How many times does one of Sam's relatives have to turn him into something or cast a spell before he learns to keep his temper in check and shut his mouth?
He doesn't even try to get along with them most of the time - especially in the Sargent episodes. He's combative the second he sees them.
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Wow. Two people in a row who clearly don't get the show. Darrin was far
from dumb. What he was is something called "character." He and Sam
made the agreement that they would live mortal lives. Virtually
every one of Sam's relatives - mostly Endora - disrespected and disrupted
their lives. He had balls and stood up to them. Yet Endora repeatedly
barged in, threatened his employment and insulted him in front of his
growing children.
Could he be pigheaded? Of course! In more than a few episodes, it's Darrin
who has to apologize to Sam, and even Endora. At least he did so
honestly, as opposed to Endora's "I regret my slight transgression of this
morning, however deserved."
The show worked because we knew WHY Sam loved him. And it still works.
Darrin isn't the "dumb" one around here.
Virtually every one of Sam's relatives - mostly Endora - disrespected and disrupted their lives. He had balls and stood up to them. Yet Endora repeatedly barged in, threatened his employment and insulted him in front of his growing children.
And a lot of those things probably wouldn't have happened if he didn't insult them the minute they got there. There are some episodes where he is antagonistic toward them before they say anything to him. He gets turned into something, is humiliated, then changed back. And what does he do? Insults them again. And again, he's turned into something.
That's not character, that's not learning from your mistakes. Which is very dumb.
Al - Alicia
An - Andrew
Jo - Joseph
Be - Benjamin
Try watching the show. It is Endora who shows up UNANNOUNCED, without even
knocking on the door. That's how the episodes start. Endora's blatant
disrespect for him was nothing short of atrocious.
I realize we're discussing an old situation comedy here, but BW was produced
and angled for us to root for Sam and Darrin's marriage - NOT Endora's
total lack of respect and acceptance for her daughter's marriage. The
brilliance lay in Endora's revealing what was so flawed about human beings.
And, yes, Darrin was flawed - he was SUPPOSED to be, for heaven's sake.
It is a tremendous compliment to both the writers and Moorehead that we, as
viewers, howled at these situations, but the fact remains that Darrin had
guts and stood by the courage of his convictions. Other than Sam, he was
surrounded by intruding in-laws, greedy co-workers and often slimy clients.
But his general grace, good manners and character always stood out,
particularly when York played the role.
For you to TITLE a thread "How dumb is Darren?" (it's spelled "DARRIN", btw)
says more about your lack of knowledge of both the series and human
nature in general.
Try watching the fourth offering, "Mother-Meets-What's-His-Name." Darrin makes
the effort to warmly greet Endora. She's instantly distant, disrespectful
and threatening. Yet in the end, he stands up to her, as he did upon
meeting Maurice.
gbennet is a PIG
DIscuss the show on a discussion board properly and stop acting like a raging BITCH.
L1- Holy crap! How does name calling and being dismissive add to a discussion? Stop acting like a child.
I agree that Darrin could have been more tactful at times knowing that his mother-in-law could turn him into a toad. But he had more pride and guts than that. Endora showed up unannounced and proceeded to insult him.
I've put myself in Darrin's shoes and wondered what that would be like. My ( now ex) husband's parents were already deceased when we met. So I didn't have to deal with in-laws. But I wondered...if my mother-in-law was already in the kitchen in the early morning when I entered and was full of snarky comments and insults, how would I have reacted? After a while, not too well.
Darrin makes a comment to Sam after one of those "morning meetings", "A man is entitled to his privacy!"
So true. People have commented about how rude it was for Gladys Kravitz to just barge in. Well, Endora did the same thing...repeatedly.
He fights the good fight. Unfortunately it's like me fighting Mike Tyson.
shareHe fights the good fight. Unfortunately it's like me fighting Mike Tyson.
Had Endora showed more initial and consistent respect, I believe Darrin
would've bended more.
Still, in season eight's "The Warlock in the Grey Flannel Suit" I think
Darrin should've agreed to travel with Sam - even by witchcraft - to
Hong Kong the following weekend for Panda's wedding. It was important to
Sam, as she and Panda had been so close. Or at least have Darrin give in
to go in the tag of this offering.
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I understand what you're saying. Although "dumb" may not be the accurate word. I'm reminded of the phrase "would you rather be right or happy?" He is unnecessarily combative, but if he wasn't what would the writers use to base episodes on? I feel this was one of the things that ultimately made the show somewhat predictable which in turn contributed to a decline in the show's ratings. Because Darrin is smart why didn't he learn how to act around his mother-in-law like most married men? The blame lies square on the writers.
share"Unnecessarily combative??????" He's defending his home against, a rude,
insulting, unwelcome group of relatives, especially his mother-in-law.
It is ENDORA who should "learn how to" RESPECFULLY act around her son-
in-law, daughter AND her grandchildren.
Calling someone "dumb" because they stand up for what they believe in in
their own home takes guts, not stupidity.
Dumb is not a word to use in this situation. There are times when Darrin was a bit abrasive...but most of the time it was due to what his life had become thanks to Samantha's family. If he had kept his mouth shut it would have made him a wimp. He NEEDED to stand up to them. It was HIS home and they should have respected that, but very often they did not. Do you get that?
American Horror Story Season 6: Donald Trump
These people (including the OP) are not going to "get it", so it's better
I guess to leave the series and its premise to people who DO get it.
My only regret in "Mother Meets What's His Name" is when Darrin uses the words "hocus-pocus" (or something to that effect) when describing how he and Sam wish to leave without magic. That deeply offended Endora, who countered "What is normal to you, young man, is asinine to us". I guess that could be taken by Endora as a slur against the witches way of life and culture.
I do think that Endora had atleast some grudging respect for Darrin (even though there were the continuing spells, pranks, etc) because she knew that he did indeed stand up to her. In seasons 1 and 2, the Darrin/Endora relationship wasn't as negative as in the color seasons. I actually prefer the Seasons 1 & 2 relationship. It had more texture and levels than the color eps, where they bickered continually. They actually got along several times.
I think it's fascinating that in the "Vapor Lock" episode, Endora grins at Sam at one point and says "What would your husband do without us?"
I agree with GBennett that Darrin should have gone to the wedding in "Gray Flannel Suit", owing to Sam's friendship with Panda. There are many times that I think Darren and Endora could have "worked together" when they had differing opinions. Darrin had his principles, and at the same time Endora didn't like to see the heritage neglected. I can see both sides, which is a tribute to the writing and acting.
Please, Endora had it out for him anyway, and was LOOKING to be offended. He
couldn't have said anything right.
Yes, it would've been a nice ice breaker after all the years of tension, had
Darrin said "Yes" to Hong Kong. Had it been included in the tag that Darrin
had changed his mind and was up for going...how much of a SHOT IN THE ARM
and general growth for the series it would've been.
I actually prefer the Seasons 1 & 2 relationship. It had more texture and levels than the color eps, where they bickered continually. They actually got along several times.
I just saw that episode again yesterday and he also uses the word "nonsense" which very much offended her and Samantha jumps in and tries to say he didn't mean that the way it sounded. Yeah that was an insult to say that who they are is nonsense since he was referring to the powers they have as nonsense. But true as I watched I saw his trying to make the effort upon meeting her. He was happy to see how she looked but from the moment she came in she had that air of attitude and was really trying to push him to the point of standing up for himself. I did think she had a point though when she asked him why he does not accept her daughter for who she is.
shareWhy? She won't accept her son-in-law for who HE is.
shareWell of course that is a given for as time goes on we continually see that, but also in this episode it is the first time they ever met each other and she was not giving him a chance at all from the start. I of course was more angry with her at all the bad things she did to him over the course of the show which I felt were so unwarranted. I was just saying in general that is a point about not accepting someone for who they are because a lot of us experience that in life and people want us to change or give up something in order to please them. Endora apparently does not realize that she is just as guilty of not accepting him for who he is as she thinks he is about not accepting her daughter for who she is. At this point in the show she doesn't even really know him yet.
shareI'm not so sure about that. I get the impression that Endora would be much more willing to accept Darrin for "who he is," if he didn't have such a blanket and unyielding prejudice and contempt toward witches and witchcraft.
I also think Endora had every reason to be furious and deeply hurt by what Darrin and Samantha had done, primarily Samantha. She was Endora's only child, she knew how hurt, shocked and angry her mother would be at what she'd done, yet she met, dated and married this man without a word to anyone. Despite the fact that she supposedly had a loving relationship with her parents, Samantha doesn't let them know what she's up to, and she lets Darrin in for a life of grief and torment because she doesn't make any effort to "clear the air" before they marry.
As for Darrin, I agree that when they meet for the first time, he's initially gracious to Endora despite her thinly veiled disdain and anger towards him, but I don't think 5 minutes (at the most) of civility toward her is nearly enough time to try to try to make her accept him. Believe it or not, it can take weeks, months, even years to win over a disapproving/angry in-law, and if Endora wasn't going to make the effort , for Samantha's sake, it was up to Darrin to try, and he didn't.
Sorry, the show is clearly angled romantically to have the audience
root for Darrin and Sam, despite his faults.
Her total lack of respect for him is (comically) angled from the
very beginning, and would remain so for the run of the entire series.
Endora was rude, insulting, belittling and meddlesome. Even in front
of the kids as they grew up.
SAM and DARRIN "made an agreement" that living the mortal way was
how they intended to live their lives. And Endora - and others - caused
them nothing but grief thereafter.
Interestingly, in the Season 2 episode "Double Tate" (where Endora grants Darrin three wishes for his birthday) - Sam makes a comment to Endora: "Oh, you know you're fond of him". Were the writers trying to tell us that Endora did have a respect / fondness for Darrin underneath all the mischief?
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The times I didn't like when Darrin was rude to a relative was when it involved Aunt Clara. He wasn't openly hostile towards her, but he would make faces and grumble to Sam when she arrived. She was always very warm towards him.
But then I had to think: though she meant well, there was always trouble for him when she appeared. After all, it was because of her that he ended up in the street in nothing but his underwear and arrested for indecent exposure; almost burned at the stake in 17th century Salem; had his home flooded with soap suds, and many more incidents.
I guess I'd grumble and be cautious when she appeared to, no matter how sweet.
His in-laws all treat him like crap, and are annoying as hell. He's completely justified in not liking them and not wanting them in his house. It's really insensitive of Samantha to take it for granted that he should put up with all their shit.
shareTowards the later Dick Sargeant seasons---Endora somewhat warms up and he even goes to her for help with things....which requires using witchcraft.
Yes being called names by relatives would put both sides in a bad mood. Not being called names by your relatives would be a reasonable request.
He likes Aunt Clara and then Esmerelda but they both botched spells--and it creates problems. the problems are what make him grumble. If they did not do this, he'd probably love them
They both did not seem to mind him being a mortal--never called him anything bad.
I was amused when I saw this subject line because I was almost expecting a heap of 'Darren is so dumb' jokes. Like, How Dumb is Darren ? Darren is so dumb he thinks you have a left and right sock, etc.
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