappy by homosexuality are people like you, banging the bible above your head like a two year old with a saucepan and a wooden spoon.

Well, here's something that will really make your day.

People like YOU, do nothing but good for us. People who get so caught up in the fervency and anger of what they're typing that they can't even spell correctly. People who quote a ridiculous book, written by manipulative men, because they can't think up a single reason of their OWN to point out what exactly is wrong with it (besides the reproductive angle...yes, we really DO need more humans. We're running so short!) People like you, who judge and sit on your moral high ground, playing God themselves.

People like you, make your argument look and sound utterly ridiculous.

Sure, sometimes someone will come along and articulate their reasons well. They'll have passages in the Old and New Testament to back up these hate-promoting beliefs. But let's face it...it's pretty rare.

People like you, who judge instead of accept and hate instead of tolerate, just prove that whatever crap you come out with is completely puerile. Medieval, out-dated, angry little people stomping your feet because you've got nothing better to do with your time. Instead of trying to help, you'd rather spend your time boring us with how we're all going to hell for who we love.

What's worse? Loving in an unorthodox way or promoting hatred, violence and prejudice? We're out there loving, while you're busy hating and misspelling.

TBH, I can't thank you enough really. You've done everything possible to show how arrogant, stubborn and just plain ignorant you are.

Who are you to judge me and tell me, via YOUR selective interpretations of a VERY contradictory piece of fiction, that I won't be welcomed into the Kingdom? I don't think I WANT to go somewhere that has a guest list after I die. I think I'd rather go to hell and wear trainers, thanks.

I very rarely answer these threads because people like you are a lost cause and mostly. You - however - deserve my thanks.

Thank you, for discrediting your own argument with your own ignorance, lack of understanding and complete disregard for the only real message that radiates through all decent, wonderful Christians.

Love Thy Neighbour.

I don't recall seeing fine print beneath that. Nor do I remember reading "Jesus Loves Everyone... Except You! And you! And you!"

Love is and should be unconditional and equal.

I can only shudder to imagine what Jesus must think of those who use his name in such hateful, arrogant mudslinging.

[–] sjtuplin 16 years ago

Well, first off, the only person who sounds angry is you.

I wasn't ATTACKING anyone. I was simply giving my interpretation of what the Bible says. Regardless of what yo say, know this: Jesus loves everyone. He wants us to love everyone. Just because I disagree with a life choice DOES NOT mean I don't love someone. Just don't take bits and pieces from the Bible out of it that you don't like. You either believe or don't. If you love Christ, you'll live your life for Him. You'll never be perfect, no one will. But, God looks at our hearts.

And thanks for correcting me on my grammar. I make one mistake and you jump all over me. That's mature.

[–] leona1435 16 years ago

When people disrespect the Bible, they respect the Christians too because The Holy Bible is a Holy Book.

Don't tell me our God isn't an awesome God!!!!!

[–] couzijn 16 years ago

The Bible is the Word of God, because it says so.

I believe that any book is written by the person quoted in the book as its author.

This message was written by me, Ronald Reagan, once US president. That must be true, because it is written in the message.

[–] bluecat60 16 years ago

Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do
not see.

This is what the ancients were commended for.

3 By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God's command, so
that what is seen was not made out of what was visible.

6 And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who
comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who
earnestly seek him.

[–] couzijn 16 years ago

Bluecat60 wrote:
>Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do
not see.

You hope for me to exist, otherwise you wouldn't be responding to my post.

You do not see me - such is obvious - so that in your reasoning you are quite certain of me.

So go ahead, hope for me to be Ronald Reagan and be quite certain of that. It may take a little courage and faith, but isn't that 'what the ancients were commended for'? (By you, that is.)

Michel Couzijn
P.S. I am often appalled at the loss of reasoning by otherwise sane people, once religion enters the game.

[–] jacrainbow87 15 years ago

I can see how people do not believe in the Bible... but... What about Revelations..?? So much of the prophecy that is in the Bible is being revealed in these times. I do not call myself a Christian, but I do believe in God, and even though I am confused about what is true or not, I still see the prophecies coming true. And I see things that are also in the Quaran that are coming true.

And only God could have made everything. The universe did not create itself. I would rather believe in GOD than the universe just being there out of nowhere.

And I do not like homosexuality, but I do have a gay friend who I like alot and find to be a kind and funny person.

[–] 15 years ago

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[–] FlipWilsson 15 years ago

I thought xtians were supposed to love thy neighbor??

[–] 15 years ago

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[–] diegoavilarodriguez 14 years ago

Dont know much about religion but i find that those who bash gays using religious crap are total hipocrits.

Since when did God want people to kill each other, to hate each other, to judge one another based on things things we dont understand, quoting: JUDGE AND YOU SHALL BE JUDGED. So screw it man, i find it ironic that gay bashers use god as an excuse to hate gays and at the same time doing things god wouldnt doesnt ant to do.

On the same note, even as a child i never believed in the bible (i believed in god but not the bible) mainly because it was written by man, a creature that has been known to lie, cheat, and steal for its own needs, i personally believe that not everything the bible said to be god´s true words, for all we know, its the words of some douche bag who just wants to *beep* with people, so for me i dont take a lot of what the bible says to be god´s true words.

[–] nastylev 12 years ago

So basically you people are judging a human's sexual orientation based on an old book written in a time when the causes of homosexuality were not fully (if at all) understood.
We now understand it a bit better, we understand the causes and factors that determine this characteristic. And it comes down to this: most of the factors that determine someone's sexual orientation are predetermined before birth. To put it in religious terms: God made him/her that way.
So my question is: would God create someone who, by design, is incapable of living a clean life and has a one-way ticket to Hell even before they are born?

Interpretation of the Bible is everything.

P.S.: Why is it that the OP puts every sin in the same category ("all sin is equal to God") yet only homosexuals are referred to as "those different than us"?

[–] LuisaGallo 12 years ago

In the Old Testament, some people were deliberately using homosexual acts to worship a false idol in the temple - that's why the Bible is so against it. It's not against two people of the same sex loving each other very deeply - just look at David and Jonathan!! That certainly reads like a love story! :-)
But if people were using certain acts - any acts - to deliberately worship a false idol, which is the same as worshipping the devil - then of course the Bible would be strongly against it. I am sure this is where most of the confusion lies.

And if God can understand all of our thoughts and feelings, how could he possibly not understand gay feelings?? That's TRULY unbelievable... ;-)

[–] ThaRealest29 12 years ago

The only thing peop1e have to do is read the Bible it says in the good book GOD created man, and he said its not right for man to be alone so he created woman not another man ADAM & EVE not adam & steve. Alot of people think its cool to do whatever they want as long as they go to church or they say that they love GOD but if it was ok it would be in the bible because it bible is THE TRUTH if you want the truth READ THE BIBLE if you dont wanna read but hear come to church the ONE TRUE CHURCH THE CHURCH OF CHRIST matthew 16:18 and if you want to live right theres 5 things you have to do.

1.Hear {the word}
2.Believe {JESUS is GODS son and was sent to died for our sins}
3.Repent {of all your past sins}
4.Confess {that JESUS is the CHRIST}
5.Be Baptized

and there you have it and live GODLY the rest of your life do not be over come with this world but over come this world.

1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Don't you realize that those who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God? Don't fool yourselves. Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, or commit adultery, or are male prostitutes, or practice homosexuality, or are thieves, or greedy people, or drunkards, or are abusive, or cheat people-none of these will inherit the Kingdom of God. Some of you were once like that. But you were cleansed; you were made holy; you were made right with God by calling on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

[–] musicbytes 12 years ago

This is why I don't subscribe to religion, The divisiveness and hypocrisy, If there is a god then he would not want all the religions fighting over which is best, Hate is always wrong whether it is homophobia racism or sexism, Spirituality is best, Be kind to everyone for we are all here together !

[–] ThaRealest29 12 years ago

first off there is a GOD and the reason there is a lot of religions is because the devil brought them in the world you might ask why? well the devil is against GOD and JESUS so anything there for he is against like JESUS church the CHURCH OF CHRIST the ONLY church you can read about.

P.S im with you on the be kind to everyone thing

[–] 12 years ago

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[–] Danzence 11 years ago

You can't be condemned to something that doesn't exist. So relax.

[–] ThaRealest29 11 years ago

are you saying hell doesn't exist

[–] Danzence 11 years ago

If you can't figure that out then.. I don't know what else to say.

[–] Thought_Criminal_J62377 10 years ago

Your post is incredibly amusing. Where to start...

"I'm tired of anti-gay Christians using the bible to back up their reasoning for deny gays the right to equal treatment. Being gay alone won't condemn you to hell. It is completely possible for gays to live godly lives, and more of them probably would *if* right wing whites would stop throwing Leviticus in their faces. The bible also says that adultery, stealing, and lying is wrong, and yet many are more willing to forgive this than homosexuality. There is no such thing as a perfect human being; even after accepting Christ, we never stop committing sin, even if we try."

Right wing whites??? Are you serious? How is it okay to say that? And how is that fair or accurate? Are you saying that only "right wing whites" oppose homosexuality? If you said anything specifically critical of blacks, you and every other PC do-gooder would be down your throat.

Is it completely possible for thieves, rapists and murderers to intentionally continue doing those sins and still lead a Christian life? No! You make it seem as if we have the green light to do whatever makes us feel good and shouldn't try to be better people or do God's will. Being gay is a sin and to embrace it, you are not trying to be better people and you're certainly not doing God's will!

I believe somewhere along the line, political correctness infected your mind and now you've lost your way. You can't purposely keep committing any of these sins and live righteously. You have to feel the guilt and be trying to change!

"There is no such thing as a perfect human being; even after accepting Christ, we never stop committing sin, even if we try."

It's not being perfect that matters, it's the trying to be that does! You don't resign yourself to consciously committing sin after sin, because we know humans aren't perfect. I honestly can't believe you even said "even if we try." As if that would be something extraordinary. Who is teaching you and supporting these beliefs???

"All sin is equal to god. That is to say that homosexuality is equally bad as lying, which is equally as bad as stealing, which is equally as bad as adultery, which is equally as bad as murder. All sin is equally detestable, because god is a sinless being.

BUT God forgives sin. All sin. The requirement for getting into heaven is:
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son, and WHOEVER believes in him shall not perish, but have everlasting life."

You didn't say anything wrong here, but your underlying message continues to be "have a ball, disrespect, offend and spit in the face of God with your premeditated sin, because we have a free pass." That's what you're overlooking... God never said to intentionally and premeditatedly continue on your shameless path of sin.

The rules of forgiveness are in hindsight! Meaning if you come to a point and realize that you've been living wrong, you can be forgiven, but you don't view it as a get-out-of-jail-free-card, where before the fact, you enter into a pattern of sin, knowing that later you can just ask for forgiveness. If a person's a true Christian and gay, they'll be ashamed of it and endeavor to change their lifestyle. They won't be trying to take other Christians down with them, by trying to change laws that sanction homosexuality and support a viewpoint that homosexuality is as valid and natural as heterosexuality.

As Christians, we have a responsibility to represent Christianity and God's law as he intended. We're not supposed to be speaking out in support of sin in all it's forms, even when political correctness has us cast as villains like it does presently. As most people are aware, PC has made Christianity unpopular, because Christianity doesn't allow people to do all the things they like to do without guilt.

Yea, Tho I Walk Thru The Valley Of The Shadow Of Political Correctness...🇺🇸

[–] Swaggnificent 9 years ago

I agree 100% that "Being gay or a pro-gay christian doesn't condemn you to hell." I agree because hell isn't real, it doesn't exist. Is there a god, I don't know, I doubt it; but the god of the bible sure isn't real. Not really a conversation that needs to be had.

As for people who slam christians well there is a long history of christians (not all of them) trying to shove their religion down everybody's throats, in the past by force. Now that we have reached a point in civilization where we won't be burned at the stake for voicing our thoughts on the matter many choose to do so. It's like calling out a liar, or correcting someone who has been misinformed. You feel the need to do so, the first because it's right, and the latter because you don't want them going around dumbing more people down with false information. Last I checked I've never had a Buddhist tell me I will burn for eternity for not meditating. They keep to themselves. In the US at least they don't try to impede science, improperly educate other peoples children with unfounded rubbish, or impose ass backwards laws, and policy based on a book full of fairy tales which have zero supporting evidence.

Really it's a non-issue since the god of the bible doesn't exist, and can't send anyone to an imaginary place that also doesn't exist. What is an issue are human rights in the real world not imaginary punishments from mythological characters.

[–] slesleylawson 9 years ago

I noticed there are groups in the bible belt of the USA who claim to be Christian, but they only follow the Old Testament while ignoring what Jesus said about peace and love. Jesus spoke against many things in the OT such as stoning, like when he said he who is without sin should cast the first stone. He spoke out against bigotry towards others with the Good Samaritan story. He said not to judge others, but people hold banners judging others.

[–] jamotide 8 years ago

I noticed there are groups in the bible belt of the USA who claim to be Christian, but they only follow the Old Testament while ignoring what Jesus said about peace and love. Jesus spoke against many things in the OT such as stoning, like when he said he who is without sin should cast the first stone. He spoke out against bigotry towards others with the Good Samaritan story. He said not to judge others, but people hold banners judging others.

So basically everyone is free to sin? What is the point of this religion again?