MovieChat Forums > Van Helsing (2016) Discussion > Dudes complaining about a kick ass femal...

Dudes complaining about a kick ass female lead


Frankly I don't get it. Lots of guys on this board whining about why the main character is a woman. Why can she kick ass? Why can she beat up men? Why is she written like a dude but female? Shouldn't a character named Van Helsing be a man?

What is the root of this sentiment?

First off, I watched the pilot...I didn't see a female character who was a dude in a woman's body. I saw a woman who was confused, afraid, wanted to find her kid and was overwhelmed by her circumstances. Did she kick a few vampire asses and fight one dude and kill him? Yup. Why isn't that plausible? Do you guys also haunt the boards of Resident Evil and complain about that lead female? Did you feel this way about Lara Croft? Did you not buy Kate Beckinsale in any of the Underworld movies? I could go on...but I'll spare you with the plentiful and obvious examples available. AND, have you ever once complained about a 60 year old Harrison Ford as Indiana Jones could kick anyone's ass? Or a 63 year old Roger Moore still playing James Bond beating up trained assassins young enough to be his grand children? Or ANY of the aging men playing roles that defy belief with physical prowess they absolutely shouldn't have at their age? Nope, no complaints there because decrepit old men don't threaten your masculinity, they embolden it. See the double standard? You should.

Second, have you seen more episodes yet? Have you seen whether the character is written and performed just like a dude? Is it possible that there's a fully fleshed character there that has a range of emotions, vulnerabilities, needs, fears? Doesn't it make sense to watch a few more episodes and see what the character is really all about before making sweeping judgements about her or how the show is written? But no, let's rush to some knee jerk reaction just because she kicked the asses of a couple of men. NO you cry...not plausible, not realistic, doesn't ring true...

But forget movies and TV. What about real life? Do some research, there are some bad ass women out there that would lay you keyboard ninjas flat on your ass. Here's a great example but by all means browse through youtube and find dozens for yourself. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4MfMZ8arBM

Not one of you would last a few seconds with a truly tough woman let alone a female MMA fighter. Lights out. So why is it so impossible to relate to them as tough when they play a character like Vanessa Van Helsing on a TV show? I think I know the answer.

Whether you want to admit it or not, you've got some old school, patriarchal view of women. They're either supposed to be women who you want to jerk off to or women who need a guy to protect them or legitimize them or make them feel clever. Strong women threaten you. Instead you want women to play a comfortable stereotype that protects your fragile ego. Well guess what? Times have changed. Shows have kick ass women because LIFE has kick ass women, deal with it. OR just stick with the misogyny and pretend it's not really that.

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Well said.

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I agree, very eloquent. This subject strikes me as particularly relevant in light of Monday's upcoming landmark presidential debate.

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um there have always been kickass women. some ppl just dont know where to look for those movies or refuse to look into the classics. it is not only "guys" who dont arent happy with this there are gals too. men have liked females fighting long before some women openly admitted to liking it. some women have put men down for it giving stupid reasons like the only reasons men like women fighting is because they are sexy or because of their clothing or some other rubbish. this is a way those women had of dismissing those characters attributes. it is men who have written those female kick ass characters in the past in comics, anime, cartoons, video games, tv shows and as well as movies. men liked them. so please just because some men dont like the premise of this tv show doesnt mean diddly squat. i have seen strong female characters and such written by women as well that men have supported. without complaint. both old and new. there have been strong female characters supported by men and yes i can tell this by the reviews which are mainly from men not women and these being things from over 50 yrs of history, of all the things i have mentioned before, comics, manga, anime, cartoons, tv shows and movies. i forgot about books and games so you can add that in the above as well.

you're just babbling. nonsense about a mma fighter. you'd get your butt kicked too so what? regardless if the mma fighter is male or female and that person ca beat you, does that mean you cant complain about a show??? no! it does not. anyone who thinks so is a fool. there is also no guarantee the mma fighter will win. fighters have gotten their butts kicked by street ppl. it has happened. it is fact! strength is not the only way to win a fight. strength is one of but many elements. women have managed to win against guys who were tougher and stronger than them utilizing various methods. you making the statement you have (about a man vs a stronger and tougher woman and that he you think he'd lose) has shown your ignorance of women having done so both in fiction and in real life

you bring up bond. well if you even looked at ppls fave bonds you'd see what you said is a lie! there are many ppl both male and female who like certain bonds while other bonds they refuse to like or they like least and that age thing definitely gets mentioned about male actors by men.

all what you have said has shown just how unknowledgeable you are about men. patriarchys and old schools. the old school liked strong women just fine, as well as creative women, and bold ones and kick ass ones. history is full of men who married women like that because they were like that. your ignorance of history is not helping the memories of those women because you want ppl (oh wait, "guys" you don't seem to give a crap about what women think) to like every single strong female character that exists or comes out or that is what your writing would make one believe.

there are bad male characters just as there are bad female ones, just as there are good female ones and good male ones. there are ppl of both sexes who have liked the bad as well as the good and some not.... those characters can be solos or duos or trios or part of a team or any number of variations of character/group dynamics.

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You seriously linked to a Youtube video that's so *beep* fake and scripted it's ridiculous?? I know their are women out there that can beat men up but that video is *beep*
A guy his size versus that woman would have no problem beating her on shear physical strength only and that alone would tell you it's fake as *beep*!

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any and every movie/show that has a strong, kickass female lead always gets the insecure str8 males who bash said movie/show. it's bizarre. personally i love characters (and their respective movies) Selene in UNDERWORLD, The Bride in KILL BILL, etc. etc.
i'm really liking Kelly Overton/VAN HELSING a lot. it's a fun show.

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Frankly I don't get it. Lots of guys on this board whining about why the main character is a woman. Why can she kick ass? Why can she beat up men? Why is she written like a dude but female? Shouldn't a character named Van Helsing be a man?

What is the root of this sentiment?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abraham_Van_Helsing

Of course the name is not Abraham Van Helsing, but _?_ Van Helsing. It's not that she can't be called it, but it's weird that they use this name without any regard to it's origin other than it being vaguely about being anti-vampire.


First off, I watched the pilot...I didn't see a female character who was a dude in a woman's body. I saw a woman who was confused, afraid, wanted to find her kid and was overwhelmed by her circumstances. Did she kick a few vampire asses and fight one dude and kill him? Yup. Why isn't that plausible? Do you guys also haunt the boards of Resident Evil and complain about that lead female? Did you feel this way about Lara Croft? Did you not buy Kate Beckinsale in any of the Underworld movies? I could go on...but I'll spare you with the plentiful and obvious examples available.


Funny you should mention those, as they are all vastly superior to any of the garbage SyFy has been peddling recently. Do note, however, that those "heroines" or just cool female characters, have their power manifested mainly through the skill of using guns, kicks, tools and magic, not overpowering ripped men in hand-to-hand combat.

AND, have you ever once complained about a 60 year old Harrison Ford as Indiana Jones could kick anyone's ass? Or a 63 year old Roger Moore still playing James Bond beating up trained assassins young enough to be his grand children? Or ANY of the aging men playing roles that defy belief with physical prowess they absolutely shouldn't have at their age? Nope, no complaints there because decrepit old men don't threaten your masculinity, they embolden it. See the double standard? You should.


That's an awful lot of assumptions. Let me just be brief.

The Crystal Skull got a mixed reputation. Shia The Beef was cast as a young "successor" to the original Indy who was obviously too old - he didn't live up to that and so the movie was still mainly held up by Harrison Ford, despite his role being mostly one of mentoring, theoretically.

The Old Bond films simply can't be put into the context of today. How old not just Roger Moore but also Sean Connery were with their last movies is just the top of the iceberg of unbelievable things. They are cult-classics for that reason.

Second, have you seen more episodes yet? Have you seen whether the character is written and performed just like a dude? Is it possible that there's a fully fleshed character there that has a range of emotions, vulnerabilities, needs, fears? Doesn't it make sense to watch a few more episodes and see what the character is really all about before making sweeping judgements about her or how the show is written? But no, let's rush to some knee jerk reaction just because she kicked the asses of a couple of men. NO you cry...not plausible, not realistic, doesn't ring true...


For the record I don't "Van Helsing" is portrayed as man-like, just in an awkward and uninteresting way.

But that's my gripe with the whole thing: It plays like a 1980'es (B-movie) action hero universe. The dramatic effect of pointing a gun today when overused creates the opposite of tension - boredom. Especially when it's obvious that it's a way to compensate for a lack of quality elsewhere. I'm sorry but that time has come and past, if you want to get stupider there's plenty of reality TV and commercials available.

And if we are to look at that period, I don't think it makes sense to try to beat it at its own game. Ripley and Sarah O'Connor were unique characters that need no imitation or remaking.

Heck, even compared to Dark Matter this is inferior. Even though the same baseline feminist baseline is there, at least Dark Matter is weighed up by original stories and nice visual effects.

Here we get a line about a volcano in the US and that's pretty much it.

But forget movies and TV. What about real life? Do some research, there are some bad ass women out there that would lay you keyboard ninjas flat on your ass. Here's a great example but by all means browse through youtube and find dozens for yourself.


Of course there are. But most of them can't. Biology is a bitch.

But honestly the discussion is irrelevant. Guns equalise, and knives even a few odds in the favour of women. It's only when we are supposed to buy into things that are obviously false that it becomes a problem. In hand-to-hand combat a man will win over a woman - up to a certain ratio. Of course some men are wimps and manginas, but that's psychological more than it is physical, usually.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4MfMZ8arBM


That's a good laugh thanks.

Oh wait... you're serious?!?

First hint - It's a camera crew in a reality TV series.

Second Hint - At 0:37 look at the frame that they so quickly cut to and from - he's already falling before she grips his hand. And here's a basic anatomic fact: Hands are not essential to the balance of the body.

Third fact: Fake police - no insignia on the shoulders, unnatural awkward walking stance for street policemen, casual and silent demeanour when arriving to a potentially dangerous scene and freshly ironed clothes.


Honestly these kinds of videos have the same comical quality as when Vladimir Putin tries to pretend he as a showman hobbyist can compete with professionals in Judo, where they (as the true patriots they are) let him throw them to the ground a few times. Funny, but fake.


Not one of you would last a few seconds with a truly tough woman let alone a female MMA fighter.


Depends on who "you" or "we" are.

Luckily for my argument, I don't star in the series. It's in the CONTEXT of the series that it becomes awkward, if not weird (I wouldn't say unrealistic as it is a fantasy series, though we've yet to see if it even has any consistent rules in that regard).

Lights out.


Where? Oh, sorry dear leader of the glorious feminist cause which shall march on forever through victories eternal and smash the patriarchy irreversibly. #YesAllMen

So why is it so impossible to relate to them as tough when they play a character like Vanessa Van Helsing on a TV show? I think I know the answer.


Is it because:

The action is boring, slow, sluggish and poorly-choreographed?

Vampires are zombies that also drink blood?

The acting is made up of unnatural conversations and psychopathic [Gasping] and [Staring]?

The script is so badly written that not even the feminist heroine does a convincing and interesting power-fantasy, while all the other characters are flat (men and women alike)?

The dialogue reads on the level of an unfathomably idiotic correspondence between illiterate homeless people in a sewer?

The make-up is cheap, blurry and makes blood look like slimy paint in a freaking vampire series ("You had one job...")?

The sound effects are made up of amateurish and unsubtle bits not unlike those freely available in an internet sound library?

Even the visual effects are bad, where clean interiors in the post apocalypse contrast "nicely" with sloppy after-effects'esque backgrounds outside?



Whether you want to admit it or not, you've got some old school, patriarchal view of women. They're either supposed to be women who you want to jerk off to or women who need a guy to protect them or legitimize them or make them feel clever. Strong women threaten you. Instead you want women to play a comfortable stereotype that protects your fragile ego. Well guess what? Times have changed. Shows have kick ass women because LIFE has kick ass women, deal with it. OR just stick with the misogyny and pretend it's not really that.


DAMN! I knew I missed the key factor. Ah well, I stand thusly corrected and educated in the one true faith. Please accept my penance.

/s


But in all seriousness folks:

The F is for feminist. The S is for stupid-male-characters. The YY you can figure out for yourselves.

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Bravo. Bravisimo. Well done.

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What? Since when is that a problem. Trust me a "kick ass female lead" is the least of the problems with this show. This show fails on so many levels, makes you wonder how they even managed to get it funded in the first place.

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Why don't you keep your pathetic misandrist garbage to yourself.

The world needs less hateful sexists like you.




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Prepare to be judged....with a FGM-148 Javelin!

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