MovieChat Forums > The Founder (2017) Discussion > Watch the film at least!

Watch the film at least!

posted 3 years ago by Rolltide (964)
21 replies | jump to latest

Never seen more ignorance, blatant moronic ignorance than the way people understand or do not understand the history of this company particularly the relationship between Ray Kroc and the brothers.

At least watch the damn film. Hell just watch this 2 minutes clip. The film is on sflix absolutely free. Anybody who does not know about sites like this need to wake up. Hundreds of free movies and tv shows you don't even have to sign up. I first watched The founder on Netflix I assume it is still there.

https://youtu.be/f71BirH2ddo

If you watched the film you will know the following facts.

1. Ray Kroc did not steal anything. He was hired by the Mcdonalds brothers to be their franchising agent. He was paid a salary and commission. He was so good at his job he started over 200 restaurants in 7 years.

2. All the agreements between Ray Kroc and the brothers were mutual. The brothers were not coerced or forced to do anything from their original agreement to franchise restaurants to when they sold their interest in the company. They are the ones who came up with the figure of $2.7M.

3. Ray Kroc made the brothers rich! $2.7M in 1961 is worth almost 10X that much today. Had the brothers sold their one store in California in 1954 they would not have gotten $100,000.

4. Anything that happened with the company after they sold out is of no interest to them. It's like selling stock you owned in Microsoft or Apple in 1995. Are you being cheated today because you missed out on big gains? You sold! the brothers did have the opportunity to invest in the company when it went public in 1970. I get tired of this shit about MCD is worth $150B today so the $2.7M the brothers got was a rip off.

5. We know little about these brothers. Ok Ray Kroc was not the nicest guy. He pursued a married woman and cheated on his wife. We know nothing about the personal habits of Mac and Dick.

[–] NGMI (1184) 3 years ago

We know nothing about the personal habits of Mac and Dick.

Mac went on to become the Zodiac killer and Dick worked for Parks and Recreation.

[–] Rolltide (964) 3 years ago

LMAO

[–] jonathan_k80 (6436) 3 years ago

"Ok Ray Kroc was not the nicest guy."

Then why make a movie about him?

[–] [deleted] 3 years ago

Lol.. really?

[–] jonathan_k80 (6436) 3 years ago

When you make a movie like this you are basically idolizing the person. Why should poor behavior be rewarded?

[–] [deleted] 3 years ago

Should we only tell stories about nice people?

[–] jonathan_k80 (6436) 3 years ago

There's a difference between a "story" and something like this which is based on facts. Stories don't bother me because they are fictional; I'm tired of seeing the glorification of real-life people who have become successful through exploiting, back-stabbing and stepping on others.

[–] [deleted] 3 years ago

Not all stories are fictional. That's absurd.

If the film made him look like a scumbag, how is that considered glorifying?

There was a movie made about Richard Kuklinsky. I don't think anyone who saw it would glorify him.

[–] wrlord (1159) 3 years ago

You don't seem to understand how communication works.

[–] NGMI (1184) 3 years ago

It's a nice time period piece and a slice of America culture. They dont call us burgers for nothing.

[–] Rolltide (964) 2 years ago

So they only make movies about perfect people?

It is a great story!

A 52 year old guy takes a company of a couple of restaurants and when he dies 30 years later there are 8000 restaurants. No story there right?

[–] jonathan_k80 (6436) 2 years ago

8000 restaurants that sell garbage food and treat their employees like dirt. Plus how many locally-owned restaurants went out of business when a MuckDonald's opened in their area?

< sarcasm >Yeah, it's a great story. < /sarcasm >

Why not make a movie about someone who became successful through good, honest, hard work and treating others with respect? Maybe it would inspire more people to pursue that route. We need to stop glorifying and rewarding poor behavior in this country.

[–] joej2923 (3036) 3 years ago

I enjoyed the film and I think it did a good job of portraying the origins of McDonald's. The McDonald brothers said they made a handshake deal to get a percentage of royalties but Kroc reneged on the deal. Their deal wasn't in writing so that's a lesson everybody should remember. I do think it's horrible that the McDonald brothers were not initially honored as founders of the company but I believe they are now getting some recognition.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3049644/How-McDonald-s-founder-cheated-brothers-REALLY-started-empire-300m-wrote-company-history-left-one-die-heart-failure-barely-millionaire.html

[–] Rolltide (964) 3 years ago

I do not believe in the 1% royalty deal. Simple. They were getting .5% from the restaurants as owners of the brand and concept. Why would they get 2X that AFTER selling their interest in the business?

The link you provided says they should have gotten .5% royalties but again why would that be the case after they got $2.7M for the company? They sold their interest in the company!!!!!!!!

The link as is often the case provides meaningless data about Kroc's wealth when he died and the company's wealth decades after the brothers sold their interests. Meaningless! They sold their interest in the company! If they just wanted that royalty forever they should have not taken the $2.7M. They should have just shut up and let Ray Kroc grow the company. They would have gotten stock when the company went public.

[–] Rolltide (964) 3 years ago

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3049644/How-McDonald-s-founder-cheated-brothers-REALLY-started-empire-300m-wrote-company-history-left-one-die-heart-failure-barely-millionaire.html

"""""""""""When Kroc died in 1984 at the age of 82 his personal fortune was estimated at $500 million.

When Richard McDonald died in 1998 having outlived his brother he left a will of just $1.8 million - and spent his final days in a humble three-bedroom suburban home"""""""""""""""

It's meaningless shit like this that pisses me off. The fact that Dick McDonald's net worth gained nothing in the 37 years from when he SOLD his interest in McDonalds to when he died is meaningless! It's not Ray Kroc's fault. Dick obviously made some bad investment decisions.

The fact that there are now 37,000 McDonalds restaurants has nothing to do with the brothers who are responsible for just 5 of those restaurants.

[–] joej2923 (3036) 3 years ago

I thought 0.5 percent for each brother was the agreement but I don't know all the details. I know the brothers had control of the design of each restaurant and Kroc wanted complete control. I agree that they probably should have let Kroc have more control over the design of each restaurant but the restaurants did have their name on them.

[–] Rolltide (964) 3 years ago

Other than Kroc wanting a basement for his first store I do not recall any design issues with the brothers. He used Dick's idea for the golden arches.

The change in the milk shakes did not occur until 1965 after the brothers had sold their interest in the company. Not sure why they insisted on putting that in the film.

The 200 plus restaurants that Ray started from 1954-1961 looked the way the brothers wanted. Had the same limited menu and used the speedee system. They were clean and family friendly which was a big part of their success and Kroc understood that.

There could not have been too many glaring things they disagreed on for the film to use a change that occurred after the brothers were out of the picture. My guess is that they were too controlling and anal. With 200 new stores and hundreds on the way the company had out grown their ability to control. They should have just enjoyed the ride.

[–] Rolltide (964) 3 years ago

2 quotes from the film irritated me.

Dick commented after one conflict "there is a fox in the hen house". How is that applicable? The 200 restaurants that Ray Kroc started, around 30 a year were harming the reputation of Mac and Dick's one? They were too successful?

Then Mac talking to Ray after finding out about his real estate strategy made this moronic comment. "Our land?". When was it ever their land? The brothers had absolutely nothing to do with the lots franchisees leased for their stores.

[–] joej2923 (3036) 3 years ago

I wouldn't rely on a Hollywood movie to get the real story since they often ignore the facts in order to have a better story. The only guy who talked about the handshake deal was the nephew of the two brothers and there isn't a record of a handshake deal.

I do wonder if the Mcdonald brothers received a cut of the real estate fees that were paid to the Franchise Realty Corp? Kroc started the Franchise Realty Corp. in 1956 and rents were paid to FRC by the franchisees.

https://www.mashed.com/147897/the-tragic-real-life-story-of-the-mcdonald-brothers/

https://www.moaf.org/publications-collections/financial-history-magazine/103/_res/id=Attachments/index=0/McDonalds.pdf

[–] Rolltide (964) 3 years ago

They did not get a cut of the rent paid on the lots the restaurants sat on because they did not own the property. They had no legal interest in the Franchise reality corp.

Again if the McDonalds brothers wanted lifetime royalties they should have kept things as they were and not sold their interest in 1961.

[–] Tabbycat (878) 7 months ago

“ The change in the milk shakes did not occur until 1965 after the brothers had sold their interest in the company. Not sure why they insisted on putting that in the film.”

I’m pretty sure why — to show that Kroc didn’t give one tin sh*t about food quality.
Powdered milkshakes?
Hey hon — let’s get the kids and all go out for strawberry Crystal Light.