MovieChat Forums > Gotham (2014) Discussion > Why Can't Jerome Be The Joker?

Why Can't Jerome Be The Joker?

posted 8 years ago by AmbushBug26
37 replies | jump to latest

I fail to see why Jerome can't be the Joker. Whenever anybody on here makes a claim why he can't or shouldn't be the Joker, it usually comes down to one main argument....

"The Joker can't have a definitive origin cause he's supposed to have vague multiple origins!"

Well that's a flat out lie. Tons of comic books and movies and other TV shows have giving the Joker an origin. In Tim Burton's Batman film, he has a definitive origin. Nobody complains about that film, so why is it when this show does it....it's suddenly a bad thing or some rule that hasn't been broken before. The whole mysterious origin got popular after The Dark Knight and now it just seems everybody wants The Joker to be like that film. Which is boring. I'd rather not watch the same dang thing over and over again. I like a little bit of variety thanks.

The other excuse people use is "Joker shows up because of Batman". Granted, this argument does have some merit..... but I'd be okay with Joker coming first. There have been examples before, most famously in the animated series episode "Trial" where the argument is made that Batman didn't create his villains. They would have ended up the same way regardless if he was there or not. Plus, bringing the villains out before Batman, makes Batman more so needed in this world. It's kind of interesting seeing a reversal of the escalation thing from Batman Begins. The villains escalated the violence and dramatic flair, and because of that they unintentionally created their greatest enemy. Someone who took the dial they turned to an 11, and turned it to a 12 against them.

I for one, think Cameron's performance is fantastic. All the best qualities of all previous performances in one. I think he should be the Joker, he's already a great Joker.

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Save time.....See it my way.

[–] midnightsnoop 8 years ago

I love Jerome. I use to think Heath Ledger was the best Joker but he has been replaced. This cat is good, very good.

[–] mannyk-73178 8 years ago

Well since it doesn't follow the comic books closely than it is okay but Joker didn't come around for some time and he was already married who wanted to be a comedian but always failed and he became Joker when he fell into ACE toxic.

Jerome could just be the tip of ice berg.

[–] krism_atl25 8 years ago

Thank you Manny seems you and I have read the comic books. And have listened to the creators of the show.

When Gotham began the creators explained the show but people refuse to listen. I feel like most of the people who watch this show have no clue about the Batman story. There is more than the movies.

Gotham is a prequel and origin story of James Gordon, Bruce Wayne, the villians and the Crime Families. The show will end when Bruce Wayne grow up and leaves for Tibet ( and fyi that's not just from Nolan, it's been the start of him becoming Batman after he trains with Ra Al Ghul) ... This is why the storyline needs to not be rushed. People are trying to push the writers and skip over stuff. Right now Bruce Wayne is about 14 or 15 yrs old...He's got at least 5 years before he leaves. Let's chill out and watch him grow up.

[–] AmbushBug26 8 years ago

I've been reading comics for almost two decades and there's been so many different incarnations of Batman and his rogues, than when adapting to a film or in this case a TV show. There's tons to borrow from.

For example, you're assuming that Bruce Wayne will leave Gotham and go to Tibet....They might not even do that. They might instead have Bruce train with Alfred like in Batman Earth One.

That's the problem I'm trying to address. Comic book fans are assuming things should happen, because it's a Batman show. They say Batman should be heading off to Tibet to train, they say Joker should have no origin, they say Oswald Cobblepot should be straight, they say the villains can't show up before Batman, they say this and they say that. They're getting upset when the TV show does something different from the comics....but this isn't the comics, it has every right to be it's own thing. It has every right to be different or do things differently. That's the wonderful thing about Batman, he's such a flexible character that there are hundreds of different interpretations. There is no set in stone rule-book saying it HAS to be done a certain way.

I was using Jerome as an example, but your example of Batman going to Tibet is another example. The show is more than allowed to take liberties and do things different. It doesn't have to follow the comics, because even the comics don't follow a set path.

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Save time.....See it my way.

[–] 8 years ago

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[–] bill-mcdermott 8 years ago

But he admits that story of losing his wife and baby may not be true and he's had multiple origins

[–] ric_boy 8 years ago

You're absolutely right. I've never understood the "Joker can't have an origin" thing because as long as past creators have had a chance to do their take then anyone can. If everything was beholden to "canon" then the Batman media universe would be very tedious and pointless. That said, Jerome's story would be my least favorite Joker origin.

But one of my favorite Jokeresque performances for sure.

And if Jerome is not the Joker then all it does is steal from what the Joker is supposed to be further down the road in this Gotham tv universe because Jerome made a pretty big stamp on it's history.

[–] bill-mcdermott 8 years ago

In one comic the joker breaks down over his origin and the doctor replies something like

" interesting.......and touching but that's the 8th origin you've told me today "

[–] Crown_22 8 years ago

I agree with Ambushbug, I like a variety of ways these villains come about, not just one particular story. Lots of comic book related movies and shows do it, even Batman. In Batman 1989, he was a gangster named Jack, fell into chemicals after an encounter with Batman. In The Dark Knight, he's an unknown mad man that pops up maybe a few months after Batman made a name for himself, causes destruction and chaos. In the comics (just like Dark Knight) he tells multiple stories how he came to be, he either flat out lies or he's delusional and don't even remember why he is that way.

To add, we really only know of Jerome killing his mom at the age of 17-18. We don't know what kind of twisted childhood he may have had growing up or when he exactly snapped and went crazy. I know it's all fiction of course but in terms of the character, we still really don't know much about him.

[–] cobrn-24298 8 years ago

Well they messed up the Barbara Gordon character and also made the Penguin gay...

Jerome can be the Joker. He's like a young mix between the Mark Hamill and Heath Ledger's Joker.

Why so serious?

[–] kevinsg04 8 years ago

Yep.

This show has told us time and time again that it isn't canon, so no one should have expectations. It stands alone.

[–] scorpionq 8 years ago

Why Can't Jerome Be The Joker?

He can and he is.

I think he should be the Joker, he's already a great Joker.

^^^

[–] itstort 8 years ago

I've a feeling it's more of a role reversal here, too.

Most depictions show that Batman creates the Joker. I think last night we more or less witnessed Bruce's final straw. In this case, I think we are going to see Joker create Batman.

He's already been kicking the idea of a masked hero since he saw Azrael; so I just think this will be what pushes him over.

[–] ramseyferguson 8 years ago

But Jerome already has multiple origin stories. There's the origin story in season 2. Then he died. He was brought back to life origin story #2. Maybe something will happen in Arkham and he gets another origin stort. And so on until he forgets his true identify and assumes the mantle of the Joker.

[–] 8 years ago

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[–] ramseyferguson 8 years ago

Bingo I think it's brilliant.

[–] 8 years ago

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[–] ramseyferguson 8 years ago

Where do we pick up our check?

[–] 8 years ago

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[–] itstort 8 years ago

But he will already have a different fighting style by the time he becomes batman. He'll have a mixed set of what he knows now, plus from his travels and the league of assassins.

[–] 8 years ago

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[–] itstort 8 years ago

Valid point. It is the Joker after all.

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[–] FMT 8 years ago

Jerome has been a lot of fun, but he can't have a back story and be the Joker - it doesn't work that way.

It can work that way, and it has, several times, the batman universe doesn't revolve around TDK. Sorry, but that's the way it is. Not to mention Gotham is an origin story in itself.

[–] 8 years ago

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[–] FMT 8 years ago

True but if Batman knows who the Joker is then why can't he nullify him?

That would show weakness on both Batman AND the Joker's abilities.

They have to be at odds and that goes all the way back to the origins of the Joker.

Fist of all you're acting as if Gotham is a prequel to an existing Batman continuity, or will lead into a new Batman continuity. And it isn't. Neither. Second of all, all action heroes, James Bond, Indiana Jones, John McClane, Luke Skywalker, they all know who the main villain is, and still only manage to finally kill him, or beat him, at the end of the movie, during the climax. Call it context, call it plot armor, call it whatever you want, but that's how it works, that's the formula. You may as well ask yourself, if Batman knows who the Penguin is, if Batman knows who the Riddler is, if Batman knows who Two-Face is, if Batman knows who Mr Freeze is, if Batman knows who Poison Ivy is, then why can't he nullify them? Batman knew who the Joker was in B89, why couldn't he just nullify him? Because that's how action movies work, origin story or not the main bad guys last until the end.