MovieChat Forums > How Green Was My Valley (1942) Discussion > Why 'Green' won over 'Citizen Kane'??? ...

Why 'Green' won over 'Citizen Kane'??? A theory

posted 16 years ago by movie-viking
60 replies | jump to latest

My opinion is that in the late 1930's to early 1940's, some of the winning films like "How Green Was My Valley" won because (in part) they caught the mood, and the fears of Americans who could see the tentacles of war (World War II) coming closer and cloer to ENSNARE them and their family (notably - their young SONS).

Brilliant as "Citizen Kane" was, I suspect the tie breaker for some Oscar votors was - that "How Green Was My Valley" showed outside forces pulling apart a family. And despite some physical separations - the family seemed to stil be one.

Dad, Mom, the kids - especially the young males - even before Pearl Harbor - could strongly suspect that they, too, would soon be drawn in.

(Polls taken by the US Gov't - as seen in some Frank Capra Why We Fight series - show the US change in attitude...)

This is my "historical context" theory.

[–] ColinChapman 11 years ago

What OP says is plausible. Kudos to him/her.

As for the others arguing if it's better or worse than "Citizen Kane" (not mentioning "The Maltese Falcon" at all) get a hold of yourselves. They were both good movies unlike certain other years when utter tripe was nominated and in some cases even managed to win over far better movies. How Titanic managed to win the best picture Oscar is anybody's guess...

In later years some movies land a nomination only to boost the ratings of the show.

"Argo" winning the best picture Oscar certainly makes one believe that the political climate and historical context still plays a role today.

[–] rkind1025 11 years ago

It's the emotional connection. HGWMV grabs the heart immediately. Citizen Kane takes a while to sink in and be appreciated. I find that the Academy usually goes for the film with the most heart. That is the first reaction you have to most anything. If they went back and voted on films from the past, the outcome would be different. Actually, that would be a fascinating thing to do...have today's academy member vote on films from previous years.

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[–] joystar5879 11 years ago

The most important reason?

IT WAS BETTER!!

"I do hope he won't upset Henry.."

[–] Moon_and_New_York_City 10 years ago

Well it is on TCM tonight, so I'm finally going to watch it. One of the few Best Pictures I haven't seen. I always hated Citizen Kane; to me it was just one big snooze. But then again - Some Like It Hot is considered the greatest film comedy ever, and I have watched it several times without so much as a chuckle.

I like the OP theory however. I do see some wins as very much a statement of the times: like Harold Russell winning not one, but two, Oscars for the same performance ....because he was a disabled veteran.

Still, nothing wrong with that kind of sentiment. That's what makes the Academy Awards so purely Americana.

"the best that you can do is fall in love"

[–] mortycausa 10 years ago

Some good points here. I actually think that How Green Was My Valley is the better movie finally. It's a more mature view of life. Citizen Kane is great, of course, and brilliant, but it a way all its brilliance is on the surface. Ford's movie has depth. It, too, has stunning visual images. The boy in the mine shaft singing out for his father. The image of the searchers as they rise from the mine shaft to the waiting women in black, with the dead father in the arms of his boy. That great compositional piece of the wedding--Maureen O'Hara leaving her spouse at the altar, coming toward the viewer to reveal a face filled with terror as the man she loves strides across the walkway in the far background, stops and looks down upon the scene, as it culminates with O'Hara's husband joining her in the carriage, and as they drive off in the foreground you see that man, still in the far background (you never a close up), she loves simply retrace his steps on that walk way. Just inspired compositional sense and imagery.

[–] thesnowleopard 9 years ago

I have to agree with those that say How Green Was My Valley won over Citizen Kane simply because it was a better film. And this is coming from someone who prefers The Maltese Falcon over both.

I saw Citizen Kane a while back and feel no desire to watch it again. It was cold and boring and self-absorbed. When they revealed the mystery behind "Rosebud," I felt nothing. It may be technically dazzling, but it fails on the levels of both entertainment and emotional involvement.

HGWMV, on the other hand, is a film that I often find twee and overly sentimental, but when they haul that boy up with his dead father in his arms, I *always* feel for that kid.

Plus, HGWMV's central theme is much bigger and deeper than CK's. CK is a bildungsroman about a boy who grows up to become rich and powerful, but loses touch with himself in the process. HGWMV starts with a similar young protagonist, but sets his coming of age against the massive and still-largely-unremarked ethnic cleansing perpetrated on the Welsh in the waning days of the British Empire. It's still relevant today. If anything, it's *more* relevant. Welles satirizing Hearst? Not so much, even bringing the big media moguls of the 12st century into it.

Innsmouth Free Press http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com

[–] jhpen22 9 years ago

I agree with thesnowleopard and others who see this as superior to CK. Almost everything has been said by now, so I'll confine my comments to one aspect of the film. I've spent over six decades as an amateur photographer, most of it trying to make the best black and white prints I could. I'd give a lot to have made one image as good as almost any frame of this movie. It's breathtaking. This is the film that convinced me of John Ford's greatness. Of course, cinematographer Arthur Charles Miller deserves great credit, too, and he received it in the form of an Oscar. Throughout the film, composition is inspired (Ford). Furthermore, it's very difficult to get such deep, dark values and such highlights as Miller gets in many shots without blowing out the high values (Ford/Miller). When I think of movies in which almost every frame is a work of art, this, The Leopard, and Red (Kieślowski)are films that come immediately to mind. By contrast, CK relies heavily on camera tricks that nobody had previously mastered. I admire it because the distorted perspectives parallels the warped main character and his story. Still, I'd rather watch, and would much rather have made, How Green Was My Valley. CK is a tour-de-force; HGWMV is a work of art. I really don't care if I never see CK again, but I could watch HGWMV over and over.