Personally, I think this is the best film I have ever seen. For those who have seen this film, can you name a film that you consider superior to this one?
Also, does anyone know any information about a director's cut that is longer? According to imdb.com, it says that there is a 147 minute version compared to the so called "milestone restored special edition?" which is only roughly longer than two hours?
a film superior to Woman In The Dunes? that's a tough one. I'd definitely recommend Onibaba by Kaneto Shindo, that came out the same year. It recently got a Criterion DVD release. similar themes of isolation and sexuality, but with a more supernatural twist. it's fantastic, but i couldn't say it was superior.
if you ever get the chance, read the novel of Woman In The Dunes by Kobo Abe. it is, like the movie, awesome.
Hey, thanks for the suggestion, I will for sure check out Onibaba. It looks interesting.
Thanks again. :)
Be warned that Onibaba has some strong violent scenes.
Otherwise it is a great movie.
I saw this movie in college...around 1982/3. I found it to be the worst movie I had ever seen at the time, so I could name many movies that I thought were superior. Unfortunately, I really don't remember much about it.
shareyou are, of course, entitled to your opinion, but i fail to see the point of going to the message board for a movie you saw in 1982 and hated to point that out.
shareYoung people who are still in college still don't have a fully developed brain, and haven't experienced enough of great cinematography to have a full appreciation. Think of all the low budget, B films, soft porn, action, and stunt films (unending use of stuntmen doing the seemingly impossible) that Hollywood produces. Those genres are geared towards getting youngster into the seats where they can stare in amazement at the: the chase scenes, the half naked women, and the McGuffin while they chat with their dates, or more in the present day, to text their friends. In other words, exactly the wrong audience to sit through any English-subtitled foreign film directed by Teshigahara or Kurosawa. I can't imagine myself back in Technical School having sat through this movie with a group of friends since for example I recall a group of us going to see ''Rollerball'' when it first came out and I took time out DURING the movie to visit the refreshment stand and also purchased a Rollerball t-shirt (black with white letters) that were on sale in the lobby.
So, as I've gotten older I find myself eagerly checking Turner Classic Movies for any foreign films, especially the older ones, and I'm tickled that with the advent of digital recording availability on cable, I can never miss one. Last night I saw that TCM was showing ''Woman in the Dunes'' with a 4 Star Rating blurb no less at 1:45 AM and I set the recording and a reminder. I made it through the first hour and a half before I started nodding off and simply turned the box off knowing that in the morning I could continue watching at the moment it was paused.
I also have an appreciation for old English subtitled war films like ''Flame and Citron'' and simply go to one of the searchable online databases to check for the next airing on my cable company with the site sending me an email in advance. Ain't technology great.
You can get the director's cut imported from Japan.
Check here for more details: http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film/dvdcompare/womaninthedunes.htm
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"That's f--king crazy man"
IMDB has someone listed as the "Entomologist's wife (in flashbacks)" in their credits. I presume that these flashbacks make up some of what was cut as I can't remember seeing any flashbacks or any mention of a wife in the version I saw.
I have to comment on the ending. I loved the film but at the very end I was saying to myself "don't *beep* up the ending, just don't *beep* it up" and what did they do they had a terrible end. I wasn't looking for a happy end just for an end that made sense. The man's decision at the end is way too idiotic to be explained away. Up till then the film was brilliant which only made me angrier as a result. Anyone else feel the same?
hey antwalsh,
i am not sure about the ending. but if it's happy end, i would be dissappointed. but on the other side a happy end from this beginning is something very strong, too.
The man's reaction is not 'too idiotic to be explained away'. He has spent x number of months in a hole in the ground. He has become acclimatised to living in a hole. He has started a relationship (however strange and abusive) with the woman in the hole. There is a psycological phenomonon called 'Stockholm syndrome' where kidnapped victims fall in love with and abet their kidnappers.
It is not strange at all, but human nature to cling to the known quantities and fear the new. After spending x months in a hole, the outside world may lose it's appeal
Disclaimer- Pete does not recommend spending x number of months in a hole in the ground just to escape the outside world. It's probably not good for you to breathe sand all the time, and despite what we've seen in this film, it's probably not a good pulling technique.
True that the man has spent x number of months living in a hole. But that's after approximately 2x or 3x number of years of not living in that hole. I fail to see how that can really qualify as an "unknown quantity".
I'd also disagree that it's human nature to fear the new. Human nature is conservative and inquisitive in (un)equal parts; witness the reservoir experiments in the film itself for evidence of the latter.
There are two reasons I feel that he decides to stay in the hole:
After x months living in the hole without rescue, he begins to feel that the outer world has rejected him, so - almost in retaliation - he turns his back on the outer world. His reaction to the radio is a good example.
The man's original ambition is to discover a new breed of insect and get his name in an encyclopedia. During his entrapment he recognises the meaninglessness of that original aspiration, and comes to realise that in this microcosm that the hole represents he can rise to greater things than he could ever achieve in the world outside, namely through the production of water in the pits. There are further issues within this point also; this epiphany has followed the slow onset of madness in which water is elevated to an ethereal level. He dreams of being recognised for producing this celestial liquid - an achievement far outweighing his previous desire to find a bug that no one has ever found before, which is a bit lame by comparison. Few of us will achieve anything extraordinary or groundbreaking in our humdrum lives. The man in the film has an opportunity to do so. So he stays.
I'm with you on the pulling though. Although it might make the process easier. Especially for the kind of person who chooses ColonelPuke as their ID.
ColonelPuke, I can agree with you on every point you make, however I can only agrees so much and I can't agrees no more.
The radio is what the woman decides he needs to forget the outside world. He offers it to her when she miscarries, but for her the outside world has no meaning or appeal. Therefore she rejects it. She has worked a long time making money to buy the radio for him. This is her labour of love for him. When he attempts to give the radio to her, this is almost a rejection of her love. As we can see throughout the film, she means very little to him.
You say his ambition becomes to produce water, but the village already has water. He says in the film that he took up entomology as it was the most useless act he could think of. I think he eschews the life of an academic to pursue what is an even more pointless endevour. i.e pushing back the dunes with only a shovel and finding a new way of making water in a place that already has ample of this 'celestial liquid'(to be pedantic, the water is coming from the ground, not the skies so 'celestial' is in fact incorrect, it's terrestrial. Likewise 'ethereal', but I'll stop there. Its a short step from pedantry to pederasty and no-one wants to be going down that route).
So in fact, most of us may experience more worthwhile activities than making water. But in his world view, when they imprisonned him the hole, they actually open him to the fulfillment of his dream.
But I agree with you, ColonelPuke is not a great pulling name or indeed a great porn name. Have you thought about changing your name to WeLoveUnicorns?
Yes, so the radio represents her love. I understand that. I still feel that his attempt to return the radio to her means he rejects the outside world. As well as her.
The man is in a hole. Water is lowered down to him. From above. Celestial liquid stands I think. That aside, the point I was trying to make - perhaps clumsily - is that what the man finds in the pit is purpose. In the outer world he realises he is something of a nonentity (this is reinforced in his mind by the lack of a rescue party). In this new world he can be important. He has found a way of getting water. No longer will the villagers have to control the supply of water. He can provide a little more autonomy to all the people living in the pits. He will be recognised and lauded. You say this yourself much more eruditely than I could - "in his world view, when they imprisoned him the hole, they actually open him to the fulfillment of his dream." The experience of making water is not at issue; it's the *achievement*.
At what point in the film does he say he took up entomology as it was the most useless act he could think of? I'm pretty sure that that claim was made around the same time as he burnt his insect collection, which is when the madness really takes hold.
Small misunderstandings and miscomprehensions aside, I like what you're saying.
These nicknames are an important and often pretentious thing, and a great deal of time and care should be afforded to them. I thought about using the name WeLoveUnicorns, but I decided that sounded a bit too wet and care-beary. SexyGuy56 I also considered, but I don't think the name gave any indication to the complex subtleties psychosomatically intrinsic to my inner self. Plus it kind of looks like there are 55 other guys sexier than me, which is obviously rubbish. What made you choose mouldyman? I hope you don't suffer from leprosy.
Actually I can't argue with anything you say there, like the French nation collapsing in the face of the German invasion, so my objections have folded in the face of your explanations. It may be because I am so goddam tired after the weekend, it may be your polymathic debate, it may be that the quantity of alcohol consumed over the weekend has melted my brain, but I think you're right. Even about the celestial liquid, which hints to me you're clutching at straws but I'll go with it.
He mentions about entomology when he first starts to shovel the sand. In this scene the woman asks him why he took up science and he replies that it was the most useless thing he could think of to do.
Unicorns are not wet and care-beary. They've got massive horns on their heads. They're one of the most dangerous animals known to man. I certainly wouldn't want to meet one in a dark alley.
Horses with horns, it's the most threatening combination I can think of. It's like giving a monkey a gun.
The only thing worse is giving a carebear a sharp stick.
Surprisingly, my real name is not actually 'Mouldyman'. It is in fact a made up pseudonym. Call me crazy.
My name comes from a mixture of ancient arabic and hawaiian. 'Moul' meaning 'sexy guy' and 'dyman' meaning '56'. I don't know how you would say that in English though.
Are you a military man then?
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And if I were Isuldur I would have thrown the Ring right into the Crack of Doom when I had the chance!
And if I were Dorothy, I wouldn't go back to Kansas!
And if I were C. F. Kane I would learn how to love other people...and I wouldn't fall for that Susan during the election...and I would tell somebody about my old sled!
If you are just a kid, take this as a gentle prodding at your sense of humor. If old enough to legally drive, may the Wizard give you a good brain!
I actually think the ending was perfect.
It is just him: realizing.
In the end, he is given free choice to leave. He climbs the ladder and goes to the sea. This is where the full existential understating of his situation hits him. He has grown to care and love for the Woman (he calls the townspeople to help her, and treats her affectionately). With the realization that she is about to (or might) have his baby, he accepts his situation, and takes comfort in it. The radio (yes it might be her love to him) almost seems un-interesting to him. In the pit, he doesn't have to worry about having all the right papers and id cards, in the pit he is a man. In the pit he feels his humanity.
Actually this ending reminds me a bit of the ending to 1984, but even more so to the real-life story of the man the movie The Terminal was based off of. In real-life the man was trapped at the De Gaulle airport in France for several years due to several layers of red tape. When he was finally allowed to leave the airport, he wouldn't. Psychologically, after living in the airport for so long, he became dependent on it. It became his world.
shareBying from Amazon japan gives you the official Asmik release in great condition. It will be about $55 with shipping but hey...it's "Woman in the Dunes" (I recomend this option). getting it on ebay is $25 or so and will be an illegal bootleg of the Asmik, which plays fine but does not have menus and you can't chose between the director's cut and the original version. Also, subtitles can only be slected from the DVD remote. It's fine and plays well, but I have a friend who got the DVD from ebay and the disc was in a bad case, but scratched and would not play without defects. My Amazon japan order was in perfect condition. Excellent movie.
As for other great films...it depends what you consider and what you like. If you like "Woman in the Dunes", you'll probably love "The Face of Another" also by Tashegihara, although I have not seen it yet. I also could not stop thinking of Bergman's "Persona" having wathched "Woman in the Dunes". The two film are similar in their abstract concepts. Also a brilliant film, one of the best.
Yes I can think of two Japanese films of the same quality, but better ? who can say. ;Fires on the plain, by Kon Ichikawa and Ugetsu, by mizoguchi
share[deleted]
I just saw a print at a local theater that was 147 minutes long. I know the Milestone version is 123 minutes long, but I haven't seen it so I can't compare it.
shareSee, if you gotta see two asian movies, arguably and only two: only two can make it to the list: Women in the Dunes -- Onibaba, neck to neck.
Both of them STAND OUT.
And someone said Onibaba has violent scenes: hey, what about the sex scenes of the kind we dont't even expect these day? Certainly much ahead of their time.