A Jerk, An Idiot, and a Psycho - The Gift (2015) Discussion

[–] Lili_Marleen 9 years ago

I agree with you about Gordo. There are some people on here who truly don't think he did anything wrong, that he was just "socially awkward" and innocent. I felt bad for him, but his behavior was inexcusable. He doesn't get a cookie just because he didn't rape Robyn... assuming he didn't. He stalked Robyn, broke into the house on several occasions, filmed them in the privacy of their own home, taunted Robyn, drugged her, and got touchy feely with her when she was unconscious. He also embellished his own injuries to gain sympathy from Robyn. Simon was a douchebag who got what he deserved, but Gordo was pretty sick as well.

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[–] 9 years ago

[deleted]

[–] laminur 9 years ago

HOW and WHEN did he drug her?? Did I miss something?

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[–] shawn_381 9 years ago

Yes.

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[–] espojay822 9 years ago

Drugged? I didn't see anything that would make me think that. The drugs were in her tissue, swiped from the neighbor lady.

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

It's revealed towards the end of the film where we see the video of Gordo dragging her limp body into the bedroom. They do not show him actually putting the drugs into her glass, but we can assume based on the fact that he is dragging her into the bedroom, that he is pretty confident that she is out cold.

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[–] Tomcat70 9 years ago

She drugged herself with one of her neighbor's pills.

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[–] drastic83 9 years ago

Um, did you miss the part where he's swishing around the gatorade bottle in the video he recorded? That implies he drugged her.

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[–] lennyaran 9 years ago

This. I thought it was very obvious. Seems it went unnoticed by a lot of people.

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[–] kobe_bryant178 9 years ago

Exactly. She even stated she didn't drink when she went to Gordon's 'house', in which he offered.. "Water?.. Gatorade?"

Then the camera even focused on her drinking Gatorade. Then when Gordo was whishing it round, I thought it was painstakingly obvious.

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[–] JadaDreams 9 years ago

It was. It was obvious as soon as we saw her getting woozy with Gatorade nearby. Who offers Gatorade at a dinner party?

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[–] jimb14 9 years ago

It was obvious. It always amazes me when going on IMDb message boards how much people miss when watching movies or TV. It makes me wonder how they get through life sometimes being so oblivious.

"No matter where you go, there you are."

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[–] koffeenkreame41-1 8 years ago

Um, did you miss the part where he's swishing around the gatorade bottle in the video he recorded? That implies he drugged her.

This. He filmed himself shaking it to let Simon know he drugged her.

"I'm the ultimate badass,you do NOT wanna f-ck wit me!"Hudson,Aliens😬

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[–] fatality713 9 years ago

Maybe somebodyu drugged you when you were watching the movie and you missed that too. There is literally no way you should have missed the clear cut to the bottle leaking, then the woman saying she didn't take any drugs, and finally Gordo holding up and shaking the bottle in front of the camera at the end. Wre you texting throughout the movie?

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[–] Mehki_Girl 9 years ago

He put something in the water bottle.

http://www.auplod.com/u/dalpuo430da.png
(\ v /)
(='.'=)

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[–] josephdonavyn 9 years ago

I don't think Gordo is innocent but I don't share disdain for him like I do Simon. Simon created his own monster

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[–] LouisFromBrooklyn 9 years ago

Simon is more than a jerk and a "bit of a bully," he's a piece of *beep* He clearly has control issues. When his wife asks questions about Gordo, he leaves her in the dark. He lies about things as well (e.g., about how Gordo took the apology well), and proves himself to be a bully to his wife as well as to Gordo. What he did to him in that parking lot was more than being "a bit of a bully," that was outright assault.

Gordo is the victim in this film. He is a stalker that has performed criminal acts, but it all stems from his *beep* up childhood--it got *beep* up by the lie that Simon spread. Gordo is clearly screwed in the head due to Simon's lie, and when Simon finds out about it, Simon proves to be cold and callous. Instead of seeking forgiveness, he wants to sweep his past under the rug. Not a good guy in any way.

Robyn is an idiot in many ways, but I wouldn't call Gordo "unknown" at the point she let Gordo into her home. She knew he was old friends with Simon, and he came looking for Simon. However, I do think letting him in without knowing him better does go against "Survival 101." Also, to the siding over a stranger over her husband point, she clearly wanted to know more about Simon's past with Gordo, and Simon kept that secret. Given the letters and strange gifts being received, she had a right to know, and hubby kept her in the dark with no reasonable explanation. And when the ugly truth came out, hubby proves to be a callous prick. Rather than taking the stranger's side, I'd call it, taking the side of what is morally right. Robyn was strong for standing up against her controlling husband--that's something a lot of women would be too scared or puppeted to do.

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

Louis,

So, I agree with you about Simon being a liar, in addition to a jerk & a bit of a bully. I also agree that what happened in the parking lot was assault. *However*, at that point in the movie he deserved a lot worse than that minor assault. At that point, Gordo had invited them to a dinner at a stranger's house that he had broken into, and most likely kidnapped their dog!! That is certainly grounds for an ass whooping.

As for Robyn, I guess you and my wife have a huge difference in opinion as to what an "unknown" person is when it comes to letting them into your home when you are alone. If it were my wife in the movie, we'd have a film about Gordo being left standing on the porch and eventually leaving, or possibly my wife calling the cops on him. I found it a bit odd that Robyn was so 'intrigued' with Gordo throughout the film.

Lastly,
I do not see Gordo as the victim in this film. You can't say someone is a victim, and then the very next sentence follow it up with saying he is stalking and committing criminal acts. Despite Simon being in the wrong for spreading a childhood lie, it was Gordo's father who was the real monster. My gut says, with his crazy father, Gordo would have turned out mentally unstable either way.

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[–] !!!deleted!!! (29543476) 9 years ago

At that moment Gordo deserved more than that assault ?
And what did Simon deserve at that moment? He has done a lot worse things than Gordo did.

Gordo didn't do anything what could really be life damaging to anyone.
Simon got him expelled from the school and later almost beaten to death by his father.
Simon also got that other man fired from his job.
These are all consequences that can be devastating to a person.

And as for Robyn, Gordo actually saved her from an terrible relationship.
We know she had a miscarriage once before and in the night she gave birth, she was again
stressed because their house was attacked and invaded by the man who got fired because of Simon's lie.

I noticed some people here seem to think that Robin was supposed to hold Simon's side, because she is his wife. I don't agree with that. She is her own person and has a right to decide about things for herself.

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

Leonardo,

Gordo hadn't done anything life damaging at that point? He broke into two different houses at that point. People get shot and killed for that all the time. One of the houses that he had broken into, he had them over for dinner at. They could have been easily killed or arrested that night. Not to mention he kidnapped their dog, and to some people dogs are like family members. Also, he drugged Robyn, who had already had previous issues with drugs. This stuff isn't life damaging??

I noticed you put 'beaten to death' in bold letters, but the part of that sentence that should be in bold was 'by his father'. It was not Simon who beat him nearly to death, it was Gordo's father.

Also, their relationship didn't seem all that terrible prior until the arrival of Gordo. Unfortunately we are left to guess and infer.

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[–] erin1223 9 years ago

I'm not sure if this matters but gordo did not break into the house that was not his.i think he worked for the people living their as a limo driver if I got that right and that is why he was not arrested but no longer works for the people who live there

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[–] !!!deleted!!! (29543476) 9 years ago

Well, for their relationship, it did't seem perfect either. there were tensions because of the misscarriage and Robyn also showed a will to work, which kind of suggested that work wasn't so stresful to her afterall.

as for lifechanging events, breaking into someone's house and not stealing or doing anything harmful is not so life changing. well, maybe it is for paranoid people who have fears.I myself have been burglared once from a weak acquaitance and that didn't leave any consequences.

And yes, Gordo was beaten by his father by his father,not Simon (well, not then by Simon) but after he was declaredgay and expelled from school.
When you say that Gordo deserved beating, it sounds as though he has done worse things to Simon tnan Simon did to him,but what happened to Simon is a direct consequence of his own actions.
The terrible things that happened to Gordo were not a consequence of his actions, but of Simons. He did not deserve that coming, but he got it. simon had sooo many chances to try and fix what he has done, but he skipped all of them. He didn't even care he ruined his life. All he cared about was Gordo interweaving between him and his wife. Now, that s a classic trait of a psychopath right there.
Now, for Gordo being a psychopath, it is even less conclusive than for Simon. it seems as though he is sorry he used Robyn for his plan,because otherwise, there wasn't any purpose for him visiting her in the hospital. It even seemed that he cared he didn't destroy Simon too much, because after all, everything in Simon life is fixable. He can have a DNA test easily to see if he is the father.

I just see it that way.

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

Well Leo, you and I will have to agree to disagree overall. The point I was making about the breaking into the house was that it could have ended in death or a criminal record, not so much a mental/emotional scar.

Also, yes, I do think what Gordo has done to Simon is worse than what Simon did to Gordo. What happened to Gordo happened to him from his Father, Simon only caused this indirectly. Should Simon show more remorse? Absolutely, but it's not ultimately all his fault that a childhood prank resulted in his Father beating him. Now look at everything Gordo did, years later, as an adult. All deliberate, directly, and premeditated. It's scary stuff.

Hey, a big thanks/pat on the back to everyone in this forum for being able to have an internet discussion/debate without name calling, trolling etc. Good Job.

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[–] !!!deleted!!! (29543476) 9 years ago

Well, You seem to miss the greatest repercussion this had on Gordo.
I mentioned it in both my posts, but You somehow went around it.
I am not talking so much about what his father did,beating him, but more about him being expelled from the school: him being denied to have his education.

That was a direct consequences of Simon's lie and Simon had a chance to say that was a lie in front of the school council. But he didn't. He kept quiet and let him be expelled.

I think this was stated in the dialogue between Gordo and Simon and the whole undertaking that Gordo is doing revolves around that : Simon kept quiet. He confirmed his lie in front of the school council, when Gordo was already under the threat of being expelled.

Don't You think that this was quite direct and deliberate?

I guess if You don't, we will really have to agree to disagree. :D

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

Hmmmm, ya I heard you mention the kicked out of school part, somehow I was thinking that was another indirect effect. I honestly didn't remember the part about the school council. Certainly a terrible action (or lack of action) on Simon's part. However, I still think it's a slippery slope, when you start holding adults accountable for childhood pranks that took place 10+ years in the past. That's the big difference for me. Simon's wrong doing towards Gordo happened when they were kids. Gordo's actions took place a decade or more later as adults, and Gordo should certainly know better by then.

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[–] !!!deleted!!! (29543476) 9 years ago

I percieve the damage that Simon did to Gordo is much worse, since Gordo didn't much flexibility to change his life. He was an underage, fatherless kid, expelled from school. Seems normal that he is stuck in a past. Maybe not normal, but explainable, expected.

As for Simon, his actions also take place 10 years later and 10 years later, he is still engaging in such "pranks" that destroy other people's lives (the guy that got fired) and is unable to give a sincere apology. And after all, Simon still has a good chance to recover. He has his education which can help him find a job and he has a child which could help him connect with Robyn.

I think that Gordo and Simon were both on the same page, when they had their reunion.
They both knew what Simon did and they both knew it will not end well. Don't think Gordo would forgive him either wayand Robyn was probably naive there for thinking he might. It is hard to correct unjustice and even if Simon tried to help Gordo and find him a decent job, Gordo would probably perceive that as throwing him a bone after taking the whole piece of meat (not so good in analogies -.- ). So, from that perspective, Simon knowing he did Gordo harm, but trying to prevent him to take revenge, Simon's reactions can be percieved as normal and expected as well.

But to conclude, it is hard to expect that everyone will be on the same page here because this is somewhat moraly complex story.

If I would have to pick a side, I would go for Gordo. 65 % on his side.

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[–] two_inches2001 9 years ago

Your perception of expulsion is wrong, being expelled doesn't mean you can't go to school again just that you can't come back to the same school for the rest of the year (or some places can't go to another school in the same district). I know a couple kids who went to another school the next week.

I'm no way saying Simon was a great guy, he's disgusting and was still acting like a child. Where I think you should re-access your position is you say Gordos actions were a direct response of Simon's bullying yet it is mentioned that Simon's father was a bully to Simon when he was growing up. So by your thinking then you can't blame Simon for his actions either. The movie doesn't put a lot of attention on that but it is the only mention of his past that was brought up by Simon instead of someone else, so it must mean something.

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[–] !!!deleted!!! (29543476) 9 years ago

Your perception of expulsion is wrong, being expelled doesn't mean you can't go to school again just that you can't come back to the same school for the rest of the year (or some places can't go to another school in the same district). I know a couple kids who went to another school the next week.

Well, when one is expelled from one school, the others are on a lookout and one's chances of getting to a good quality school are certainly much more slim. And in this case, since we heard how much Gordo's father cared for him, I doubt he got a good deal.

Where I think you should re-access your position is you say Gordos actions were a direct response of Simon's bullying yet it is mentioned that Simon's father was a bully to Simon when he was growing up. So by your thinking then you can't blame Simon for his actions either.

This is certainly not my thinking, cause my thinking goes along this way :
When somebody harms you, you don't go around harming other people, but you strike back to the one who harmed you. If you remotely care for justice, that is what you do.
If somebody harms you and you harm somebody else, that is not justice. That is even more injustice, so it means you don't care.
Revenge just seems more humane than hurting random people :D

And here to burry myself deeper, I don't actually believe in free will, so even if I do blame people, that is I'd say intrinsic behaviour. I don't really think anybody has any choice. A brain does what a brain does.

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[–] two_inches2001 9 years ago

I agree that revenge doesn't seem as bad as torturing someone else but when your a kid usually your not going to attack your parents. The kid will take what they see and treat people the way they are treated. Then you get into nature vs nurture which is a never ending debate.

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[–] JadaDreams 9 years ago

Gordon was ostracized at school because of Simon's lie. Even if his father never attacked him, Gordon's life would have been significantly altered. Kids kill themselves over stuff like that, people turn to drug use. Can you imagine how alone he must have felt? No one believed his side (the truth), he was left with no one to turn to. He probably felt worthless.

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[–] VivienCastro 9 years ago

>I found it a bit odd that Robyn was so 'intrigued' with Gordo throughout the film.

Robyn sympathized with Gordo from the start. Keep in mind that she was a girl who was bullied by other girls during her childhood. And while I wouldn't think her relationship with Simon was abusive at that point, we can assume their personalities affected their past dynamics. Remember that she had a pill addiction, he tends to be just a bit controlling/insensitive, she tends to be just a bit weak/sensitive, a victim type. Obviously he loves her so he didn't really unleash her jerk side on her before, but there had to be some subtle indicators of what he is like.

I think that at first while she didn't know Simon bullied Gordo, she just felt some natural sympathy for him because she could relate. She even said that much when Simon first made fun of him, that other people could also call her socially awkward. I think Robyn was the weird kid who grew into a pretty girl which gave her the social approval, but didn't much change her personality or the way she perceives herself.

Robyn thinks that Simon, who is an extrovert and was never bullied, simply doesn't get it. When he mocks Gordo for his social awkwardness, she remembers girls who mocked her and she doesn't want her husband to be like that because she can identify. That's why she gets so protective of Gordo, because at that point shes identifying on some really basic level. It's not about him as a person, it's about her defending the socially awkward, the odd ones, that she feels she is too. He is like a symbol of something to her.

When Gordo sees the "weirdo" on the fridge, she knows how he feels and she feels very responsible for hurting his feelings. She can't give it a rest because she hates the idea that she was now on the bully side and made someone feel that way.

It's not weird that she reacted to the implications that Simon bullied Gordo. All the pieces were there. It's not weird that it really bothered her either. But then of course it developed into something bigger because Simon was more then just a former bully, he still was a bully and also a pretty sleazy liar and he didn't respect her that much either. And Gordo was a psycho but she never learned the full extent so naturally she kept identifying with him until the end, seeing them both as victims of Simon in a way.

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

Good explanation of some details I glossed over. It makes a little more sense why the wife befriended him the way she did. I still think it was a foolish move on her part and could have gotten her killed (in addition to being raped). In my opinion, the wife was the driving force that caused much of the movie's drama and conflict. I found most of it just downright unnecessary, really. Again, had it been my wife in the movie, the cops would have been called and a restraining order taken out against Gordo. End of story.

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[–] RamonRazor 9 years ago

I think she softened up to Gordo is because she could relate to him in some way. Furthermore she knew there was more to what her husband was leading her to believe.

Lol @ OP saying Simon was a "bit of a bully". Mother *beep* are you kidding me? He was a grade A piece of *beep* I guess he missed the part where Gordo wouldn't accept the apology and then beats him and kicks all his *beep* around. Then Simon goes home and lies to his wife about it.

Unfortunately the wife was pawn at the end of the day. She was Gordos way of getting back at Simon.

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

I guess you missed the part where Gordo broke into 2 different homes, kidnapped their dog, and drove a wedge in their marriage (prior to that beating)? No need to call me a MF just because you disagree with me, geesh. Gordo was a stalker who got what was coming to him in that scene. Though, had the wife not been so naive, and actually got the police involved sooner, none of this would have happened, and she wouldn't have gotten raped.

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[–] erin1223 9 years ago

Gordo only broke into Simons house and he worked as a driver at the house he pretended was his. We also do not know the deal behind gordo's record to know why he might have broke into someone's house before and it is too bad that Robyn was a pawn but simon could have deserved to have his house broken into and if gordo kidnaped the dog he brought the dog back and it seemed fine I think

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

I have news for you, Erin1223, just because you are the driver for someone, does not make it legal to go into their home and make it your own while they are on vacation. Also, it is not legal or morally right to kidnap a dog, just because you eventually brought it back. Third, no one "deserves" to have their house broken into, and even if they did deserve it, it does not make it legal. Fourth, please try and use some sort of punctuation in between sentences. I'm generally not the grammar police, but wow your post is rough.

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[–] mkohary 9 years ago

Simon isn't just a jerk, he's a manipulative, narcissistic, self-inflated *beep* This becomes crystal clear during his little tirade to Robyn about how the bullied should just "get over it", displaying an astonishing lack of compassion and empathy - something psychos are well known for.

Gordo certainly was no innocent and was wrong to do the things he did, but at least his motivations are understandable. You know precisely where they come from and can sympathize with them - who hasn't wanted to get revenge on a bully before? So what's Simon's excuse? What's his motivation to be such an unfeeling prick? Gordo has a reason you can point to, but Simon, that's just who he is. He doesn't even respect his own wife, lying to her and gaslighting her at every turn. This is probably why a lot of people have a lower regard for Simon than for Gordo.

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[–] stroetel 9 years ago

He touches on his father being a dick too, and they say the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

You're right in saying Simon doesn't have much of an excuse. However, if you're just a run-of-the-mill/dime-a-dozen jerk, you don't necessarily have to have an excuse. He's committed no real crimes here. However, if you're Gordo and you've committed numerous inexcusable crimes (stalking, multiple breaking and entering,dognapping,drugging someone, possibly rape) you need more than an excuse, you need a good lawyer and an alibi.

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[–] JadaDreams 9 years ago

If Simon spoke to the police about Gordo's "rape," he could be guilty of filing a false police report. His actions were definitely worthy of a defamation and/or harassment suit. He's also guilty of assault in the present day, and likely when they were in high school, too.

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

JadaDreams,

You're delusional. While that tape is probably not enough evidence to convict Gordo on Rape/assault charges, it's certainly enough to prove it's not a false police report, that's downright laughable. It's also laughable to bring up a harassment suit against Simon when he was clearly the one being harassed in this film. Honestly, I don't know why I keep revisiting this thread, as every time I do I lose a little more hope for humanity. I understand those who feel bad for Gordo, but the comments of those who sympathize with Gordo and paint Simon as a monster are truly shocking/scary.

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[–] daddie0 9 years ago

Gordo certainly was no innocent and was wrong to do the things he did, but at least his motivations are understandable. You know precisely where they come from and can sympathize with them - who hasn't wanted to get revenge on a bully before?

This is exactly what makes Gordo worse than Simon IMO. No matter what you have been through, to victimize a third party (and yes, the stalking and drugging is victimization enough whether or not he raped her) makes you worse than your own assailant.

BTW, I agree 100% with the OP's title.

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[–] CDM_moviereviewer 9 years ago

Actually, from a purely academic perspective, Simon would be considered a psychopath, considering his behavior from early adolescence continued on into adulthood, as evidenced by that other employee who got fired through his actions. Summon is not a bully. A bully does not intentionally go after individuals, knowing the consequences, and having no remorse. Is a complete difference between those playing the game – in what most Americans are used to and each respective behavior – to being either a sociopath or psychopath, depending on the given scenario. To further illustrate the difference - so he made a rumor, and that engendered into something bigger (perhaps unintentional?). However, it becomes something completely different and you actively seek similar scenarios - psychopathic behavior.

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

If you want to use a broad and liberal definition of Psychopathy then sure, slap that label on Simon. *But*, you'd have to slap that label on millions of other Americans at the exact same time, based on a that broad interpretation. You're playing a little fast and loose with that term for my tastes.

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[–] matahari20-1 9 years ago

If you want to use a broad and liberal definition of Psychopathy then sure, slap that label on Simon. *But*, you'd have to slap that label on millions of other Americans at the exact same time, based on a that broad interpretation. You're playing a little fast and loose with that term for my tastes.

So psychopathy or sociopathy is no longer what it is because 'lots of people do it'?

Might that be why it's becoming the norm in America for mass-shootings. if that's the average American attitude?

Serious question.

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

That's certainly a valid question. However, I think my point was, that for there to be a clinical diagnosis, it needs to have a great affect on everyday life, to an abnormal level. If the symptoms are commonly occurring in the general population, then it's considered 'normal'. I'm about a decade or so removed from my Psychology classes so I'm a little out of my depth though.

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[–] ishraq-priom 9 years ago

I have joined to this discussion way lot later so i am just gonna say what i think. You guys have said pretty much everything about what you think . In my honest opinion the movie was great and it wanted to give a message that is - An idea can change everything you just have to put it there And of course the big elephant in the room Bullying.

Robyn is a good person with her issues ... she had her drug problems, she had miscarriage which was a tragedy, now trying to be pregnant but so far not been able to and she likes to be busy with her work and hopes to return in some form of it officially....... through her i think our society is portraited somehow i don't know how but it seemed that way to me... and she is also naive to think that Gordo is just another guy who wants to help around, be the friend etc. What made her special is she gives the sense of right and wrong in this movie she always tried to do the right thing and say the right words and though she had a lot of issues but she broke the shackles and decided to leave Simon for a better future for her and her boy.

Simon is complex character but he can be summarized easily by Robyn's line - You were a bully then and you are a bully now. He does whatever it takes and he will take every actions necessary if something or someone gets in the way. He was a kid and he was popular cause we know he was the president at the school and he made fun of Gordo and practically destroys his life and still doesn't have any remorse that what he has done to another human being. Yes it may not be him that hit Gordo to death but everything started when he did the thing and didn't even bother to correct his mistakes as a result Gordo was expelled and never quite manage to change his life around, and even when Simon had gone to apologize he threatened Gordo instead. Simon became a successful person probably by screwing everyone over - REMEMBER ALL THOSE FILES IN HIS DESK...probably all of them at some point his competitor and look what he did to Danny.

Gordo is the character at question here what kind of a person he is/not. He wanted revenge or an honest apology at some point in his life... but in the way of getting revenge he did things which are just *beep* up" would suffice that . He broke in two houses and ........lets forget other things and just focus on what he did to Robyn ...he drugged her and most likely raped her, for that only he is a criminal(the worst kind there is a rapist) whether he is a psychopath/not that comes later. And i think he didn't go to the hospital out of sympathy for Robyn it was to a sabotage any chance if any Simon had left with her and also to say 'How is my child' type of thing i know there is no such mention in this movie but that's just me .

He went to the hospital to draw the final coffin in Simon's head and implanted the idea the child is his/not , he should tell Robyn/not, perform a Dna test(hypothetically)/not, what it would do to his relation/future if he does/doesn't do all these things AND I think to see Robyn's face when he asks her about the baby cause in his *beep* up mind he has given her a gift or should i say -THE GIFT.

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[–] jackbaumel 9 years ago

Everybody here is misremembering their psychology 101. Simon is a classic psychopath, possibly a clinical criminal psychopath. Gordo is severely disturbed, but his actions in the movie are neither sociopath nor psychopath (although an examination of his record could indicate otherwise).

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[–] Hiphophippie23 9 years ago

I agree he shows a lack of empathy/sympathy, and an ability to manipulate, but not enough to be considered for a clinical diagnosis. He sure seemed to have a normal life prior to the arrival of Gordo.

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[–] laminur 9 years ago

I agree with you; Simon is a classic psychopath.. No empathy to any people at all!!! Focused just on success!!

But what is missing in the movie the past, family.. of Simon and Gordo... Gordo is a loser but there is "something" in him that prevents us to pity or understand him....

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[–] RoidDroidVoid 9 years ago

I firmly disagree with the majority diagnosis of Simon's psychological condidtion. Simon is a textbook high functioning sociopath.

See below for additional information regarding my professional opinion (ok, not really... since it's a movie character (in a mediocre movie)).

Medically, sociopathy is termed as antisocial personality disorder. It is defined as "a mental health condition in which a person has a long-term pattern of manipulating, exploiting, or violating the rights of others."

According to ICD-10 criteria, presence of 3 or more of the following qualifies for the diagnosis of antisocial personality disorder (~sociopathy):

a.) Callous unconcern for the feelings of others.
b.) Gross and persistent attitude of irresponsibility and disregard for social norms, and obligations.
c.) Incapacity to maintain enduring relationships, though having no difficulty in establishing them.
d.) Very low tolerance to frustration, a low threshold for discharge of aggression, including violence.
e.) Incapacity to experience guilt or to profit from experience, particularly punishment.
f.) Markedly prone to blame others or to offer plausible rationalization for the behavior that has brought the person into conflict with society.

High Functioning Sociopath

High functioning sociopath is term used to describe people with sociopath traits that also happen to have a very high intelligence quotient. They are likely to be highly successful in the field they endeavor (politics, business, etc.). They plan very meticulously and the presence of sociopathic traits like lack of empathy, lack of remorse, deceptiveness, shallow emotions, etc. makes it very difficult for "normal" people to compete with them.

RoidDroidVoid

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[–] bunnywithanaxe 9 years ago

The behavior of the wife intrigues me-- Yes, she was pretty foolish about boundaries, but the way the actress handled it, you almost got the sense she was a ware of that and pushing past her boundaries anyway-- she kept doing this eye contact thing with Gordo-- no a flirty thing, but more like she recognized him right away as a fellow high school trauma survivor. She felt a kinship with him-- that made her want to reach out to him, in foolish ways.

And it rings true to me-- there is a kind of "mark of Cain" thing with people who are abused/ bullying survivors-- we kind of recognize each other. Anyway, I appreciate how subtly she handled it-- she could have been all daffy over- nice person, but she seems considered about each of her boundary- breaching choices.

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[–] daddie0 9 years ago

she recognized him right away as a fellow high school trauma survivor

This is the ONLY thing that almost created sympathy for Gordo and Robyn and it comes to a head in the kitchen when she demands he go apologize to Gordo. Simon's rant about the "fantasy" of apology and how he berates her for waiting for "all the mean girls to line up and apologize to her for their actions in school" was so harsh and unloving that I finally began to dislike the main character...then the "twist" came and I lost all sympathy for all the characters. Heck at the flower scene I began to wonder if Gordo and Robyn had actually had an affair. Crazy movie, great premise, but IMO somehow missed the mark.

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[–] eze_ip 9 years ago

What is wrong with you guys? Gordon may have RAPED a woman, he also broke into 2 houses, invited people over there, kidnapped a dog, drugged a woman... I dont understand you all at all, he was a total psycho!

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[–] Rvrgm 9 years ago

I couldn't bring myself to "root" for any of these three, though I don't think that we are meant to.

Not every movie is meant to have a "hero'… The point of this movie, to me, was to play off of traditional home or life-invader thrillers, and then veer off into a unique direction of making the man you THINK is the hero to be the actual "bad guy" … it's what they used to call a "morality play"

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[–] IL_Maestro 9 years ago

Simon is that demon because he did a mistake, no matter how big it was, it was still a mistake
now usually when someone makes a mistake, they are damaged goods
lets say when Robyn took drugs earlier that we are told about, that would make her look as a drug addict for life no matter what she does later
that is why most people lie and deny anything these days, because admitting a mistake labels you as a bad person and everything you did would be negative
i actually fail to see the link between what Simon did to Gordo when he was a kid and what he did to Danny when he was grown up, not everybody who acted like that as a kid would act like that when he is older and vice versa
not everybody who would frame Danny just to get a promotion must have been a bully when he was a kid
that is a mistake and this a mistake, even if both were so big but committing one doesn't mean you are going to commit the other one
about wife who i liked, she was new in that city and feeling lonely and had no reason to fear Gordo plus she had issues with drugs and losing the baby so i didn't really hate her for that.

"It is never about what happened, it is only how you look at it!"

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[–] bluethings234 9 years ago

Ok i have to chime in here after finally watching the movie. I feel bad for people who actually think Gordo is worse than Simon. Simon played a big part in who Gordo is today. He gave him a traumatic childhood experience by making up a huge lie that basically lead to beatings, his father trying to kill him, ruining any relationship with family, friends, girls and making him an outsider. You can talk psychology and i can't cause i don't know the technical terms but Simon screwed him up big time and time and time again showed no remorse about it whatsoever. Somebody said that in Simon's defense this happened when they were kids. Well he did the same thing to Denny Mcdonald. He got a man fired to get a promotion. WHO DOES THAT? don't compare that guy to plain bullies. Doing all that and lying to his wife is sick. Gordo did some questionable stuff, i won't defend him but just think what he went through because of Simon. then years later have that guy beat you up because you won't accept his apology. Yeah because one "i am sorry" that wasn't even sincere is supposed to make it all better. Simon got what was coming to him, he even deserved more.