MovieChat Forums > The Last of Us (2023) Discussion > I dunno if I can keep watching this...

I dunno if I can keep watching this...

posted 2 years ago by WarrenPeace (2267)
34 replies | jump to latest

When I finally got around to checking out TWD after the hype, I happened to catch a show where they end up murdering a bunch of normal humans that were not zombies.
This bothered me because I didn't understand why humans would be at war with each other instead of all uniting to kill zombies.
Since I did not even see one zombie in this ep. that I was expecting, I quit on it.
Now I am thinking of doing the same for Last after seeing what psycho murderers Joel and Ellie are.
I don't mind when it's self defense against the infected.
But when it's against other humans, especially in cold blood and when they are defenseless, I don't care for that.
Plus it has the same old trope of how the anti hero can get up and walk when he is barely alive, is the one that somehow dodges bullets and ends up killing everyone else even though he is outgunned.

[–] Volley (3433) 2 years ago

When it comes down to it, it's amazing how little infected we actually saw in the TV series compared to the game.

Anyways, without spoiling anything, it'll only get worse in Season 2 (and probably Season 3) when it basically becomes a revenge against humans story.

[–] Skavau (15993) 2 years ago

Who exactly have they murdered in cold blood specifically? There was a reason to all of them.

[–] WarrenPeace (2267) 2 years ago

Joel didn't have to murder those he has tied up and tortured or when they surrender to him.

I don't care for the level of violence against fellow humans we are now getting.
They should all be allies in fighting a common enemy and not fighting each other.

[–] Skavau (15993) 2 years ago

Joel didn't have to murder those he has tied up and tortured or when they surrender to him.

Did not want to risk them chasing them.

They should all be allies in fighting a common enemy and not fighting each other.

They were literally cannibals.

I take it you don't watch much gritty media.

[–] WarrenPeace (2267) 2 years ago

Did not want to risk them chasing them.

There is no risk when he has them tied up or if they don't know which direction he is going like Marlene would not have known and if he takes the only working car.
I don't see all of his killings justified and I never will.

They were literally cannibals.

I don't mean just them, I mean everyone.
Like when he and Ellie were in KC and they were attacked by that group that were not Fireflies.
Why attack them when they could have fought together or traded?

As for them being cannibals, they were doing what they had to do to survive the long winters.
Can they really be blamed for that?
The show made it look like it was wrong when it really wasn't for a desperate situation.
At least they had someone to eat that was well done from that fire!

[–] Skavau (15993) 2 years ago

There is no risk when he has them tied up or if they don't know which direction he is going like Marlene would not have known and if he takes the only working car

They could break out. It's quite obvious he would go to the town.

I don't mean just them, I mean everyone.
Like when he and Ellie were in KC and they were attacked by that group that were not Fireflies.
Why attack them when they could have fought together or traded?

???? Stand up in the street and ask to negotiate with people firing on you? What?

As for them being cannibals, they were doing what they had to do to survive the long winters.
Can they really be blamed for that?
The show made it look like it was wrong when it really wasn't for a desperate situation.
At least they had someone to eat that was well done from that fire!

You are taking the word of a literal pedophile that it was purely done from necessity.

[–] WarrenPeace (2267) 2 years ago

I will clarify just one thing you brought up then let it go....

"???? Stand up in the street and ask to negotiate with people firing on you? What?"

I get it that Joel and Ellie were attacked first and had to defend themselves.
No objection.
(Though Joel did not have to kill the kid who was then defenseless and crippled after Ellie had shot him.)
Just that I don't understand why they were attacked in the first place.
The attackers did not know how dangerous their targets were and they could have tried to negotiate or to perhaps even trade first. Maybe try and get them to fight Fedra with them.
Of course that would have made for a boring game or TV show.
I get that too.
Just saying there are alternatives to attacking or fighting.
Usually in real life situations disasters bring people more together.
Of course that depends on the disaster since as we saw during the pandemic that actually kept us apart because we did not want to risk catching it.
(Sorry. Going off on a tangent.)

We are not going to agree since you have your viewpoints and I have mine.
And we are debating over a fictitious show?
LOL

[–] Skavau (15993) 2 years ago

(Though Joel did not have to kill the kid who was then defenseless and crippled after Ellie had shot him.)

Joel is quite consistent about this stuff. He doesn't leave survivors who can then gather reinforcements.

The attackers did not know how dangerous their targets were and they could have tried to negotiate or to perhaps even trade first. Maybe try and get them to fight Fedra with them.

Joel and Ellie are not travelling across the USA to fight Fedra.

We are not going to agree since you have your viewpoints and I have mine.

Yeah but your position is almost "these type of dark shows with grim protagonists shouldn't exist."

[–] WarrenPeace (2267) 2 years ago

I don't mind if it exists.
Just that I am disappointed in the direction it is going.
At first I was into it.
Now not so much.

[–] Kennedy (110) 2 years ago

There's probably a lot of people that were similar of you, but 20 years down the line probably most of them have died, or are living in protected communities of some sort (QZs or otherwise).

The people left have been living without law and order for 20 years, in the beginning they got indiscriminately killed and bombed by the government, everyone had family members traumatically dying, maybe you had to kill some of them yourself, there will have been plenty of local food scarcities and you might have been forced to do some wicked stuff just to survive, everyone is traumatised as fuck and paranoid as fuck and everyone has weapons. There's ton of crazies around there, cults, cannibals, fascists. Then infected can jump you any minute or maybe the stranger you found will turn infected during the upcoming night.
There's way more men than women, and no law and order or society to control them so there's probably a shit-ton of rape.
Maybe you would be willing to share your food with a sympathetic stranger, but what if he is a scout for a group of 50, then your food supply that was supposed to last you years is suddenly gone.

If you tie someone up and shoot their friends, after they get liberated they probably want to take revenge, and it's not so easy to get away quickly. There's probably a lot of no-go-areas with zombies or human communities you don't want to cross (even at fedra they have a death penalty for going into or out of a QZ) and unless you are very lucky and find a working car battery or a horse, you only go 5km/h. So you don't want to leave witnesses.

[–] Skavau (15993) 2 years ago

What TV shows do you actually like, may I ask?

I genuinely suggest you simply don't watch MA media content. It sounds too gruesome for you.

[–] WarrenPeace (2267) 2 years ago

Yeah, you're right.
I am not used to such violent shows.
Mostly movies on cable channels since I cannot stand commercials.
Or reruns of sitcoms like Will & Grace that I have been getting into again.
Or the game show, Funny You Should Ask.

[–] Skavau (15993) 2 years ago

For context on how different we are, I have in my 'to watch list' a show about a virus that turns people into psychopathic serial killers rather than zombies.

[–] WarrenPeace (2267) 2 years ago

Serious or kidding around?
If serious, what is the name of it?

In thinking of the movies in my DVD collection I don't think all that many of them have guns.
If they do in a drama then it is not used in gratuitous ways or silly like in comedies.

[–] Skavau (15993) 2 years ago

The Sadness

[–] TheArgentinian (7108) 2 years ago

I don't mind the protagonist being a cold-blooded killer. What I mind is the double standards. That only MALE characters can get away with it and have the audience still cheer for them.

[–] Skavau (15993) 2 years ago

In this show specifically, or are you speaking generally?

[–] TheArgentinian (7108) 2 years ago

Generally.

[–] Skavau (15993) 2 years ago

Killing Eve says hi

[–] [deleted] 2 years ago

What do you mean? Doesn't the audience go for the protagonist male or female?

What about, for example, Uma Thurman in "Kill Bill", the girl who kills her rapists in "I Spit on Your Grave", or Geena Davis in "The Long Kiss Goodnight" ?

[–] TheArgentinian (7108) 2 years ago

Action movie by beloved director. Exploitation movie and the third one I haven't seen.

[–] [deleted] 2 years ago

But they still are valid examples and not part of that double standard you are talking about.

Anyways, there: "Atomic Blonde" where Charlize Theron is also an assassin (to replace "The Long Kiss Goodnight" that you haven't seen). It's not from a beloved director nor an exploitation movie.

Can you give me some examples of movies where the female protagonist is a cold-blooded killer that the audience is not cheering for ? Because I must not have seen them.

[–] TheArgentinian (7108) 2 years ago

Stop gaslighting me!

[–] [deleted] 2 years ago

Time is money. Any you know what they say about a fool and his money...

[–] Kendricks (2239) 2 years ago

"This bothered me because I didn't understand why humans would be at war with each other instead of all uniting to kill zombies."

You'd be among the first to die in a real apocalypse scenario.

[–] WarrenPeace (2267) 2 years ago

I probably would.
I have no idea for how to handle a gun.
I would end up shooting myself or others on my side accidentally.

How is that for honesty?
Probably not the reply you were expecting, was it?

[–] Kendricks (2239) 2 years ago

Never called you dishonest.
Also had no exact expectations regarding your reply, but honesty is always appreciated and the topic consider, you benefit the most from it.

Just some advice though... you should learn to shoot.

[–] WarrenPeace (2267) 2 years ago

I really hate guns so I can put that off until I come to that bridge, which I doubt I ever will.
I'm not that paranoid.

Besides I'm vegan and a lousy gardner, but god bless me I keep trying, so I'm fucked anyway.
I'll take up yoga so I can be flexible enough to kiss my ass goodbye.

[–] Kendricks (2239) 2 years ago

Well, at least you'll die with a sense of humor when the post-apocalypse cannibals butcher you.
There's always a bright side, I guess.

[–] WarrenPeace (2267) 2 years ago

LOL
Did you ever see Dawn of the Dead?
If you did then you would know what, "Choke on it!" means.
Yeah, that would be me!

[–] brux (14729) 2 years ago

> a show where they end up murdering a bunch of normal humans that were not zombies.

What episode was that?

[–] WarrenPeace (2267) 2 years ago

I dunno what year or episode number but there was this other group of survivalists that was hiding out in a bunker.

[–] Skavau (15993) 2 years ago

You are referring to the Saviors when Rick and co did a pre-emptive strike

[–] radarlove73 (119) 2 years ago

WarrenPeace (857) I wish we did live in a world where humans would, if the case arose, unite against a common enemy, but that would never happen as the majority, regardless of how they acted before any conflict, would become the worse versions of themselves. You only have to look at human attitudes in warfare for proof of this.