MovieChat Forums > Joker (2019) Discussion > What has become of humanity...

What has become of humanity...


...when they now make movies like Suicide Squad, Venom, Joker, etc. encouraging us to root for the bad guys?

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If it makes you feel better, those are niche films. Their sole purpose is to make money and to cater to fans of those types of characters. Not everyone is gonna wanta watch (I certainly didn't) but for some twisted reason, some people like the villains in some franchises. It's one of the stranger aspects of human nature, to admire certain traits villainous characters (or even real life people) have.

Truth be told, such films are gonna be forgotten by most people. Most movie-goers prefer stories where the good guy wins, the bad guy loses, and good prevails over all. They won't be upset if the bad guy gives the good guy a reason to come back in another movie just to triumph over them again, so long as the story makes sense.

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If all movies were about good guys winning and justice being served it would get tedious and unoriginal.

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It's more fun when you don't make the heroes perfect, show more than one side to the villain, make the heroes work at saving the world, make the story unpredictable, and do some character development. That's missing from way too many movies/tv shows these days.

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True but I like my movies to reflect reality and we all know that good always triumphs in the real world.

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Quite the contrary, I don't root for Joker. At all.

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Society is morally bankrupt, now, mostly thanks to Democrats, Marxists, and Communists.

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Republicans have virtually been in power since the early 80's. Times were much better when Democrats controlled Congress and The Senate from the 1930's through the 1970's. I agree that the Democrats suck now, but the Republicans are just as bad or worse.

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The Democrats too often get a free pass considering their uniquely despicable history. Democrats wanted to get involved in WWI (Wilson), WWII (FDR) (in fact, the only human (Truman) to order a nuclear weapon to be used during wartime, twice, against civilian populations was a Democrat), Korea (Truman), and Vietnam (JFK, LBJ). Let's also not forget the link between the KKK and the Democratic Party; not in the way that the Republicans are currently tarnished due to the few remaining KKK members, but an actual deep connection between membership and the party.

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Both the Democrats and Republicans are not the parties they once were. Both have had good periods and bad periods. Right now, to me, they are both despicable. I have no idea who I will vote for next year. If it is Biden and Trump, I would vote for Trump. If it is Bernie and Trump, I would vote for Bernie(even though a few of his ideas are not agreeable to me).

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dffdf

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It's usually the Republicans who say using a nuclear bomb to end the war was morally right. Are you now saying it wasn't? So sick of the Democrat/KKK stuff. As if things don't change. Where are the racists now? Do you think today's KKK are a bunch of Hillary supporters?

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Yes, that is true. I don't think you would be able to find one Hillary supporter in the KKK.

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true

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Humanity was always like this.

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Just because the bad guys take the lead in all these movies, doesn't mean they're all comparable. In Venom and Suicide Squad they're portrayed as anti-heroes more than anything and have some sort of redemption arc. In Joker he certainly doesn't get any of that, nor do I feel like the audience is supposed to root for him. We can feel empathetic for the struggles someone goes through without condoning their actions. Joker is a cautionary tale.

All that being said, it's nothing new. A Clockwork Orange, American Psycho, and Taxi Driver are all older movies where the protagonist isn't necessarily the good guy.

Not only that, but for years now people have been tuned in to serial killer documentaries and stuff of that nature. Most people don't do it because they're rooting for the killers, but because the mentality behind these things can be fascinating.

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I certainly wasn't rooting for the Wall Street scum on the train either or Thomas Wayne who cut funding for people who need mental health. Aren't the Wall Street scum and Thomas Wayne just as bad as Joker? Don't they destroy as many or more lives than some villain does? Something to ponder.

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They are not as bad as Joker. Though they are a holes they do not deliberately kill people. They may not think about the consequences of their actions but they are not going out and stabbing people or shooting people (though the Wall Street scum did so and got what they deserved).

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I think many Wall Street scum and Thomas Wayne individuals do realize that there are grave consequences to their actions, but they just don't care. Many of them seem to take pleasure in having a part in the suffering of others. In some ways what they do is worse, because there generally is a long period of suffering that is endured before the person succumbs. To me, that is worse.

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Scarface, Chinatown, No Country for Old Men, The Usual Suspects, Smokey and the Bandit, Beetlejuice, Ocean 11, The entire Fast in the Furious franchise, Godzilla... I could keep going, all those are films where your'e kinda rooting for the bad guys.

Do you even watch movies?

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The Fast and the Furious even had a police officer turning into and joining a gang of bandits.

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Exactly! I think I would have listed those same exact movies as well 😂

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Sorry but I never rooted for the guy who is making farmers destitute, stealing land, natural resources and the daughter he incestuously fathered with his raped daughter in Chinatown. Maybe you did.

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Joe Pesci in Goodfellas...? He commits the most horrific acts of violence and yet is still somehow likeable, and almost an iconic 'bad guy people love to hate'.

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No I never rooted for that character.

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Millions did...

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Except Martoto.

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Oh you burned me good there.

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Millions rooted for him to do what?

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"Someone on TV told me to be outraged about this!"

*cues outrage*

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