Raging Bull arrived at the beginning of the '80s, but is it best of that decade? This list ranks it third behind Do the Right Thing and Ran. Where does it belong?
http://cynicritics.com/2013/03/14/favorite-80s-movies/
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It's a good list but I think it's missing some films like Cinema Paradiso, Tootsie, Local Hero, Witness, When Harry Met Sally, Once Upon a Time in America, Repo man, pope of Greenwich village
Greatest Films Not in the IMDB Top 250http://www.imdb.com/list/bc9x1QAFat0/
Once Upon in America and Repo Man definitely belong in there.
You can't be a satanist without being a christian.
No, it's not the best movie of the 80's. Any list of that kind is subjective and will always be up for debate.
It's like the IMDB top 250 list. No one person will ever completely agree with that. And that list has 11 films from the 80's ahead of Raging Bull. Some of those I agree with and others I don't.
Personally, I liked Raging Bull but I didn't love it. It would probably not even make my top 20 films of the 80's.
For example, I think Lost Boys is way, way better that RB. But that's just me and you're welcome to disagree. I'm not saying it's better filmmaking or better cinematography or anything like that. I just enjoyed that movie much more than RB. It may have something to do with sentimental value.
There are probably several thousand or even million people that prefer Star Wars V and VI over Raging Bull. Or even Back to the Future. Sure they're different types of films but who's to say what genre of film should be the best of any particular decade.
"Where does it belong?"
Not in the top 10 as far as I´m concerned. Probably always found it a bit one-note, just like its protagonist - too tightly stuck in its world of (self) destructive brutality. A masterpiece nevertheless.
"facts are stupid things" - Ronald Reagan
Yeah, but franz, what if a life is one-note? What if a character in a film is tightly stuck in a world of destructive brutality?
Are you saying that film, or any other art form for that matter, needs to embrace some type of redemption, or some type of personal, or thematic change for it to be satisfying?
I know you well enough that you are not begging for a happy ending in this film... But I would imagine that you also understnd that a unrealistic sudden burnout by LaMotta would be equally as disdainful.
Scorsese doesn't pick sides in this one. Jake starts out as somewhat of a jerk.. and ends up as a jerk. It's fairly realistic. Many people don't have life changing moments where they realize the err of their ways... Some do, I admit. Raging Bull immortalizes a guy who started to maybe eventually realize his own mistakes. But he never actually does. That's ok. I haven't realized mine either.
"What if a character in a film is tightly stuck in a world of destructive brutality".
Is he? Anyways, Raging Bull is. Not sure I can necessarily mount any so-called "objective criticism" from this pov, but for me it makes the film, idk, somewhat less giving. That´s the conclusion I´ve come to after 7 viewings. Always felt there´s something missing that´d justify its status as this ultra rare, chosen landmark. It´s very good, of course, but 8,5/10 is the highest I can go when it comes to rating it, as beautiful and poetic as its brutality can be.
"Are you saying that film, or any other art form for that matter, needs to embrace some type of redemption, or some type of personal, or thematic change for it to be satisfying?"
Hell no. And I can´t imagine how the final passages could be any more powerful or satisfying than they already are. Quite possibly, the final sequences are the best part of it all. And I really couldn´t report to you any particular scenes that I feel don´t work... it´s the overall thing that somehow, in vaguely abstract little ways, does not quite "go to eleven" for me.
"Raging Bull immortalizes a guy who started to maybe eventually his own mistakes".
RB is essentially a monument to male insecurity, no more, no less. To me, it doesn´t ever come near the fulfilling perfection of Taxi Driver, its mesmerizing emotional potency, but it´s still a classic for the ages.
"That´s ok, I haven´t realized mine either".
LOL, you ´sound´ like someone who has.
"facts are stupid things" - Ronald Reagan
The reason I like RB more than TD, franz, is because RB is constricted (for the most part), by the facts of La Motta's life. RB is contained by the events that actually happened. It works with what it has.
Taxi Driver is free to spin off into any direction that proves a point, that drives a climactic scene, that sums up a director's point. That's fine. That's what most movies are all about. The director has the film on a tight leash, so that he can unleash his monster at the right time. Taxi Driver unleashes the monster, then pulls him back in, and paints him as a redeeemable, yet still crazy threat at the end.
RB deals with what LaMotta's life has offered. Jake explodes a bit at the end, but he becomes sterilized by the mundane, backlash of reality. He is minimized in almost every way by the time he sits alone in that final scene.
That is most people's life. There is no climactic burnout. No grand finale. People just fade away. Even a bombastic egotist like Jake ends up fawning in the mirror, with no one looking at him but himself.
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........That is most people's life. There is no climactic burnout. No grand finale. People just fade away. Even a bombastic egotist like Jake ends up fawning in the mirror, with no one looking at him but himself.
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Interesting and astute analysis on the character of LaMotta. RAGING BULL is technically excellent and the hard hitting manner in which this unpleasant tale is presented, is what would wow most ardent admirers of this film.....not to mention DeNiro's volatile and intense performance. The issue for me, is why choose the life of a violent, repugnant and insecure character like LaMotta to convey this profound theme?
This is my subjective opinion, but I find the film uninvolving and a chore to sit through and the theme you have mentioned will get lost on many casual viewers. The assaultive presentation could also alienate audiences. It is the B&W cinematography and editing that impress upon me the most— not the proceedings or characters. Had it been shot in color, would the film have the same impact? TAXI DRIVER on the other hand, keeps me engaged, intrigued and even somewhat caring. Although the original intentions of Scorsese and Schrader was for the audience not to identify with Travis Bickle, the reverse happened. The biggest flaw with RB for me, is in the development of LaMotta. There is no real insight into what makes him tick, or is he just a product of his generation and environment possibly? Are we supposed to be just detached observers to his behavior?
As for being considered the 'best' American film of the 80's, the term 'best' again is subjective. RB was also shot in 1979 and almost a year in post production before release. Not that this is really relevant and it is a period piece; but of the 5 films nominated for BP in 1980 I would rate this film 5th place.
I did not like this film.
It's definitely one of em.
You CAN be Catholic and Pro-Abortion.
I'd put this at number 2 in a best of the 80s list. However, it comes behind Once Upon a Time in America, which I believe to be the best ever made. Raging Bull is a film I would put in the top 10 of all time though, so yes, truly great.
'Loneliness has followed me my whole life' - Travis Bickle Taxi Driver
I wish youasked it about 70s :(
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