Cate's German?
Was that dubbed??? Her German is pretty freaking good if not.
shareI don't think it was dubbed, but Clooney's German made me cringe, almost physically sick. In another movie situation it might have been plausible...
O Brother, why weren't they able to find a dialect coach for you who knows his job? It's not that German is some minor, extremely exotic language!
---------------
Ever notice that "what the hell" is always the right decision? ~ Marilyn Monroe
Well, between Blanchet, and Cloony there was a difference.
1. She was playing a German, so her German had to sound on point.
2. He was playing an American who spent some time in Germany, so it's more likely that his German wouldn' be that great, and it's realistic that he would speak with an American accent.
His german was absolutely right, for the character.
What did you expect fluency?
No he is an English speaker butching the lanaguage.
Cate wasn't dubbed, she studied hard, although she studied Ingrid Berman (amongst others) who happened to be Swedish, not German.
American films don't seem to be as concerned about accents as they should be; I don't know if they think people are too stupid to notice or what. It seems often to be left to the performer to do their own homework, ala Meryl Streep, who allegedly learned Polish for Sophie's Choice to ensure her knowledge of the language.
Having seen the movie (I'm German, btw), her pronunciation is absolutely terrific! Even the parts that are tricky to pronounce for people from English-speaking countries (like the different 'ch'-sounds in German), she mastered with ease; Only her intonation is slighty off.
Clooney, OTOH, didn't seem to give a lot about sounding right in his German-speaking parts (watch when he asks the boy floating his boat)...it sounded rather unintentionally funny.
But you must remember that Clooney played an American (an American who maybe isn't great at Speaking German) so his German doesn't necessarily have to be as good as Blanchett's who actually played a German. Think about it.
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Idiots.
Why should Clooney's German be perfect?? He's playing an American and in the book there are several references to his German not being that great.
Oh, yeah, forgot, people don't f++kin' read books anymore.
Don't you think someone who only knows some German would sound different than someone who knows none? Moreover, why would someone who knows only a little German use perfect German phrases, but pronounce them like he had a speech impediment?
Oh yeah, forgot, people don't fu¢king learn languages anymore.
Their German was just BAD.
No one said Clooney's German or McGuire’s has to be perfect. After all, they are not Germans . however, their German should be enough to pass them by. Those who speak German should be at least able to be able to makeout what they were trying to saying....
I guess subtitles were needed for both German, and non German speakers
Right. For Clooney that fits right in since he wasn't German, but did live there.
shareBut Cate's character was actually German, wasn't she?? Whereas although he was supposed to have been in Germany for some time pre-war, Clooney's character was American, so surely his accent would not have been anywhere near as good as her's. Besides which, when Clooney was speaking to the little boy with the toy boat, we never saw his face at all - so someone else could have been speaking his German lines, couldn't they??
shareAnother "cringe" example is Rene Russo speaking German in "The Thomas Crown Affair"- I didn't recognise my native language for a second, and when I did I couldn't believe it! Like Clooney, they must have saved on the dialect coach. Ick!
Nadine :)
Check out some episodes of the relatively new TV show Fringe, then. Uck! They didn't even bother to get the written translations right.
shareI read that Arnold was refused the German dub for The Terminator or one of his other big movies, because his Austrian accent makes him sound like a farmer.
The equivalent would be a redneck accent for Americans, or a Cornish pastie for the English. (or munchie for the Irish :P)
At the Berlinale the film got bad reception by the german audience. People didn`t applaude. According to reports there were even outcries.
The actor´s attempts to speak german caused unintended fun and laughs.
Some reviewers asked why Hollywood doesn´t cast an appropriate german actress to play a German. They commented that in the past at least the bad guys - the Germans - were played by German actors. And the good German is killed - of course.
It was negatively noted that the crew/cast didn`t dare to appear for questioning after the film - as usual.
Cate's German was pretty good, although I don't see why they couldn't have cast a German actress in that role. It's not as though there's a shortage . . .
George's German was off (didn't understand all of what he said) but that doesn't matter seeing as he's playing an American and therefore isn't expected to speak German well.
~psychos don't explode in the sunlight, I don't care HOW psycho they are~
I saw the film last night (English with German subtitles in a German cinema), and Clooney's German prompted hysterical laughter in the audience. I could hardly make out what he said. I mean, yes, he is supposed to be an American and hence have an accent, but he speaks grammatically complicated German with an atrocious accent, that doesn't make sense. A foreigner usually speaks in a less complex way and only attempts to be understood.
Cate Blanchett had an accent, yes, but she spoke German quite well, she did a good job there. But, though I considered her to be the only highlight of the cast in this rather dull film, I also don't get why they didn't just use a German actress for the part, that would have made infinitely more sense.
Clooney's German ... he speaks grammatically complicated German with an atrocious accent, that doesn't make sense. A foreigner usually speaks in a less complex way and only attempts to be understood.
Tell us a German actress of the same calibre as Cate Blanchett. I don't think there are any.
The problem with the "George Clooney's character was American" argument is that Clooney's character apparently lived in Berlin for years so he should have learnt it pretty fluently. Especially for back in that time when I assume English was as common.
The problem with the "George Clooney's character was American" argument is that Clooney's character apparently lived in Berlin for years so he should have learnt it pretty fluently
I don't care about Clooney's German, but even some characters who were supposed to be Germans spoke total gibberish. It's just like the background Germans in the Indiana Jones films, they speak German with a terrible foreign accent. Why, o mighty Hollywood, why? There are 80 million Germans, a couple of hundred thousands of those must be actors, why not take them? If you're willing to spend millions on costumes and locations you should be willing to spend a couple of thousands on real Germans.
sharei don't think it's a question of money wolf they don't use german actors because they don't feel they need to. I mean come on, the Indiana Jones series is not exactly meant for serious, educational or realistic viewing.
Pisces rule!
As for Indiana Jones movies, I don't consider them bad examples of German speech in Hollywood. It was quite good actually. Especially one line in "The Last Crusade" doesn't need dubbing, it remains untouched when aired in TV or in cinema ("Diese Amerikaner, die kämpfen wie Mädchen!"/"Those americans, they fight like girls!") while German main villians are duped because they sound ridiculous or make major mistakes in grammar or pronunciation.
A rather good example of German is Die Hard. Alan Rickman speaks very well with only one or two horific error(s).
For a very very bad german line watch James Bond - Tomorrow never dies. There was a good laugh for german audiences. And James Bond is supposed to be fluent in German. I needed two tries to even unterstand what he was trying to say!
cate's german was very stilted, especially when she was talking to her husband, who spoke authentic german
george german was authentic, for an american who spoke german as a second language
Don't Care What The Governments Say
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Correct me if I am wrong, but you say Cate' "German" was very stilted, if I am not mistaken that means "not easy and natural" - then I would take it as you are complimenting her?
no it means quite the opposite
Don't Care What The Governments Say
They're All Bought And Paid For Anyway
- Sun Green
The crew/cast didn't DARE appear after the film for questioning, you say?? - well, don't forget, they were in Germany and may have been a bit nervous - catch my drift?
You were the one who said it, not me.
if german is your native tongue, it still sucks ;-)
well actually it doesn't. her pronunciation was near perfect.
the language on the other hand was not. most of the time it was kinda funny, even for christian oliver. some of the sentences didn't make sense at all.
the dialogue writers somehow messed it up - probably with a little help from babelfish or the google language tools ;-)
to me cate's german sounded very stilted compared with that of her husband
Don't Care What The Governments Say
They're All Bought And Paid For Anyway
- Sun Green
well, her husband IS German, that might explain ...
sharei'm not looking for an explanation, i was just pointing out cate's german was stilted
she should have used a voice double for her few lines of german
either that or spent some time with a voice coach
Don't Care What The Governments Say
They're All Bought And Paid For Anyway
- Sun Green
I bet she did that. ;-) Let's be fair, German isn't exactly the easiest language. It's by far not the most difficult, but I'm glad I am German and don't have to learn it as a second language. ;-)
sharebeg to differ, german is probably the easiest language for an english speaker, given that english is a germanic language
Don't Care What The Governments Say
They're All Bought And Paid For Anyway
- Sun Green
3 genders instead of one, massive differences in grammar, word order, etc... If you're English, go for French. ;-)
shareenglish is a germanic language, french isn't
also i found learning german to be sehr einfach
Don't Care What The Governments Say
They're All Bought And Paid For Anyway
- Sun Green
English WAS a germanic language until 1066. Now it's indeed, especially concerning pronounciation, closer to French.
shareI loved her saying "You can never really get out of Berlin." I keep watching the trailer just to hear that.
shareI heard that Cate was not dubbed in it. Its really her speaking German. She was supposedly only told just before they shot the scene that they wanted her to speak German instead of English.
There was a voice coach hired apparently but he was terrible. Absolutely inaccurate. They had to dub Clooney in the film.
life is full of censorship.i can't spit in your eye. -katharine hepburn
And the line is true...if you have ever been there then you know what I mean. Great city, wonderful people...loved it and moving there soon.
shareI personally had more of a problem with her accent when she was speaking English. Definitely channeling Marlene Dietrich there, and there were several times that she didn't pronounce words in English like a true German would (saying "th" in the word "nothing", zB). Obviously, Cate is a bigger box office draw than a similar calibre German actress would be for an American audience, but too bad it *wasn't* a German actress -- say, Franka Potente, Diane Kruger, etc. -- I never once forgot that I was watching Cate Blanchett.
George, on the other hand...oy vey...but as others have pointed out here, the character lived in Berlin before the war, so that accounts for his German speaking ability, but he never did gain much of a credible accent. I laughed at that too, but I think that was on purpose, to emphasize that although he could speak the language, he was never really German.
[deleted]
Cate's German was pretty good, but never close to natural. It shows she trained hard, but sometimes she slips into a (Bergmanesque?) scandinavian accent.
Clooney's German, on the other hand, sounds as if he read it from a cue card, with English pronounciation, not knowing what he says. Even if his character wasn't good at languages, working as a journalist in pre-war Berlin for some years, he should at least have got some hint of speech melody. It sounds like a computer's reading program. I don't think it was on purpose. Either a bad language course or he just didn't care.
Isuppose she didn't have to translate her german lines from English on the fly, so no, it wasn't pretty freaking good, it was acceptable. Her english accent when she was talking German was several times stronger than her fake german accent when she was talking English. Also her intonation was off, she sounded like she had learned to prounounce the words, but had never heard them together in a sentence. Everyone else was barely understandable, they could as well have been talking Dutch, except for Emil Brandt(Christian Oliver) and the little boy floating his toy boat who supposedly was dubbed.
shareI just read through this whole thread and the posts protesting that George's or Cate's German was unintentionally funny are ... unintentionally funny. In a sad and bitter kind of way.
In the rush to be huffy and holier than thou and more Teutonic than Hitler, the posters quick to take offense at any mislocation of any umlaut are missing the obvious aesthetics.
"The Good German" is a salute to Golden Age, Studio films like "Casablanca" and "The Third Man."
In such films, Paul Henreid, Viennese, could play a Czech -- not at all the same thing. Claude Reins could play a Frenchman. Cary Grant passed as American in film after film. Myrna Loy, in her early career, was Asian.
That was how it worked in the studio era. it was all artifice. Beautiful, beautiful, artifice.
Before Political Correctness became the humorless cop breathing down everyone's neck.
It doesn't matter how Cate or George pronounced "Wienerschnitzel," "Götterdämmerung," or "Endlosung." What matters is if they have the glamor to match the studio's best.
Only problem is they were trying to be realistic by speaking German, unlike the Golden Age of Hollywood when everyone just spoke English. And since they were speaking German it does matter if they sound authentic or not as it's a direct correlation to the success of the film's realism.
Oh sweet mystery of life at last I have found yuuuuuu
Since the film was largely filmed in English, it was largely aimed at an English speaking audience, therefore totally 'authentic' sounding German really isn't all that necessary to the success of the film. Someone earlier commented that Cate's 'English' accent showed through often...interesting when she's not actually English and doesn't speak with an English accent.
It's a tradition of Hollywood that they use known actors to sell movies regardless of nationality. People watched this movie because it starred George Clooney and Cate Blanchett and because it was directed by Steven Soderbergh. Some perfectly good German actress wouldn't have sold the film to many people outside Germany. There are many very good English actresses...it doesn't stop them putting Gwynneth Paltrow in film after film with a very limited English accent, does it?
And does no one have complaints about Tony Curran's very pronounced, ungermanic accent??