MovieChat Forums > Solyaris (1972) Discussion > what is this movie trying to say?

what is this movie trying to say?


and What Happened to HARI?
where did she disappear??
was tht SOLARIS planet Feeding IDEAS from HUMANS and trying to Replicate PLANET EARTH?
GOD this was such a DULL and BORING film!


lets just stick to that.... for now.

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What Happened to HARI? Where did she disappear??

Your asking the wrong questions. Ask 'What was Hari?' 'Where did she come from?' 'Was she a figment of someone's imagination, or was she ever truly alive?'

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was tht SOLARIS planet Feeding IDEAS from HUMANS and trying to Replicate PLANET EARTH?

Well, at least that's an interesting question. Certainly the physical manifestations on Solaris were products of the human imagination. But who contacted who? Does Solaris probe our minds when we sleep, or do we travel to Solaris in our dreams? Is Solaris trying to do anything or is it really we who are making the replications? Moreover, is it a conscious effort or a subconscious one?

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GOD this was such a DULL and BORING film!

It's not surprising that you didn't like it, since you don't understand it.

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"It's not surprising that you didn't like it, since you don't understand it. "

You don't have to understand this film fully to enjoy it.

Conversely, you could probably understand most of it, but hate it as well.

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It's not "sci-fi", it's SF!

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Conversely, you could probably understand most of it, but hate it as well.

You cannot hate something your understand.

Your comment betrays your level of self-awareness and knowledge of people in general.

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"You cannot hate something your understand."

Why not?! I understand most of what's going on in football hooliganism, but that doesn't mean I like it.

I also understand colonialism fairly well, but I don't like that either.

"Your comment betrays your level of self-awareness and knowledge of people in general."

Ad hominem...

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It's not "sci-fi", it's SF!

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This film is about existence and how humanity may never truly understand their true purpose.

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You cannot hate something your understand.

AHAHAHAHA!!!! What?! Of course you can! This is where freedom of thought and personal opinions come into play. That's a hilarious statement though!

I'd be inclined to better believe 'you cannot hate something you do not understand'.

We've met before, haven't we?

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You cannot hate something your understand.

Sure you can.

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Have you read the director's statement? "Any concept presented to a viewer indirectly, allegorically and correctly interpreted by him, is closer and dearer to the viewer because it involves his own creativity" - Andrey Tarkovsky

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Unlike the writer of the novel, Tarkovsky emphasized the human-relationship themes more than the science themes regarding the nature of the planet. But the themes are intertwined. I think the movie is about the unknowability of alien life (an idea not acknowledged much in science fiction at the time of the novel and later, the movie) and the limits of science, but also is about the unknowability of those we love and the unknowability of ourselves. We can love someone as much as possible, but how well do we know them? How well do we even understand our own motivations and essence?

There are also questions raised in the movie about the nature of our knowledge of others in our lives. How well do our memories square with who our loved ones, now departed, really were? How can we hold on to the people we love, who inevitably leave us, when our memories and knowledge of them are as imperfect as they are? Did we ever really know the people in our lives - even our close family and friends? Or is some part of them always unknown and unknowable?

There is a lot of discussion in the novel about the many studies done on the planet over many decades by scientists in many fields, with no real progress over all that time in understanding the nature of the planet's intelligence. The same can be said about our knowledge of other people in our lives - and the parallel is brought out in a subtle way in the movie.

My real name is Jeff

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Excellent write-up; I saw this film for the second time last night and would like to share my thoughts. I feel an overwhelming "strange familiarity". Much like the surrealism of Bunuel, the pretense of a space setting highlights the absurdity of what is banal in everyday life. After stripping away juicier plot points, here is what remains: a broken man prepares for an assignment, he meets defensive peers and a familiar woman with whom they share a passionate/tumultuous relationship, there's a party with guest tension, and finally the man suffers a fever that resolves the story. The irony is that the framing of these interactions makes the ordinary seem weird and inscrutable again. It was an artistic achievement to craft a haunting dream out of such mundane parts. The work is cynically anti-solipsistic: even self-knowledge is impenetrable. Thematically, I pair this with Hitchcock's Vertigo much more freely than with Kubrick's 2001.

A man goes to the movies. The critic must be willing to admit that he is that man. -Robert Warshow

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BobbyDupea; a very nice summary.

My view is similar though I relate my interpretation more to other science fiction movies.

1. The God concept and super advanced space aliens;
Kubrick said this about 2001;

KUBRICK: I will say that the God concept is at the heart of 2001 but not any traditional, anthropomorphic image of God...
can you imagine the evolutionary development that much older life forms have taken? ... Their potentialities would be limitless and their intelligence ungraspable by humans.

While Kubrick and Tarkovsky would have different views about God. In terms of super advanced space aliens, their portrayal has similarities.
The intelligence on the Solaris planet is so advanced that it is not able to be grasped by humans.
This is why the cosmonauts on the space station are baffled by what the planet is doing to them.

2. Replica humans and what does it mean to be human?
I have no evidence for this but it seems possible that "Solaris" influenced the story of "Blade Runner" in certain ways.

** Replica humans; accepted or not?
- Prior to "Solaris", the view of replica humans in dramatized SF was often very negative.
There would be a rare science fiction story such as with The Twilight Zone's "The Lonely" (1959) where the replica human was seen in a sympathetic light. But still an actual loving relationship with an artificial human was forbidden so the replica is finally destroyed.
The original Star Trek series came too a similar conclusion in "What Are Little Girls Made Of?" (1966) about artificial human replicas.
- Phillip K. Dick wrote stories about replica humans including; "Imposter" and "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep".
The replica could be an unknowing lethal spy.
Or the replica could be the product of a large company where their replica androids would try to trick 'real' humans. But the replica was a dehumanized copy who should be shunned.

* The story of "Solaris" on the space station is centered on human replicas who are created by the planet Solaris and how the main character, Kelvin, reacts to them.
The replica for Kelvin is Hari, his dead wife who had committed suicide years ago.
- Kelvin's first reaction to replica Hari fits the previous SF stories; rejection.
He fools Hari in getting into a space capsule and launches her into space to be rid of her.
- This is the Phillip K Dick, Twilight Zone, original Star Trek view. Human replicas are fake, they are to be shunned, they are to be destroyed.

But "Solaris" presents a new twist for this replica idea.
The replica Hari comes back!
The shaken Kelvin now has a breakthrough. He begins to accept her and embraces her through the night.
Slowly Kelvin begins to become emotionally attached to Hari. She is not really his wife but in a way she is. He cares for her. And he calls her his 'wife'.

- "Blade Runner" also makes this leap from the replica being the enemy, being shunned and destroyed to a connection between the protagonist, Deckard and the forbidden replicant, Rachel.
They go a step further where the two end the film together in an elevator. A couple who love each other the best way they can.
- Again, I do not know the specific influence of "Solaris" here. But "Solaris" came first with the theme that the replica can be accepted.

** What does it mean to be a human? Memory is part of that.
A perfect wax replica is not a human.
Unless a person is in a coma, a human reacts to some sensory stimuli.
A human has memory whether in the body or mind, verbal or non verbal.

"Solaris" explores humanity and memory.
Hari believes she is human because she has some memories from Kelvin about his wife (through the power of the Solaris planet).
Then Kelvin gives Hari more memories; from home movies of his family and his wife on earth.

In "Blade Runner" the implanting of memories becomes the way that a replica human can become more human.
But are the memories real or fake? But after a while, what does it matter?

In "Solaris" Hari eventually becomes more comfortable in her role as Kelvin's 'wife'. But the crew member Sartorius resists this acceptance of Hari. She is not human he tells her. (Representing the older SF view of replicas.)
Hari's reaction, she kills herself. She is healed but eventually asks the other two cosmonaut / scientists to destroy her.

In "Blade Runner" at the beginning of their knowing each other Deckard tells Rachel that she is not "human". She's just a replica. Rachel emotionally breaks down and Deckard has a slight awareness. Something is happening to these replicas. They have feelings.
Again, "Solaris" led the way.

3. What does it mean to be home?
"2001" has its main character put into what looked like a space alien hotel or zoo.

"Solaris" has another resolution.
Kelvin talks about going back to earth.
The next scene he seems to be back at his father's house (which was seen in the beginning of the movie). The same pond with flowing water. The same trees. The same sky.
He sees his father but it is raining inside the house! But not outside.

Kelvin is not back on earth (he's on the Solaris planet) but is he at home?
While the weather is not right in this alien created house, what if it was?
If a house, land, weather, family were perfectly replicated, couldn't that be home?

4. Back to the God concept;
In "2001', when the main character, Dave Bowman, is dying in bed, he raises his hand and arm towards the monolith who is facing him at the foot of the bed.
This gesture I'm certain comes from painting of the Creation of Adam by Michelangelo where Adam has his arm extended towards God.

In "Solaris", when Kelvin realizes that he is at a replica house with a replica father, he falls to his knees and hugs his father's legs. While his replica father, representing the power and intelligence of the planet Solaris embraces him.

The human in both films is making a human gesture associated with God.

* Music and an overall theme;
- In "2001" the recurring music is Also sprach Zarathustra, or Thus Spoke Zarathustra by R. Strauss.
This relates to Nietzsche's poem by the same name which relates to evolution and the concept of the Overman.

- In "Solaris" the beginning and ending music is by Bach; Ich ruf zu dir, Herr Jesu Christ, or I call to you, Lord Jesus Christ,
Tarkovsky is connecting to a different message compared with Kubrick.
While Kubrick is exploring a scientific definition of God in "2001". Tarkovsky is referencing / connecting the space alien God concept to his Christian faith.

5. The overall odyssey;
"2001 A Space Odyssey" can be seen as being about space aliens affecting human evolution.
Ape meets smart space alien represented by monolith, ape gets smarter and becomes a better killer.
HAL is smarter than the human crew but it eventually outwitted by a human Dave.
Dave is captured by the space aliens and is transformed into something new; a grand step in evolution in the direction I assume of the smarter aliens represented by the monolith.
- Intelligence can be seen as the key in this progression.

* "Solaris" is also an Odyssey for Kelvin but it is of emotion, wonder and acceptance.
Kelvin began to have feelings for the replica of his dead wife. While the two other crew members disagreed, Kelvin did not give up on the emotional connection he had for Hari.
- At the end, when Kelvin is at the replica house and kneels before the replica father he is submitting to the godlike power of the planet Solaris.
Kelvin is accepting what the planet can given him; a home, a father, even maybe bringing back his dead wife.
- Kelvin's odyssey is of a man in emotional pain of grief who wants to accept that a godlike power can bring back what was taken away by death.
- Emotional evolution can be seen as the key in this progression.

* One thing left about "Solaris" is the the replica human story had a potential which had not been explored in dramatized science fiction before. And the door that "Solaris" opened led to new possibilities for the replica human whether in "Blade Runner" or in "A.I." (Spielberg's film based on a story developed by Kubrick).

Imo at least, BB ;-)

it is just in my opinion - imo - 🌈

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Who cares?

This film was extremely DULL, BORING, incomprehensible and pretentious, especially that absurd driving scene early in the film. It just went on and on and on and on.. Was Tarkovsky deliberately trying to put us to sleep? I could hardly keep my eyes open.

Btw, did I mention that it was REALLY DULL?

Schrodinger's cat walks into a bar, and / or doesn't.

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Dull, okay, I understand, boring and incomprehensible, sure, if you thought so. But PLEASE, stop calling it pretentious. This film is incredibly subtle and pretty poetic, never does it become pretentious.

http://letterboxd.com/guccipix/list/my-top-100-favorite-films/

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