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Theory regarding the Faction and last episode of season 1 (spoilers)

posted 8 years ago by scorenow16-1
47 replies | jump to latest

In the season 1 finale, we are told that after preventing Helios 685 the Travelers created a new timeline where a faction fights against the director deciding humanities fate. So in this episode Grace informs the team about the Faction and war in the future, the team is unaware of the Faction(due to altering the timeline), and Grace also states that it was the Faction that abducted the team in Episode 5 "Room 101." If you listen to that whole dialogue at the end of Episode 12 "Grace" it would appear as if the Faction was only created after the team prevented Helios 685; however, Marcy, Carly, Trever,and Philip were abducted in Episode 5 and Helios 685 wasn't prevented till the next episode.

So the question is who abducted Marcy, Carly, Trever, and Philip in episode 5 if the Faction was only created after preventing Helios 685? My theory is that it was the Director sent back in time in the season 1 finale who kidnapped them. We know the director is able to send itself and others back in time and if the timeline was altered then the director would not be aware of the teams original mission (to prevent Helios 685). Furthermore, Grace reset the Director prior to the Director's arrival in the 21st Century. This could help explain why the monitor kept asking "what is your mission" and "when are you from" in the abduction episode.

The question then became how could the Director exist in the future if the reason for its existence was to prevent Helios 685 (which was prevented)? The Director was programed to be God and therefore would need to exist in every scenario. Therefore, it would need to calculate both a means to prevent Helios 685)and also maintain its existence and survival in an alternate timeline.

Another theory I have is that Grace was actually on the side of the Faction and the little girl was on the side of the director. The show went out of its way in the last two episodes of season 1 to illustrate Grace's human emotions through an abundance of overacting. I found it annoying at first until I saw the juxtaposed lack of personality and emotion of the little girl after she was taken over. The little girl was robotic, like a terminator or agent from the Matrix.

I think the missions the team received after Episode 6 came from the Faction in an effort to prevent the director controlling the future of humanity. Grace and Ellis's missions was to save the future by resetting the Director and bringing it to the past in an attempt to control it and guide humanity to a brighter future. However, this had the opposite effect and only created that which they hoped to destroy.

Let me know your thoughts.

[–] Corky666 8 years ago

That was about the MOST preposterous combination of drivel I have EVER read. Just shut up

[–] Agent_of_SQUIDD 8 years ago

Seemed like a well thought out essay to me. Got any response to his ideas or you just feel like being a d-bag today?

"Debating a troll is like trying to play chess with a pigeon..." — Modified Quote

[–] Sluggr-3 8 years ago

Corky666 is why a previous group of Travelers came back and installed the "flag-ignore" option at IMDB. I have about a dozen versions of "the clueless critic" living in mine at the moment.

My Chimp DNA seems to have lost its password temporarily. Sluggr-2

[–] Agent_of_SQUIDD 8 years ago

Yeah, normally would go straight on mine but he is a fan of Westworld so he gets one free pass.

[–] Corky666 8 years ago

Exactly

[–] gswan 8 years ago

You make some excellent points. In particular:

If you listen to that whole dialogue at the end of Episode 12 "Grace" it would appear as if the Faction was only created after the team prevented Helios 685; however, Marcy, Carly, Trever,and Philip were abducted in Episode 5 and Helios 685 wasn't prevented till the next episode.

I agree, if faction(s) arose following the success of the plan to divert the Space Rock, and if Trevor's exposition that there are "no do-overs", and travelers can't go any early than the latest previous traveler, then no faction member could have gone any earlier than after the use of the xray-laser.

I wonder if they can ever find a credible explanation as to why the whole Directorate, and its surrounding society of scarcity, wasn't replaced by a much better future, once the Space Rock was diverted.

I agree, we have no way of knowing whether Grace and Ellis can be trusted. It might be best if all Travelers stopped obeying any orders from the future, once the Space Rock was diverted.

Season two might be a disappointment, if most episodes focus around a secret war between teams following the orders of one future faction, or another -- particularly if we never really understand the different positions of the factions. The excellent Continuum had factions from the future fighting in the present, but it did a terrific job of explaining the positions of the factions.

My theory is that it was the Director sent back in time in the season 1 finale who kidnapped them.

But wouldn't that lapse from the "no do-over" rule?

[–] chrisjdel 8 years ago

I posted a theory in two other threads which I won't repeat again in detail; but we may have been wrong in assuming the Faction wants to fix everything just like the Director, their actual goal may be to create a timeline where their own charismatic leader is in charge of a new world order. Some temporary destruction and environmental damage (provided it can be reversed in time) may be acceptable collateral damage from their point of view.

If the Faction is indeed trying to maneuver world events into a crisis/disaster situation which provides the opening for them to take power, it's no wonder things haven't changed that much. There's another influence trying to counteract every change the Director makes and keep the timeline moving along their track. If an asteroid impact isn't available as the catalyst to start World War III they'll find some other route.

[–] Scimitar_Scimitar 8 years ago

I agree, if faction(s) arose following the success of the plan to divert the Space Rock, and if Trevor's exposition that there are "no do-overs", and travelers can't go any early than the latest previous traveler, then no faction member could have gone any earlier than after the use of the xray-laser.

I believe that there is no doubt that the faction arose after the defection of Helios.

Now with the altered timeline and the fact that it seems the director is keeping up with past events, are they sending different travelers back before they send our travelers back in time?

I believe there is also something to the story that Philip tells about the timing of the Revelry bell "revelry bell rang at the exact moment the dome collapsed in shelter 41, exactly at 0600, almost like cause and effect". Almost like it was programmed to, almost like the bell weaken the structure just enough to bring on the collapse.

[–] Sluggr-3 8 years ago

To me, the attempt to deflect the space rock will have more dire consequences than simply letting it hit. To deflect, they had to create a super-energy source with anti-matter, which then touched off a subsequent arms race when they deployed the bomb to power the laser. So you save 91M by diverting the rock, but you lose 7B in the ensuing arms race. perhaps The Director isn't good at chess, and by taking an easy Rook loses the Queen. Similar to WW-II where we had the Japanese Naval Code and likely knew the attack on Pearl Harbor was imminent. We let it happen, but placed all our carriers safely out at sea and let the older battleships get dinged. We lost 2000 people, but if we had deflected the attack, the Japs would have realized their code was compromised, would have changed it, and we would have lost a superior tactical advantage which allowed us to win the war and avoid many many times the number of casualties lost at Pearl.

My Chimp DNA seems to have lost its password temporarily. Sluggr-2

[–] Scimitar_Scimitar 8 years ago

To deflect, they had to create a super-energy source with anti-matter, which then touched off a subsequent arms race when they deployed the bomb to power the laser. So you save 91M by diverting the rock, but you lose 7B in the ensuing arms race.

The antimatter weapon was already built in the future. MacLaren tells Delany hs team has been tasked to stop the US military from building the most powerful weapon of mass destruction in history. Now while that might not be the truth as to why they need it. MacLaren says at the start of ep07 that The Chinees and the Russians they will know about the antimatter destination and it may start the same arms race that we came here to prevent in the first place.

[–] Theshornwonder 8 years ago

Japanese codes weren't broken until 1942. The Pearl Harbor attack was in 1941.

[–] Sluggr-3 8 years ago

It isn't that the Travelers "can't" go back before a previous Traveler, but rather that doing so creates ripples. So, having watched all 12 again, my thoughts are that the Faction has limited resources for time-travel, they seem to be able to take people as hosts (assassin girl, automaton drone guy in ep 5) who have been previously designated as such (so likely tapping off the Directors memory banks. Therefore, IMHO, all the text messages are from the faction who wants to undermine our team. yet at the same time, we may see a complete reversal in season 2 with "the team' working for the faction if it appears that The Director's game plan is now not the best path to follow. Furthermore, this may already be the case, and The Director has now already started to target the team, as Philip says, that was a lot of guns, so clearly ramped-up over just having a single assassin girl.

Did Forbes arrive with the FBI troops based on his own detective skills such as tracking Mac's GPS databank or was he directed via a tip from either of the future groups.

Good series that got even better with view #2.

Weakest part was Kat on the plane, because while they could wipe her memory and from the manifest, she is going to be missing a nice suitcase and likely a bunch of clothes, and possibly a record of her Ubering to Sea-Tac.

My Chimp DNA seems to have lost its password temporarily. Sluggr-2

[–] philfeeley 8 years ago

The excellent Continuum had factions from the future fighting in the present, but it did a terrific job of explaining the positions of the factions.

Sorry, that show lost me when they did that. It was completely incomprehensible after that. I stopped watching before it was cancelled.

[–] vortexrider 8 years ago

Who cares? I didn't even read your "theory". What a waste of time.

[–] Corky666 8 years ago

That IDIOT needs to get a life, it's just a show

[–] Scimitar_Scimitar 8 years ago

So in episode 5:

Officer Boyd says to MacLearn that 'you need to consider that they have been taken out of the equation'. Then she says "The Directors". This may be just a mistake.

But in episode 6:

Bloom says that there is a "Project Team", one that she is a part of and one that she has debated on both sides as with what to do with our travelers, so there is division within this team. She then goes on to say that it was a team; I would say sent back by someone within this Project Team that kidnaped them, separating herself by saying it was not her team.
So does a number of group leaders from other teams or low number programmers and engineers make up this project team? The project team is clearly in charge and are more than likely the 1st step down from the director.
Bloom also does not seem to care about breaking protocol 2, she talks openly about the future.

To answer your question the faction did not exist prior to the deflection of Helios

[–] chrisjdel 8 years ago

Bloom also does not seem to care about breaking protocol 2, she talks openly about the future.

For all we know, she was saying only what she was authorized to say. And none of the protocols are absolutely carved in stone. They can be set aside under certain circumstances. For instance the Travelers told Dr. Delaney the truth, which is usually one of the biggest no-nos.

The Project Team, whatever it is, shows that things aren't quite as simple as the Director being in charge of everything. We don't really know the full details of how it fits into future society. The Director runs the Traveler program because its vast intellectual capacity is needed in that role. But clearly there are humans in the loop too.

MacLaren's team was kidnapped before the Helios mission. So if the Faction was indeed responsible then they already existed then. That's assuming it wasn't the Director's way of determining whether this very talented but possibly unreliable team could be counted on. Maybe we'll find out later on that Phillip deciding to save Alexander, or one of the other tips he provided the FBI, led to the existence of a man who was never supposed to be born who organized and led the Faction.

[–] Scimitar_Scimitar 8 years ago

For all we know, she was saying only what she was authorized to say. And none of the protocols are absolutely carved in stone. They can be set aside under certain circumstances. For instance the Travelers told Dr. Delaney the truth, which is usually one of the biggest no-nos.

Actually telling people from the 21st that they are from the future is not a protocol and is common place, Philip does it all the time. I was more referring to Bloom's blase attitude, she was about to die so she probably did not care much and she is a fan of our travelers.

The Project Team, whatever it is,

Bloom talks about in ep06.

MacLaren's team was kidnapped before the Helios mission. So if the Faction was indeed responsible then they already existed then.

It can not be the Faction. They only emerge after the Helios deflection. It may have been the Directer, but I think it was a few members of the Project Team acting without direct authority... or with authority.

[–] chrisjdel 8 years ago

Actually telling people from the 21st that they are from the future is not a protocol and is common place, Philip does it all the time. I was more referring to Bloom's blase attitude, she was about to die so she probably did not care much and she is a fan of our travelers.

I think Bloom was a cynical smartass in general, and this was just her normal attitude on display. Phillip told his attorney friend that he was a time traveler and so forth mainly because he knew the guy wouldn't believe him. He doesn't go around blabbing about it to everyone.

It can not be the Faction. They only emerge after the Helios deflection.

That's speculation based on the fact that MacLaren's team was told after that about Shelter 41's non-collapse. But this change may have occurred before the Helios mission. The first thing that popped into my head was MacLaren going off on Phillip about how every change they make has the potential to alter the future. Perhaps one of Alexander's descendants (of which there weren't supposed to be any) turns out to be the Faction's founder.

It's always seemed a little odd that Shelter 41 collapsed only seconds after the reveille bell at 0600 (not big on sleeping in, those future folks). It sounds as if this might have been a deliberate act. Either the Director got wind of a revolt brewing and decided to squash it, literally, or the Faction was starting to carry out bombings and other attacks and miscalculated how much boom the structure could withstand. So in the new timeline either the Director's people failed or the Faction was more meticulous in setting their charges, or perhaps picked a different target that day.

[–] Scimitar_Scimitar 8 years ago

That's speculation

It's not speculation it is a working theory based on tangible evidence. Ep5 kidnaped, no mention of faction. Ep6 Senior engineer Bloom, seemingly part of the hierarchy, comes back and say that she know who kidnaped them and referred to them as a team by saying it was no one on her team and no mention of a faction. What is pure unadulterated speculation, is saying that some boy who the travelers rescued in the 21st is somehow the distant ancestor of way, way back of the faction's founder. WTF.

[–] chrisjdel 8 years ago

Both theories are speculative. However they stated that the Faction was against the Helios mission; why would that be the case, if they were a product of this very change in the timeline and wouldn't exist otherwise? The future is constantly changing. The Director seems aware of those changes but still, 0014 and Grace for example technically come from a different future than MacLaren and his team. One where Shelter 41 survived to give rise to the Faction. We don't know for certain exactly which changes caused this; it was Grace's speculation that the Helios deflection was responsible, but there's no definitive evidence of that and like I said, if that mission was vital to the Faction's origin they wouldn't have been opposed to it.

Yeah, the whole thing about Alexander was a random theory. I just envisioned them learning the name of the Faction's leader and having Phillip flash back to the news report of the boy's rescue, hearing the same last name, then remembering himself saying they did a good thing, and MacClaren's rebuke that every change they make has the potential to alter the future. Phillip realizes there wouldn't be a Faction if he hadn't decided to go off the reservation and do his own thing. The whole mess is his fault. Wouldn't that make a terrific last ten seconds of an episode?

Who knows if they'll decide to go that route? But a good time travel story should drop all kinds of little details that don't seem significant at the time but play important roles later on. Retroactive easter eggs, some of which a viewer will notice for the first time when they watch old episodes over again. That's always cool. It tells you things weren't just made up as they went along, later developments were part of the story even before they became part of the story (if you know what I mean).

[–] SrEditor 8 years ago

Oh, I definitely thought of that as soon as they saved him.

Not about the Faction, per se, because we hadn't heard about that yet, but that we would find out later that Alexander is an ancestor of someone who does "something" that makes the future worse.

[–] Sluggr-3 8 years ago

So instead of accidentally leaving a few microprocessors behind like T-1, they sent the whole machine back.

My Chimp DNA seems to have lost its password temporarily. Sluggr-2

[–] cluascorp-56301 8 years ago

Excellent, that's what I thought too (more or less) :)

[–] nakkas 8 years ago

What if the deflection of Helios 658 would (or will) result in an ideal future, where the Director isn't needed or necessary, and he somehow being aware of different potential timelines, wants to thwart this outcome by going against protocol 2?

[–] chrisjdel 8 years ago

Protocol 2, leave the future in the past? Are you sure that's the one you meant?

If the Director wants to avoid the possibility of being wiped out by changes in the timeline, i.e. never being built, transferring to the 21st century where the time-altering missions are actually taking place would be enough. In fact it looks as though that may have happened at the end of Ep. 12. Something was coming through into the quantum "frame" (short for mainframe?) from the future. So the Director may be in the present now. We'll have to wait for Season 2 to find out.

[–] Sluggr-3 8 years ago

Scene from Fringe seems eerilee familiar.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQAlCXYzh-0

My Chimp DNA seems to have lost its password temporarily. Sluggr-2

[–] nakkas 8 years ago

You're right, I got mixed up about protocol 2; I meant the rule that there are no do-overs (which isn't a protocol afaik). I guess you're right about the Director transmitting its conscience to the present being enough to survive. Questions after questions, I can't wait for season 2!
Btw, I don't remember the details, but when Marcy talked about her brother surviving the collapse of his shelter and suffering from PTSD afterwards, did she say it was shelter 41? Because in ep12 they all say that nobody survived the collapse of shelter 41. So if that's what she actually said, it would indicate that her first transfer to our present was actually from another timeline than the second one in ep12?!

[–] chrisjdel 8 years ago

Btw, I don't remember the details, but when Marcy talked about her brother surviving the collapse of his shelter and suffering from PTSD afterwards, did she say it was shelter 41?

Marcy got separated from her brother during an emergency evacuation of their shelter complex; so it couldn't have been 41, which caved in without warning only seconds after the 0600 wake-up. We know none of those shelters were designed to handle the number of people that ended up crammed into them. Probably weren't intended to be humanity's permanent home and remain operational for centuries either.

They talk about the weight of the ice causing Shelter 41's collapse. That means either it was located in the polar regions or the Earth has entered a deep ice age due to severe environmental damage. Maybe even a snowball Earth scenario - glacial ice sheets covering one hundred percent of the planet's surface. They could indeed become miles thick and their enormous mass would put a lot of stress on structures underneath.

[–] Sluggr-3 8 years ago

So it seems they came up with a solution to global warming after all. ;-)

BTW, glaciers aren't static. Even on nearly level land they slide, just not at the ft per day rate on most mountains.

My Chimp DNA seems to have lost its password temporarily. Sluggr-2

[–] tonlee-96956 8 years ago

So without going through the other comments.. in the story they explained that crossing over an existing 'arrival' causes ripples (in time). That does not mean that a later point in time could initiate sending a traveler back in time to a certain point before an event happened in the present. I know, confusing. But think of 'arrival' times for travelers as a queue. People from the future can not/must not jump their spot in the queue. The comment about quantum entanglement kind of gave it away. The future is linked to the past, changing the past changes the future. Each sending is massive energy that causes a 'wake' in the time stream. Each of these wakes stack on each other. If you were to try to jump the line and go further back in time it would slice through those wakes and possibly/completely void out the earlier traveler/s and any changes made by them and all other travelers afterward (each breaking of the wake would cause a ripple). The reason why the kidknapping happened at an earlier time by The Faction was there were no new temporal events 'arrivals' at that time and The Faction sent operatives to that point to find out and possibly stop them from fulfilling their mission in Helios 685. The next queues popped up and old people were taken over blah blah blah (Helios 685).

The Director does, at some point send itself into the past causing a temporal loop (and paradox).

I don't believe Grace was working for the Faction, its more plausible that if someone was send back by a Faction controlled Director, it would have been Ellis (trying to ensure the Faction survives and possibly wipes out the timeline that houses the original Director and "the good guys"). The girl Charlotte could have been either group, but to me felt like Faction. Carly hesitates in killing Grant because she loves him, so the little girl knowing this must kill her before she hesitates killing him and protecting the team.

The last theory, probably not either. Grace made the decision to restore to factory setting the Director. She was sent to the past to assist Ellis. Ellis could have been sent back to the past by either group, most likely by the Faction however, unknowingly. Remember he was surprised by her reset to factory settings and she surprised by the quantum frame.

[–] chrisjdel 8 years ago

I think what all that talk about ripples really means is that sending a Traveler back, say, a year before the previous one rolls back everything that's happened in the past year. It's like hitting the reset button. All the missions in that time are undone and you have to do them all over again. In order to maintain a plan based on sequential actions, one mission laying the groundwork for others, you have to follow a chronological order in the present. Sending a single person back before the first Traveler's arrival would erase everything and set their plan back to day one.

[–] Sluggr-3 8 years ago

Sending a single person back before the first Traveler's arrival would erase everything and set their plan back to day one.

I wouldn't go so far as a reset to day one, but certainly it could present possibilities where it might alter/undo the actions of a traveler that arrived at a later time.

My Chimp DNA seems to have lost its password temporarily. Sluggr-2

[–] chrisjdel 8 years ago

I wouldn't go so far as a reset to day one, but certainly it could present possibilities where it might alter/undo the actions of a traveler that arrived at a later time.

Maybe not every mission would be screwed up, but you'd have to figure out how to put the missing pieces back in somehow. And every intervention aimed at fixing things would risk further corrupting events up-time from that point. It's like a team going through its season. You take one game at a time. Each win is permanent. Imagine if you got to the playoffs and suddenly some of your wins turned into losses, disqualifying your team. Now you've got to go back and tinker with the season again trying to turn some losses back into wins.

To avoid undercutting their own progress the Director maintains chronological order in sending the Travelers. Uneven lengths of time can elapse between future and present, fifty Travelers may be dispatched in one day from the future but arrive over a period of days or weeks in the present. Or the other way around. Fifty Travelers could be sent over the span of a week and all arrive near a mass casualty incident on the same afternoon. But the order in the queue is the same on both ends.

[–] Sluggr-3 8 years ago

Fifty Travelers could be sent over the span of a week and all arrive near a mass casualty incident on the same afternoon. But the order in the queue is the same on both ends. (can't quote, Java broken again)

I addressed that with the "bloom" incident where an unknown amount of time could have taken place in the future between each consciousness transfer even though in our time only about 5 seconds elapsed between each one. Similarly, the transport between 14 and 27 in the future could have been mere seconds even though it was clear 14 had been here for some time.

So we know from Trevor that standard operating procedure is to not send back anyone to a time previous to the most recent arrival, but our levels of speculation here now bring into question whether there are two sources of travelers in the future who might not be linked and they might be inadvertently causing lots of ripples. "When are you from" may still be the most important question in this series.

My Chimp DNA seems to have lost its password temporarily. Sluggr-2

[–] gregorysterner 8 years ago

What if the FBI agents that brake in @ the end are travelers too? What if it IS THE DIRECTOR that caused all of the future crap to happen? Could the AI be changing the past so it will exist?

[–] chrisjdel 8 years ago

our levels of speculation here now bring into question whether there are two sources of travelers in the future who might not be linked and they might be inadvertently causing lots of ripples. "When are you from" may still be the most important question in this series.

It sounds as though the Faction has infiltrated the Traveler program and is using some kind of software hack to plant its own queue of Travelers into the Director. The poor AI thinks these candidates are its own and sends them through. This is what Grace meant by the Director being "vulnerable to corruption by the Faction". If it's aware that someone is messing with it, but remains blind to the actual incidents of hacking, that may be the reason it wants to come back to the 21st. No more Travelers will be sent from the future - but most currently here are loyal to the Director, only a few are Faction. For its "Grand Plan" to work the few thousand operatives it already has may be enough.

Of course, we could always find out that another Traveler program from even further in the future is sending people back too. Maybe some of the humans survive by downloading their consciousness into machine bodies, so when food and clean water are no longer available everyone doesn't die. Now here they are back in fully human bodies in the present, sent by an unknown organization from the Director's future with who knows what agenda.

[–] allus2013 8 years ago

I'm with you most of the way until the girl being from the Director; she killed her family members and I thought that was a direct violation of one of the Protocols. But the Director created them so I guess it can alter them.

[–] chrisjdel 8 years ago

She was the girl who misfired in Episode 5, so the rest of her family were all Travelers. Someone sent her to assassinate a bunch of people, including Grace and (apparently) MacLaren's entire team. I'm inclined to think it was the Faction but at the moment we don't know for sure who sent which of the various conflicting orders.