ending? SPOILERS!


So did Qohen plug in the suit and die and go to heaven thus disproving the zero therom or did bobs modified suit find q's soul or something
&
Why Was bob getting sick? Did he have a brain tumor or something that also cause his child genius stuff
& what was up with management? Was it all it q's mind?
someone please explain what they got from the movie. i was left scratching my head but ultimately feeling happiness and knowing that I just watched a beautiful film that left a lasting impression.

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good questions here. i was surprised by the ending. surprised it happened so soon, that is. was expecting more

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ultimately feeling happiness and knowing that I just watched a beautiful film that left a lasting impression


Sorry, but that is all you are supposed to find with a Gilliam film, for every viewer will get something different and new from this movie. Whatever you thought was the answer to your above questions, that IS the answer, becuase I am sure it will differ from mine, and that is the point

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Nice post. Had the same feeling in the end.

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I had the feeling it was such a chaotic mess, that it pleased my mind if just to see that our (my) order is not yet beyond saving or making sense. Fear doesn't fear fear, but fear fears no fear. A musing.

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[deleted]

I think it's a statement on religion. The whole film seems to be critical of religion in subtle jokey ways that seem like they're just jokes until management's speech at the end. Qohen is dying the whole movie, so he needs to have faith in something, his idea is the phone call for the meaning of life. Then, he dies in the sex suit thing. Management tells him that all of life is just a random one time occurence and he waisted his life waiting for the phone call. Then, accepting that there is nothing after death, Qohen lets the darkness suck him up. The final scene symbolizes him taking heaven and bringing it to reality by making the sun set in his paradise (a stand in for heaven). At least, that's what I got from the film.

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Thank you!
Now that I understand it, I hate it :)

I thought it was something more than a typical atheist subtext.

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[deleted]

Wow, a hateful muslim. What a surprise


Are you stupid or totally fuçk!ng stupid? What kind of thing is that to say?

There's only 2 things i hate more than religion, it's ignorance and racism and you seem to be an expert on both subject.

People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs

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Well, you could also argue that Qohen accepting nothingness is a sad ending. I just thought that was what the ending represents, but i could see it both ways. If it's a sad ending then the film says that purely the belief in a religion, true or not, is a good thing. It's a complex ending, so I'm sure people could get many different things from it.

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I think it's nothing as esoteric as heaven and all that.

Qohen felt incomplete and alone throughout the entire film, always waiting for something external to happen to give his life meaning, i.e. The Call. But in the end, he understood that although inspiration can be drawn from others, happiness needs to come from within and contentment thus allows oneself to shape one's future. Which as all things must come to an end, but it's up to you if there's a feeling of incompleteness (stuck in never-changing nirvana) or fulfilment at the end.

It's all a matter of perspective how you see the world.

That said, all of Gilliam's movies are expertly crafted, and this one is too, just with updated effects. I find it less poignant that other works, though. Where Brazil is a harsh critique with pessimistic outlook on the world (with the original ending) and The Fisher King and Dr. Parnassus are life-affirming experiences, this one lingers somewhere in the middle. Maybe it just struck a bit too close to home for me, as I could find myself in Qohen quite a bit. It was Faustian, the ever-seeking, but no Devil this time. The world is what we make it, within the confines of the rules that govern it.

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I believe the movie works on two levels, and both arrive at the same conclusion,
first of all you have a critique of modern life, its not an accident that he chose to depict the future as an otaku convention, with shut-ins, people partying with their I-pads and virtual reality sex, eating and vacations. (seriously as a completely different point, i cant believe how visionary was demolition man)
These are people completely connected trough net and technology and disconected from regular human interactions, they are living their life in front of the computer. And this influx of information has more costs, even bob says how bored he is at 15 years old, and the need for something new constantly.

Now you have this company, who does god knows what, but is apparently omnipresent(the camera of the ceo replaced the head of jesus at the church), and dedicates its employees to sorting collected data, and solving equations, (im guessing facebook evolved into that),the main secret project, is proving that the universe was an anomaly and that anomaly will be corrected, if the last scene is to be believed (providing that part is real) The CEO apparently wants to do it to acquire ore or drive its price up, by making people lose faith in the afterlife.

which brings us top the second level of the movie the religious aspect, as you can see there is a lot of religions going around, all announced like buisness, and all equally ridiculous (the church of batman), they even announce themselves as alternatives for people to whom buhddism and scientology have failed, and at the sidelines there is Qohen, a man that by his own admitance, has tried sex, drinking and marriage to fill a vacum in his existance, and now is wating for a phonecall that may or may not be real, but by everyone else's perespective but him, it isn't, to tell him what the meaning of his life is, but his seems to be a modern twisted monastic life, trading the prayer for searching in a computer, and expecting the answer trough a telephone, he even lives in a rundown church, that has "management" as a replacement for jesus.

Now getting closer to the point, the reason q was chosen was because he was a man who had been driven to a meaningless existance in the search for meaning, he was driven by faith, so they used that to entice him to solve this unsolvable problem, when he began to lose faith they used more secular bonuses (the call girl), who promises to fill out his emptiness with sunny beaches and love, the thing is that is still an interaction based on deceit and virtual reality, its not real life, and Q is quick to point it out several times, once by saying that the sun doesnt come down.

now finally on to the ending, whereas the ending is real or not, its stated in the film that it doesnt matter, what does matter is that he traded his own life in search for something that wouldnt come, and had discarded all posibilities to live a real life, in the first VR scene, he was in the call girls world, which was a sunny beach, and transforms it into a vast black hole, at the end the opposite occurs, he turns it into a sunny beach, which still is a fake one, with the twist that he creates the sunset to make it seem more real.

Now:
A)he died and went to heaven (unlikely since the movie seems to be agnostic at best and atheistic at worst, and he still doesnt get an answer, and the beach is digital)
B)he became part of the mancom neural network, and he destroyed it and gave it a new meaning,
C)it all happened in his own head(or soul) as he was told earlier that the answer was inside him all along.

sorry for the long post, i really like this movie, but it seemss that its puzzle and not all the pices are there, normally i can understand puzzling films after 2 maybe 3 watches(only exception was cosmopolis which took 4 watche sto understand completely every single conversation), however i dont see myself comprehending this anymore after watching it another time, it seems that pieces of the puzle are missing, and im sure thats how it was intended to be.

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I think you probably understand it better than most.

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Nice post, informative and well thought out thanks. I've only watched it the once so far, but my first thoughts of the ending were that he had already died, and was a construct in the neural net the whole time.

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thanks, yes that is also my personal opinion, that he is part of the neural net, i do believe that he destroyed it or changed it in some way, since there is a motif of Tools troughout the whole movie, He is being told several times that he is nothing more than a tool by both bob and management, and he produces the hammer and tells it its not "the right tool" before the destruction starts by a hit of that same hammer.

but then, everytime he used a hammer in the real world to destroy the computer it was promptly replaced, so who knows....

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Really nice post, thank you for your thoughts.

I think the movie spins in a lot of tangents and throws a lot of paradoxes at the viewer. Very infuriating :)

I don't get the ending really, and wonder how it connects to the zero theorem. Which isn't really that bleak, if everything amounts to nothing you can also make everything out of nothing. If we come from nothing, there are no limits. We could create a (digital?) heaven. But it's also a paradoxical.

And the end song "I want to be special" also seems to tie in to Q's choice in life and maybe also Terry Gilliam's. Might this movie simply be his ode to crazy?

Hard to even rate this movie yet.

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I enjoy movies like this. Ones that are not tied up in neat little bows but are designed to be talked about and thought about. The film has many layers and many ways that you can look at it, how many were intended, how many are just a product of what the audience brings? Who knows! I just know that I will enjoy rewatching the film at examining it from different angles, even the angles of those who did not like it, for they may have taken something completely different from the film than I did.

For example I saw someone basically call this a pro-atheist film, and that certainly is one way to look at it. But another would be to look at it as a film about faith, when the main character gives up looking for solid proof (the zero theorem and waiting for an actual call to tell him the meaning of life) and then chooses to basically go on a sort of spirit quest and end up a happier person for it.

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The movie certainly made quite a bit of mockery of religion. But I thought the "waiting for a call" was actually a spiritual / religious thought, not wanting proof but wanting to hear "god speak to him".

I wonder what a Buddhist would think about this movie and the void resembling Nirvana.

I thought that if everything came from nothing and adds up to nothing, it's actually brilliant because it also means you can create everything from nothing! Meaning the universe is actually infinite. In some way that was what happened in the end, after accepting the zero theorem he fell through the void and accepted the virtual reality where everything is possible.

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