If a vampire's heart doesn't do anything, why does staking them work? - Dracula (2013) Discussion

[–] lexyladyjax 11 years ago

Staking a vampire in the heart is metaphysical. It's also meant to be done in their coffin during the day. There the stake pins them to the ground, or that was the belief.

Some things you just can't ride around...

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[–] mythbustfan 11 years ago

according to some vampire myths, a vampire's "blood" becomes a substance called ichor that has to flow through the vampire's body like blood

even though the heart doesn't pump the ichor, it has to flow through the heart and veins like water in a river or it turns viscous and turns solid

by staking the vampire's heart, traditionaly by wood or silver, the vampire dies again

sometimes in the myths a vampire turns to dust and sometimes a body is left behind in this process, depending on how the story goes

before the Bram Stoker's Dracula, people killed as suspected vampires left the body behind

but this is only one explanation that is known

the rest, I don't know

guess the movie reference
Use you head, will ya?
You know what that is?
Its that lump 3 feet above your ass!

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[–] CountVladDracula 11 years ago

according to some vampire myths, a vampire's "blood" becomes a substance called ichor that has to flow through the vampire's body like blood

Who the Hell told you this and why are you claiming to be a fan of mythology while conveniently distorting real folklore? Do you have such little integrity that you LIE about folklore to try to make a TV show look better?

Sure. Why not? I just found out there are people on this board who have decided I'm a German man.

Ichor comes from GREEK mythology about the GODS and has NOTHING to do with vampiric lore. Maybe some new piss poor pulp novel but not actual lore.

And if you read Stoker's Dracula you would know that in his novel Dracula had a heartbeat. The staking stopped the flow of blood and paralyzed the vampire in a death-like state.

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[–] Modern-Prometheus 11 years ago

Where the hell do you get your vampire myth information?

I can't think of a witty signature right now. I like turtles.

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[–] DoctorShemp 11 years ago

even though the heart doesn't pump the ichor, it has to flow through the heart and veins like water in a river or it turns viscous and turns solid

Oh so like Dick Cheney....

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[–] mythbustfan 11 years ago

no the vamp HAS to have a heart first

Use you head, will ya?
You know what that is?
Its that lump 3 feet above your ass!

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[–] 11 years ago

[deleted]

[–] CountVladDracula 11 years ago

I asked this before and apparently the immature children who domimate this particular message board decided the best way to deal with me is to spread false rumors about me, which are now impacting me in the real world. Well done, boys and girls, you have hurt a five foot tall New Yorker woman by getting her readers to question her gender!

Anyway, your question is very valid. I asked this myself. In the actual Dracula story he definitely had a heartbeat but then again he could also walk in the sun in the original novel. He just could not turn into a bat, wolf, or mist during daylight hours.

Here's another weird detail, they're going out of their way to tell you that he cannot pump the serum. Well, how many times has he been in bed with Lady Jane and clearly done manly things that biologically, very much, require circulating blood to achieve? Certain sensual acts require circulating blood as much as spreading around a serum would. There's a long buried thread about this. I fled this board and only came back with the RUDE behavior of this board's regulars started to impact my REAL life!

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[–] mythbustfan 11 years ago

some people DO call the stuff that vampire's use instead of blood ichor, I never claimed that it was the SAME ichor as the Greek ichor, just that some people call it that

as far as to why "modern" vampires turn to dust or goop like in True Blood is probably becaue the vamps on Buffy the vampire slayer started it so every body does that now

also, I did say that this was the myth that I heard, there are probably hundreds of others that I don't know as since, as far as I know, vampires don't exist in real life, the writer of each individual vampire fiction has their own way of treating the myth

from bursting into flame in sunlight to having sparkly diamond like skin in daylight

so give me a break, ok?

guess the movie reference
Use you head, will ya?
You know what that is?
Its that lump 3 feet above your ass!

reply

[–] CountVladDracula 11 years ago

ome people DO call the stuff that vampire's use instead of blood ichor, I never claimed that it was the SAME ichor as the Greek ichor, just that some people call it that

What "Some people"? I collect books on folklore and the occult. There's no such reference.

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[–] freds7 11 years ago

@CountVladDracula do you have the names of some good books like that? Folklore, the occult, all that stuff. For a beginner who don't know sh!t. It's fascinating.

------
Dozens of times, lots of different ways. Every night, I save you.

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[–] Modern-Prometheus 11 years ago

Vampires: Burial and Death by Paul Barber is a great place to start. There's a ton of books out there that claim to have accurate vampire folklore information, when they're really just regurgitating popular misconceptions and nonsense. Barber is one of the sources you can trust.

I can't think of a witty signature right now. I like turtles.

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[–] freds7 11 years ago

Thank you, it's just that I'm actually looking for something that's not about vampires, but.. honestly, I don't even know.. witches, angels, monsters, creeps. Vampires are great, love 'em, but I'd love to learn more about the creatures that belong to the same category, only.. different.

------
Dozens of times, lots of different ways. Every night, I save you.

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[–] freds7 11 years ago

Ha, I still ordered it. Would love more suggestions though. Demons, and angels too (why not) would be great. Anything creepy or inherently evil.

------
Dozens of times, lots of different ways. Every night, I save you.

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[–] Imperatrixx 11 years ago

the RUDE behavior of this board's regulars started to impact my REAL life

If I were you, I'd really start asking myself some real serious questions about my real life. And I'd get the hell off this board already. *gigglesnort*

__________

"Did you call the hypothetical hardware store and buy a theoretical chainsaw?"

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[–] CountVladDracula 11 years ago

If I were you, I'd really start asking myself some real serious questions about my real life. And I'd get the hell off this board already. *gigglesnort*

I don't think you quite understand what was going on. It seems to have died down but someone on this board was following me all over the Internet and claiming I was a little German man among other things and deliberately taking things said out of context and accusing me of being anyone who tried to defend me. It got a little scary.

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[–] Imperatrixx 11 years ago

Yeah, I saw. I still can't fathom why in the world you'd even begin to give a crap about stuff that happens on the internet. Or what you're still doing here. I think you're kind of enjoying this to a certain level.

__________

"Did you call the hypothetical hardware store and buy a theoretical chainsaw?"

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[–] spasticfreakshow 11 years ago

simmer DOWN. i don't interact with you bc you are a drama queen. PERIOD. i AM interested in your knowledge of LORE, but you are so melodramatic, high and mighty that you stir up trouble. chill DOWN and others will too. it really is YOU creating the problems. PLEASE LET IT GO, as i would rather NOT put you on ignore, but you turn intelligent threads into children's babbling arguments.

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[–] 11 years ago

[deleted]

[–] viboraojo 9 years ago

Some people apparently don't realize bogey men are make believe and fans discuss statements and questions like yours for entertainment. Just ignore the yahoos who attack you and continue enjoying the stories.

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[–] DorkJelly 11 years ago

Do they even stake hearts in this show? Because I don't recall that. (just wondering)

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[–] OccamsBarber 11 years ago

Why does a cross burn Jewish vampires?
Somethings we just weren't meant to know.

---
"No matter where you go there you are."

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[–] weevil266 11 years ago

Why does a cross burn Jewish vampires?

It doesn't. They just pretend that it does to try to fit in.

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[–] OccamsBarber 11 years ago

So they'd be much harder to ward off. A star being much harder to improvise on the fly than two pieces of wood.

---
"No matter where you go there you are."

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[–] HarveyMidnight 11 years ago

Why does a cross burn Jewish vampires?

Hahahah.. there's a novellete called Midnight Mass, about how vampires began to prey on Jewish communities first, because the Jewish people flatly refused to use crosses to ward them off. They would have to accept as a FACT their faith was erroneous, and most of them just wouldn't do that.

There was one character, a rabbi, who had taken to wearing a crucifix, to protect himself. He had to compartmentalize his faith with pragmatism. "If a fire was consuming your house, would you refuse to throw water on it just because you'd always been taught not to believe in water?"

Interesting story, but it very much 'chose sides' in the question of religion and vampires. The power of Christ repelled them.

Sometimes fires don't go out when you're done playin' with them.

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[–] OccamsBarber 11 years ago

In my youth (the middle ages) I wrote a very long poem in which a Jewish vampire discovers he could only be warded by the Star of David.

---
"No matter where you go there you are."

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[–] mythbustfan 11 years ago

in one legend on vampires that I've heard, it's not so much the crucifix that wards of a vampire as the religous conviction of the person wielding that icon that wards them off

for example, a highly devote Jew weilding a cross would have no effect on a vampire, but a Star of David WILL ward them off

Likewise, an atheist with a cross/Star of David would have NO effect against a vampire either

BUT like I've said before, this is just one vampire legend I've heard of and since vamps aren't real, it's the writer's discretion if they follow it or not

name the movie quote
Use you head, will ya?
You know what that is?
Its that lump 3 feet above your ass!

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[–] OccamsBarber 11 years ago

I remember that from some movie. I liked that touch. Vampires are fun to play with

---
"No matter where you go there you are."

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[–] CountVladDracula 11 years ago

in one legend on vampires that I've heard, it's not so much the crucifix that wards of a vampire as the religous conviction of the person wielding that icon that wards them off

Yup. That's in the Dracula novel. It's not about it being a cross, it's about the faith behind the symbol.

In Goethe's Faust a pentagram can hurt and even ward off Mephisto.

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[–] Imperatrixx 11 years ago

Likewise, an atheist with a cross/Star of David would have NO effect against a vampire either

We atheists just use a photo of Richard Dawkins. XD

__________

"Did you call the hypothetical hardware store and buy a theoretical chainsaw?"

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[–] actionmanrandell 11 years ago

that would make no sense because if it had to do with belief and conviction an atheist could easily hold up some random book about science and use it to ward off the vampire because they have conviction and belief in science

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[–] mythbustfan 11 years ago

maybe it would maybe it wouldn't but given the fact that vampires AREN'T REAL, the whole point is moot anyway

name the movie quote
Use you head, will ya?
You know what that is?
Its that lump 3 feet above your ass!

reply

[–] JRC-6 11 years ago

an atheist with a cross/Star of David would have NO effect against a vampire either

Funny scene I once imagined was a vampire getting burned by a cross and shouting, "I'm an atheist! That's not supposed to hurt!"

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[–] CountVladDracula 11 years ago

Why does a cross burn Jewish vampires?
Somethings we just weren't meant to know.

Actually the explanation is it's about the faith of the person using the symbol. This means a symbol of any faith may work. In the Dresden Files Harry Dresden is able to use his pentacle against a vampire.

In Fred Saberhagen's Dracula books he explains it as psychosomatic and unintended hypnotic suggestion. The person using the symbol believes in it so strongly that this belief influences the vampire, whose psychic powers unconsciously pick up on the belief and so he physically responds to it.

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[–] 11 years ago

[deleted]

[–] spasticfreakshow 11 years ago

i like this line of questioning and would be interested to read your novel. yes, a magen david would fend off vampires for us - and jewish vampires would be safe from a cross. this makes sense.

HarveyMidnight's obnoxious post reveals the sickness of Christians that instigated the Crusades, pogroms, genocide perpetrated against American Indians (did you know the Europeans justified their extinction with smallpox blankets as the merciful end to savages who didn't know Jesus) and even the Holocaust. Just keep ASSUMING Christians are RIGHT and everyone else should join on board (or will go to hell, right?), even when you don't know your savior's real name, NOR do you know anything about his upbringing and what motivated him. Jews, on the other hand, we know far more about the Christian "messiah" than most of them ever will. Ironic, because we're not looking for it, yet by definition, we are more LIKE him. Your 'messiah' is actually my neighbor - his tomb was discovered by archaeologists on my street in Jerusalem. AND YET you don't come visit his grave bc you believe his body rose up. Very disrespectful, from the point of view of the Jewish tradition. We visit the graves of our prophets and Biblical patriarchs and matriarchs. Muslims with Mohammed too. Christians and Yeshua? They let his grave remain unvisited and covered in concrete, but they say we're wrong not to worship him. NOW THAT is chutzpah. YOU DON'T EVEN CARE ABOUT THE GUY, BUT WE SHOULD? HAHAHAHAHA!

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[–] Modern-Prometheus 11 years ago

HarveyMidnight's obnoxious post

Um, what? I believe he was mentioning a novel written by F. Paul Wilson and describing its contents. He was even annoyed by the very thing you seem to think he was doing, the assumption that Christians are right and whatnot. Did you even read his post?

I can't think of a witty signature right now. I like turtles.

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[–] spasticfreakshow 11 years ago

read his post where he gets up on his high horse about how EVEN THEN jews can't admit that christians are right. maybe YOU DID NOT READ IT. or your comprehension level of English is low.

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[–] Modern-Prometheus 11 years ago

I'm looking at his post in here, his only post from what I can see, and he's only talking about the book Midnight Mass and the context of the story F. Paul Wilson wrote.

Could you quote him exactly, where he said this?

I can't think of a witty signature right now. I like turtles.

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[–] spasticfreakshow 11 years ago

sure.

Hahahah. there's a novellete called Midnight Mass, about how vampires began to prey on Jewish communities first, because the Jewish people flatly refused to use crosses to ward them off. They would have to accept as a FACT their faith was erroneous, and most of them just wouldn't do that.

capitalize how it's a FACT that the guy whose name you don't even know is the real messiah, because in your crazy summation of a novel, you want to proselytize to the stupid jews on this board who still just don't get that your messiah - whose name you don't even know - is the real one. WAY TO SHOW THAT SOME CHRISTIANS ARE STILL JUST AS STUPID AS DURING THE CRUSADES.

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[–] Modern-Prometheus 11 years ago

He's clearly talking about the novel there. Not his views. The novel suggests that Christianity is "the right religion", and as a plot point, Jews are hunted down because their faith is "the wrong one". He's just describing what happened in the book.

I can't think of a witty signature right now. I like turtles.

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[–] spasticfreakshow 11 years ago

got to disagree with you. i understand what you're saying, but in capitalizing the word FACT, in USING the word FACT, he reveals his own anti-semitism. the whole quote i gave you in fact, is not the summation of a person who understands why jews might not worship 'jesus'...

by the way, i've been thinking how cute your signature is. there are some awesomely large turtles in Olympos, Turkey. a paradisaical little village by the sea, the whole area is a turtle sanctuary. you should check it out!

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[–] Modern-Prometheus 11 years ago

Yeah, he said FACT because in the novel, it is a FACT that Christianity is "right" and the Jews were wrong. I'm not wrong about this. Look at the rest of his post, even he is bothered by the notion.

I'm telling you, he was just talking about the book.

I can't think of a witty signature right now. I like turtles.

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[–] spasticfreakshow 11 years ago

i read his post and i did not get that 'even he is bothered by the notion'...i'm sure you mean well.

i know that many people are oblivious of the ever-present anti-semitism, but as a jew who's traveled widely and lived in many cities, many states, and even several countries, i've experienced it firsthand. sometimes at the hand of christians i'd befriended, who shared with me amy grant songs about how the jews just COULD NOT UNDERSTAND. it's possible we understand quite well. when someone is subtly taking pot shots.

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[–] Modern-Prometheus 11 years ago

I'm sorry, but you must be a simpleton or something. He is clearly describing the premise of a work of fiction. He is emphasizing a plot point. Nothing more. I don't know how else to explain it to you. This should be clear as day to you but you insist on believing that his description of Wilson's novel is somehow reflective of his own views, and it clearly is not. In all my years of posting on IMDb I have never encountered a reading comprehension problem this bad.

It sucks that you've had to deal with prejudice but that is not what happened here. You are reading something in his post that was never there. Wilson wrote a vampire novel in which the Jews were preyed upon by vampires because it was a FACT, in the context of the story and the world in which it is set, that Christianity is the right religion. That is all he was saying, and if you can't understand that, that's your problem.

I can't think of a witty signature right now. I like turtles.

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[–] mythbustfan 11 years ago

just because a person CLAIMS be to be a Christian doesn't mean they are following the true word of God

if so, then why are there a couple of hundred denominations of Christianity with a thousand different sub denominations of the church

even Jews have sub-sects of Judism (Hassidic, Orthodox etc) and their teaching are more centered on the Jewish faith than Christianity

Muslims seem to be even more seperated in their faith than Christians are which is why a charismatic Imam can turn some into terrorist thinking that by killing innocents, they're actually following Allah's and Mohammed's word

the way a person translates the words of God is different for everyone in those religons and if you have "cults of personality" spewing what they think is the why of God, disaster usually strikes

just like the Muslim terrorist, just like the crusaders, the Spanish Inquisition, the Nazis, the Branch-Davidians or the people from the Heaven's Gate cult who committed suicide in order to join aliens in a spaceship in the tail of the Halle-Bopp comet in the 90s

when you take out the love in the Word of God, all that's left is hate

BTW this is coming from an atheist point of view

guess the movie quote
Use you head, will ya?
You know what that is?
Its that lump 3 feet above your ass!

reply

[–] 11 years ago

[deleted]

[–] HarveyMidnight 11 years ago

Wow.. don't know how I missed this conversation previously... now I'm feeling the need to explain my position.

I am an extremely odd bird in that I am a pro-religion atheist. I recognize the good that a church can do for a community--- it can bring people together under a common set of morals and values, encourage them to work together, help others, be more understanding.

I don't 'choose sides'-- fact is there are some very fine and respectable lessons you can learn in many of today's organized churches. I am not in ANY way, a militant atheist who thinks religion does more harm than good.

The guy critizing me was WAAAY off.. no way would I support the idea that Christianity is somehow superior to Judaism. Neither would I mockingly insist any religion is 'erroneous'--- because as a believer in logic, I know I could very well be wrong in my own assumption about there being God out there or not.

My conclusions are right for me... I don't insist they are right for others... and all I ask is that others NOT insist their conclusions are right for me.

Yes, Ninja, you were correct--- my comment about it being a 'fact' that the Jewish religion is erroneous was ONLY (there are those infernal caps again)... ONLY a summation of the plot of the novel, and doesn't in any way reflect my personal view. When I said "but it very much chose sides", I meant to be critical of this aspect of the plot.

BUT.... before you get the wrong impression about the book-- the rabbi and the priest are central characters, they are wonderful friends, and prior to the vampire apocalypse they worked together to encourage loads of community outreach programs and had their respective church and synagogue working in unison. The story is NOT some kind of anti-Jewish propaganda, and I apologize for making it appear so.

Sometimes fires don't go out when you're done playin' with them.

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[–] bart-229 11 years ago

I wondered why, if vampires have no breath, Dracula pants so much on exerting himself physically. I don't know--maybe these stories are just fantasy or something.

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[–] fastoutfield 11 years ago

Not only that: if vampires don't breathe, how does Spike smoke?

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[–] rosiepenguin98 11 years ago

How does he sing?
Or talk? How do vampires talk if they don't breathe? Surely they must breathe sometimes even if they don't need to.

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[–] jetset_2002 11 years ago

Im curious on how Dracula can achieve an erection without circulation. Is there some sort of vampire viagra? Or did he perhaps have an erection when he was turned, and is therefore roaming the earth with a constant boner?

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[–] mythbustfan 11 years ago

if erections last longer than 500 years, please talk to your local mortician immediately

name the movie quote
Use you head, will ya?
You know what that is?
Its that lump 3 feet above your ass!

reply

[–] Zantor169 10 years ago

Well according to lore, vampires were recently deceased people who rose from the grave any night to plague / feed on the living, usually loved ones who wronged them in life. They would drive a wooden stake through the heart to pin them to the ground to prevent them from rising at night. Then hollywood got a hold of it and it morphed into what we know it as today in movies and series.

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[–] [email protected] 10 years ago

Blame it on John Polidori! Prior to the release of his novel (The Vampyre: A Tale, 1819) vampires had always been (both in folklore and fiction) revenents, literally living corpses. More like what we today call 'Zombies'. However Polidori based his vampire, Lord Ruthven, on his employer, Lord Byron. He made him young, handsome, sexy and very attractive to the ladies. And from then on vampires ceased being living corpses and became handsome, suave lady killers (literally). Hollywood jumped on this and just about every cinematic vampire (and some of the more recent literary ones) have always been attractive and indulge in sexual activity. Which, as you rightly say is nonsense. To get an erection you need blood flow..something vampires lack.The whole 'penetration of the skin and exchanging of blood' is a substitute for actual sex! That's how vampire's reproduce..not by sex! Also it makes me laugh so much when women fall naked into a vampires arms or roll around in bed with one. Have you ever had your partner put their icy cold feet or hands on your naked skin in bed?? It's a bit of a shock, isn't it!? Well imagine an entire body that feels like that because that's how a naked vampire would feel..totally ice cold..because they're DEAD!! Every woman who's had sex with a vampire(Buffy..Mina Murray..that dozy bint in the Twilight series) should all scream and leap six feet in the air when their warm naked flesh is embraced by a ice cold , naked vampire!

Polidori also made his vamnpire an aristocrat. From that point on no self respecting vampire could go without a title. Sir Francis Varney..Lady Ducayne..Count Von Krolock, Graf Orlock,Baron Meinster and of course Count Dracula.

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[–] Hecate-3 10 years ago

It wouldn't be ice cold; it would be room temperature. But Yes, you have a valid point.

I also wonder why a woman, who was as experienced as Lady Jayne was implied to be, never noticed the absence of certain post-coital fluids. Or does Dracula produce some facsimile thereof?

But the bottom line probably is that sex sells so they included all the sex scenes purely for fanservice.

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[–] tuula-1 10 years ago

She was probably just too polite to remark on that, just thought he has some 'issues'.

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[–] Hecate-3 10 years ago

That would be a more plausible theory if, like Lucy and Mina, she were unaware that vampires were real. As a vampire hunter, it's exactly the sort of thing she should have noticed, and coupled with his body being room temperature it should have been a dead giveaway (pun intended).

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[–] nataliebird2000 10 years ago

Ha ha ha ha haaaaaa

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