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These movies will/have normalise(d) violence against women


It's crazy when you think about all the feminist propaganda we've heard these past years, that because of the extreme length at which feminism, like women, is contradictory, 50 Shades was a multi-millions book success because women chose to.

In the meantime, most men are understanding that women like to be beaten, and they pull you out any *beep* like "confident, dominating" figures or worse extreme *beep* term like "empowerment" to justify it.

The result is that in a few years, and especially the upcoming generation is going to grow-up with the not so new notion (look-up men-women relationship, bdsm and feminism before and during nazism you'll understand why extreme-right wing is rising and WWIII is upcoming...) it'll be completely normal to to despise, humiliate and beat the *beep* out of woman, in order for you to be considered a man (although you're the opposite), thanks to women and feminism.

And after this period has passed, which means feminism will have been complete destroyed, that's when people will understand and remember again, what they had to remember in the 1950s after the war: don't give any *beep* responsibility, power or speech to women or else watch what happens in a few years. Well like in the last century, we'll go back to that for women's own sake.

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I agree, thank you

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you're welcome

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Not sure why some still have the attitude that violence against women is still okay? ...long before 50 Shades came along...our police..judicial system..all put the burden on the woman..look at the athletic departments of most colleges..pro sports,and even at the High School level..a slap on the wrist..our Military service women deal with harassment every day..there is some headway being made, but it is a long time coming.

as I have mentioned, I had a relative who suffered spousal abuse..just getting her out of the situation was a long,difficult ordeal.
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I feel as a parent, it is my responsibility to teach both my daughter and son,what is appropriate conduct for each..maybe we just need to start there..that it is not okay to hit/abuse physically or mentally.

And I guess I have to mention the use of the term.. feminist propaganda...that says a lot to me right there.

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Well Isundling, you have to look way beyond your pre-established contemporary view: saying you have to teach both daughter and son what is appropriate conduct is a very good start in the idea...which can very quickly turn into you doing the same mistake so many mother do which to mentally disorient your son.

For exemple my generation grew up with the idea of "bad boy vs nice guy". Abusive mothers were the one repeatedly telling their sons they somehow have specifically respect girls, like they were so kind of higher entity, put on a pedestal. Unfortunately the absolute truth of the situation was that bad boys were the only getting the girl, while nice guy were alone or even manipulated by girls. Which creates a dissonance that then evolves into the current generation of abusive guys because it's only a matter of time or age before most of them realise being a nice guy gets you *beep* while bad guys always get you girls.

In the other hand what we don't teach girl enough, is that men are not that important despite what the whole culture teaches them unlike men, and more importantly that bad, charming, seductive aka "easy" guys (which are the bad boys, *beep* etc...) are *beep* deep inside.

The huge problem is that my generation was very light in comparison to the new one which is growing up with another paradigm "the beating abusive "alpha" male vs the emasculated wimp afraid of rape accusation". This generation is going to be so *beep* up in a few years, because we're teaching them through feminism that if you dare even speak to a women unsolicitedly somehow you're a rapist, which crushed feeble guy's mind into thinking being "nice" is not touching a girl in anyway to "respect" her, until because they need love and realise that girl in turn will never do one single *beep* step towards them, but somehow always go for the guy, you know the *beep* who "abuses" her or even beats her, he'll become worse.

And this is even more difficult with girls, because of the feminist propaganda, which has made most women or girls integrate, that somehow liberation and elevation is attained through "sexual freedom", not respect and achievements, that men are somehow privileged and so women don't have to work or take responsibility because it's "men's fault", but most importantly this constant infantilisation of women, is making them unconsciously integrate that because "it's men's fault", then it mean they are depending on men, and that's when you get false ideas like "he abuses/beats me, because I made a mistake and he likes me" like this movie is depicting.

I won't go further than that, for example last century History is very interesting to explain that, but there's a reason why as of now, this far, for the past 50.000 years of civilisation women have never been put into power, and regularly be deprived of the freedom they have today: to avoid this terrible situation. This is sad, maybe we can evolve past that, but right now feminism has set the deep root causes for the upcoming backlash that will sent us 50 years back.

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I'm not getting your point. You're saying that women's desire for equality caused the uprising of hyper-masculinty and right-wing extremism? ... How?

And I think you're confusing the popularity of this book with people actually liking it, let alone endorsing the gender dynamics portrayed therein. I bought this book, but I hated it with the fiery passion of a thousand suns. I enjoyed hating it, but that's another matter. Likewise, most of the people I know who bought it also disliked it. Even the few women I know who actually enjoyed the book were rooting for Ana to change Christian into a marriageable, non-abusive man.

Furthermore, while rape and abuse fantasy stories do exist in erotica aimed at women, it's FANTASY. There is an extraordinarily enormous difference between rape fantasy and actual rape. You control the fantasy. You can simply stop reading the book at any time you please or stop the BDSM scene any time you please, which makes it different from actual rape in every conceivable way. It's like throwing a toddler into an actual fire just because he likes pretending to be a firefighter.

Let's also remember that there are men who have submissive tendencies, women who have dominant tendencies, and the vast majority of people are simply in-between.

And why is it only women who are accused of being unable to differentiate fantasy from reality? No one accuses sane men of wanting to become Vietnam veterans who suffer from severe PTSD and are routinely discriminated against by local police officers simply because a lot of guys really liked First Blood. My favorite movie is The Exorcist, yet, quelle surprise, I have no desire to become possessed by a demon.

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Excellent points...also,I just might add..anyone who thinks young men are getting their ideas about how to treat women from 50 Shades of Grey...I find astonishing..listen to the Rappers...their message is listened to by many,many more young men and women that any other medium..and it's not a good one.

And I respect anyone's right to not like/hate any books or movies..and there are those of us who do enjoy a fantasy...great thing about living in a free world..most of the time.

One big surprise...The Exorcist?...dang, that was just too scary for me..but I do enjoy a good vampire story..no zombies though.

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More than 50,000 years with no power?

Oh dear, guess Boudicea didn't get the memo. :-))

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Yeah, one or a dozen out of hundreds of thousands surely make it a rule...

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The problem is rappers were never endorsed by women as being models as much as 50 Shades did for abusers.

And what you call "fantasy" not only is propaganda, but also as real world impact, that obviously you'll have to wait a few months to see the real impact off.

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I'm saying that the neo-feminist propaganda is responsible for having normalised and make women self-integrate their inferiority, sexuality as the vector of "empowerment" (rather than I don't know...responsibility, *beep* huslte or intelligence), and therefor 50 Shades was the BIGGEST book success of this decade.

The proof is that you're a prisoner of your woman biology, if your conclusion was this cliché "he beats you, because he loves you, so maybe he'll change". The fact that you spill something that stupid is why in a few months and years, rape and abuse will not be "fantasy" because *beep* FANTASY, you are responsible for what you let yourself be influenced by, which mean what will become norm and model, and the fact that soon nobody will give one *beep* about rape, or abused women because of that.

The impact, is that men having gotten the "message" that women like to be beaten and abused (of course only if they're handsome and rich), will start becoming violent in a few years.

As for it "light" BDSM, well this is not even BDSM.

So if you want me to repeat, *beep* FANTASY, *beep* this hypocritical "yeah, but not, but yeah but"...it has work fortunately for years, what I'm saying is that with 50 Shades of Grey amongst other things, you'll see men start beating or abusing women and becoming violent overall in society, then remember this post.

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Excuse me if there are typing or grammatical errors in this post. I found it difficult to write through fits of laughter.

So you're using sales of a Twilight fanfiction to justify abusing women (all women, no less, not just Fifty Shades fans). Yeah, that's totally sane. And then you have the audacity to blame feminism, despite that feminists have been lambasting Fifty Shades for glorifying abuse since it became popular. Also, let's not forget the men-folk, who you seem to have a very low opinion of. Believe it or not, the men are quite capable of rational thought. Many of them who have read these stupid books realize that, simply because some women happen to enjoy these books for whatever reason, does not mean that all women want to be abused in reality. An example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbbQwXdUEI0

Speaking of fantasy, it's like the points you tried to make in your post aren't based in reality.

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Not sure where any of you live...but for me, after today,there are far worse problems to worry about than some movie...

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Then why do you spend so much time defending it if it's, "some movie"? There are bigger problems to worry about

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I don't worry much about Fifty Shades. As an amateur writer, I just really enjoy critically analyzing and discussing stories, and it helps me with my own stories.

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[deleted]

But that is not what they want to hear...rape is another one they like to use..oh well.

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Granted, the film did tone down the less-than-consensual sex scenes that were in the book. But he's still an utterly atrocious Dominant and a-hole of epic proportions. He knows Ana is bafflingly inexperienced, but he still pushes her into the world of BDSM and does little to help her understand what BDSM actually entails. He fails to use aftercare and rarely communicates before a scene. By the way, a "scene" is just playacting, yet Christian treats it like actual punishment. It would be fine if the film simply pointed out that he's a bad Dom, but it doesn't, and we're led to believe that this is normal Dom behavior.

I also liked the ending. If only there weren't two sequels.

But, aside from the horribly inaccurate portrayal of BDSM, it isn't really the sex acts that bothered most people; it was the way he stalked her and was immediately obsessed with her. Moreover, it was that the film failed to address how messed up this behavior was, instead portraying it as romantic. In one scene, he sells her car without her knowledge or permission, which is not only awful, but also very illegal.

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the film failed to address how messed up this behavior was


Let's give "credit" where credit is do. EL James. She wrote the book. The story is hers.

Given the source material the director was saddled with and struggling against a "writer" who was overly invested in forcing her "vision" on the movie, Taylor-Johnson made a fantastic movie. She wasn't working with a script based on Gone with the Wind here.

For every animal bought, a shelter animal dies.

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Can't argue with that. It was a well-polished film; it just had a terrible plot. And Jamie Dornan has all the charisma of a potato chip.

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Well, THAT I can argue with. Jamie Dornan is a doll. He comes across so sweet in the interviews I've read and seen.

Christian Grey is evidently just a cipher in the books. Dornan gets credit for giving him any spark, any personality at all.


For every animal bought, a shelter animal dies.

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I think he's a fine actor. He was playing a part where he couldn't show a great range of feelings and emotions- Christian Grey hasn't developed them yet. Given what he had to work with, he was wonderful. The next two, he gets to let loose. There was a comment on another thread that spoke of Ana's changing voice, quiet and sexy for the first one then different in the trailer. Christian wanted a submissive-she wanted Christian. After she walks out, all bets are off. She's still a quiet and shy young woman but she's not his submissive and she starts being herself. And it turns Christian on even more but frustrates him too. The chemistry in the trailers is great, and I expect the movie to kick it out of the park.

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To quote "Postcards From The Edge" written by the late great Carrie Fisher:

Do you always talk in bumper stickers?

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You're an intellectually stupid inferior *beep*. The fact that you have no grounds in the realities of politics, vast sociological strands that all point towards the same direction, and that you're limited, stupid and unimportant enough as to think that a multi-hundred-of-millions phenomenon echoed and further adopted by other millions of cultural items has NO impact on the socio-psychology of people, means you're probably one of those scum who think that multi-billions prospective, economical, geopolitical and socio-cultural interests happen by magic because you have the arrogance of thinking that people who deal with such issues at high-level are as limited simpletons as you are.

Nope sorry, and I wouldn't count on you to not be hysterically hypocritical enough so that you can already see the change around you in people's attitude, but YES several hundreds of millions of people then several hundreds of millions more through indirect products, porn, discussions, items, topics...will have been influenced by 50 Shades of Grey. And you know, both fortunately and unfortunately these kind of influencing cultural assets don't just have a linear and direct influence on people's psychology, sometimes they're an inescapable slippery sloped tied in a vicious circle: one of my friends "beats" women up, but he gets the most girls "because they like that", all my friends know that most women somehow "like to be dominated" but we're smart enough to question the actual definition and relevance of this, many young guys I've talked too are persuaded that to be a man you have to be "dominant" or "alpha" interpreting it as being arrogant, abusive and even violent, which some are, but the saddest is probably ALL those young girls, one nighties or she-friends that have either integrated themselves the normalisation of their own inferiority or this false BDSM as being somehow sexy or empowering.

Best example: "well i'm a feminist a bit, but it's true that a women will never be as strong as a man, and because of privileges, men are supposed to be stronger so I expect them to provide a minimum or be violent because it means they can defend me", the worst especially amongst young girls being: "well if beats me, he likes me, because he wants to show that he can protect me from myself or other". I had never heard such *beep* 4/5 years prior to that, now I'm just hearing that more and more and more. Here for a *beep* youtube video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsKdBeb5-GI

What are you doing about that? Oh that's right: being a politically correct parasite hypocrite scum.

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...one of my friends "beats" women up, but he gets the most girls "because they like that", all my friends know that most women somehow "like to be dominated" but we're smart enough to question the actual definition and relevance of this...


Obviously you need to get less terrible friends.

And you've never heard confused teenagers talking about violent men as romantic? I've been hearing that nonsense for years. It isn't new; it's just more visible thanks to the internet. And women are starting to reject the "alpha male" nonsense compared to a few decades ago. The most noticeable change has been in legislature; marital rape was legal only a few decades ago.

Yeah, we still have a ways to go and we could very well slip backwards if *beep* like FSOG is accepted. But *beep* like FSOG is not wholly accepted. Much of the discussion surrounding FSOG has been criticism of how it glorifies abusive behavior.

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"But *beep* like FSOG is not wholly accepted" then that's where we disagree. Do you think society is "magic random *beep* There's no economical crisis? There's not Trump as *beep* president of the US? Racism has not recently exploded? I'm sorry but things have logic and systemic causality.

You have feminism pushing towards the worse on one hand, and 50 Shades pulling towards this worse on the other hand. And I don't need to make some prospective, the change is here, and with the release of the second movie this year, you'll see how it'll change by the end of the year.

But again something we will disagree on even more, is actually how much women are responsible for that...

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Great post.

~Keep some room in your heart for the unimaginable~

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While I'm not a fan of S&M I am a female and I don't consider it to be abuse. The people that are into this stuff usually talk it out with each other on what they will or won't do. They do have "safe words" and Subs aren't just women, they can be men too. I've came across people who are into S&M say that these books are promoting "dangerous" activities but Christian's contract mentions that he doesn't leave any marks on any of his submissive's. However, a woman who was being interviewed in a documentary about bondage said that her partner slapped her across the face so hard that her nose started bleeding. To me that's dangerous activity and abuse. She didn't even know that he was going to do it or gave him permission. They were having sex and out of nowhere he slaps her hard and for some strange reason she liked it and that was how it all started with her.

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If you read the books the contract says he can't leave any PERMANENT marks on her. After being belted as hard as she was she is left with stripes on her backside. Christian comments on it in Grey.

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We're talking about the movie here.


For every animal bought, a shelter animal dies.

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The sex scenes aren't as abuse as what happens outside the bedroom.

If you have a dude that’s showing up to your workplace unannounced and breaking into your apartment, that’s not a sure fire sign he’s into you, it’s not a sign of a hopeless romantic, it’s called stalking and warrants a call to the cops.

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Wow...okay..

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I know, right? I hear some girls say they want a Christian Grey in their life so wow, indeed.

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I see from the Darker trailer RiveterRose that they have increased the creepiness factor by actually having stalker pics with the super illegal file that was made about her!

http://bit.ly/2hBQ9SC

Why does he need creepy photos like that, he already knows what she looks like? LOL!

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Didn't he also keep photos of his former subs in sexually humiliating poses for the purposes of retaliation should they try to blackmail him in some way? If that doesn't convince people that this dude's a *beep* sociopath, I don't know what will. And even if we ignore the moral repugnance of his actions, how was that supposed to work? So if one of his subs decides to go public with their "relationship," he's going to release the humiliating photo of her ... and prove her right?? Brilliant plan!

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Yes, which is beyond humiliating.

I hate how when he says he'll get rid of them, she's says "do whatever with them." And he gets mad at her. What is she supposed to say? He gets mad if she says throw them away, he gets mad if she says keep them.

I don't know about anyone else but I do not like getting my pictures taken without consent.

Hate thinking this way but it's like when a victim comes forward with sexual assault, people are like "well you shouldn't be doing that anyways". "she should have known better". Victim blaming. I thought Ana should have apologized to Lelia(because there is not way he'll apologize) for it because Christian never wants to admit he's wrong and one thinks about how his figure will be portrayed.

The things we do for love, well I guess obsession?

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No...the pictures were not for retaliation. You need to read this part again. Christian CLEARLY explains this. I won't do the work for you to explain it to you.

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Can't explain the stalker pic that comes with the illegal file though!

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From the horse's mouth:

“This is going to sound cold, but—they’re an insurance policy,” he whispers steeling himself for my response.

“Insurance policy?”

“Against exposure.”


He can use whatever euphemism he wants, even incorrectly (that isn't what "insurance" means), but he's still keeping sexually humiliating photos of his former sex slaves so that he can threaten them into silence should they ever attempt to expose him as a kinkster.

Immediately following that, we get this little gem from Ana:

The penny drops and rattles uncomfortably round and round in my empty head.


Hehe.

He mentions shortly after that he initially took them for "recreational purposes" (read: fapping), but kept them for hush-hush blackmail purposes. And then they were taken by Leila, apparently, because he's an idiot who can't remember his safe combination.

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[deleted]

The problem is way deeper than a slap in the face. It's a whole generation of girls that will grow up with the integrated notion that a man or someone being dominant is someone being violent, abusive and beating them, and that their own integrated inferiority is normal, and because guys do and acts as women demand, a whole generation of boys will grow up thinking that it's normal and preferable to be abusive and violent to please women.

Good luck with that in a few years, when it has been integrated enough into society that it's normal to beat a women because we're heading towards that, YES because of 50 Shades, because YES it's not it's not a niche porn video but a cultural mass phenomenon adoubed by hundreds of millions of women, and many more thousands of content (Ariana Grande for example), and the last time it happened was just...before nazism.

I'm not a woman, but I'm sad that this is an absolute truth that in a few years the word "feminism" will be inacceptable, not just because it's actually the pile of *beep* that lead to this ultimate woman contradiction, but because I can guarantee that this normalisation of pseudo-domination through abuse or violence will have been integrated by enough people that it's okay, even preferable to beat women up to show you're "correct" or you're manly, and everything from there will just be the logical slippery slope.

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I think you are giving this movie way too much credit...the books and movies are not aimed at teenagers...young women today have enough trouble with college rape,Tinder..and the other dating sites...read an interesting article in Vanity Fair about young men and women hooking up over the phone...and get together for sex..there is no dating anymore, no conversation...just swipe left or right...

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Guy allegedly beat and raped a fellow student because of Fifty Shades of Grey:

http://jezebel.com/guy-allegedly-beat-raped-fellow-student-because-fifty-1687577206

School to 11-year old dressed in Christian Grey costume, "No"

http://jezebel.com/school-to-11-year-old-dressed-in-christian-grey-costume-1689872607

This franchise can do no wrong. Darker, you find out Grey blackmails and humiliates his past submissives. Elena, who raped and molested Christian when he was a child walks away and Christian gets irritated when his mom and dad find out and only understands why they are mad, when Christian finds out he's going to be a dad.

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You're completely naïve or hysterically disconnected from reality. YES, multi-hundreds-of-millions of people phenomenons echoed by other hundreds of millions derived content in porn, politic, culture, discussion etc...have an impact.

And maybe you don't know one single teenager, but I can guarantee they are the main target and the worst because they're the most literal and gullible, of 50Shades. Tinder is "okay" because it's a consensual loss of meaning. 50 Shades is making a whole generation of women thinking that it' normal to be submissive and getting beaten by your boyfriend is normal, while a whole generation of guys are growing up thinking that being a man is being abusive and violent because that's what women want.

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I'm still baffled that you keep blaming feminism for FSOG.

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I'm not blaming feminism for FSOG. I'm a feminist.

I have a problem about how it normalizes violence. Humiliation and basically a guy who can't take no for an answer. I mean he treats her so badly.

Don't know where you got feminism from. Feminism is equality.

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My comment was directed at augurea.

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Feminism is not equality, it's women's doom and the reason why 50 Shades of Grey is a success. Read my post below.

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That's the most interesting and subtle part of it. You can deny that culture even exist like you do with 50 Shades, but certainly not deny how huge the feminist propaganda was these past years, NOT in 15 years ago, NOT in the 70s or the 50s, but NOW it has never been so omnipresent.

The problem is that this feminist propaganda has destroyed everything feminism has worked towards when it was relevant, and has now become so twisted that it is setting the grounds for women to be sent back in the 50s. It WILL happen, unless you're a history revisionist, because that's what already happen with nazism: in the 20/30s feminism was huge especially in germany where women had the right to vote. The problem is this feminism got twisted until it promoted exactly the same violent attitude in men to please women that it is now, and that's why women were sent back to the kitchen in the 50s and nobody wanted to hear otherwise because of what they had done.

Well here is the same thing: the current feminism has create a conspiracy reading of the world in which a secret invisible patriarcat is giving men privileged while discriminating against women by no fault of their own, therefor making women integrate that not only are they not responsible for anything (unlike men who work their ass off for it) but that they should be harder on men because they are privileged. Then it has positioned the quality of being a women not in the same responsibility, courage and independence as men, but as being mainly expressed through "sexual liberation", the most twisted contradictory thing being the word "empowerment" which means that women progress or affirmation has not been acquired through responsible, intellectual and hard work, but is somehow attained by sexual expression of which the power had been given by someone else. Most women have today integrated that. But the worst is the constant self-victimisation that is been implanted in women's mind, reinforce by illusive "domination theory": ALL women are said to be victims, but not by their own fault, while an inexisting theory of "male dominance" over society has been imposed has the cause of this non-existing victimisation. This is what led the ground for 50 Shades of Grey as a contradictory fantasy promoted by feminism, even if of course feminist who do nothing but spread contradictions and lies, deny it.

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