Daughter's Decision SPOILERS - Jodaeiye Nader az Simin (2011) Discussion

[–] VicBooth 12 years ago

The choice of the mother would signify the true end of the Nader and Simin's marriage because she could then move away so that's why I think the daughter was crying so much, because she was going to choose the mother.

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[–] rockin_metal_baz3310 12 years ago

Its so hard to think who she would choose, caus I keep putting my self in her position.

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[–] melinda2001 9 years ago

Earlier she had said that she knew that her mother would not leave if she stayed with her father. If she wants them to reconcile, then it makes sense that she'd choose to stay with her father. Maybe that's what she's discussing with the interrogator as the credits roll and that's why the discussion is taking so long.

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[–] scmema 12 years ago

She chose nobody, I think that's the point of the whole movie..

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[–] dougla_1 12 years ago

She does choose a parent. That was unambiguous.

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[–] sageonelove 12 years ago

I think the daughter chose her mother even though she felt her father and grandfather needed her more. Her father wasn't going to change, wasn't going to yield to reason or pleading.

Nader put her in one horrible moral dilemma after another, forcing her to lie and commit a sin, somthing she took very much to heart. She saw and related to where her mother was coming from, her father's behavior must have seemed so hypocritical to her teen aged mind.

Ultimately youth owes it to itself to be self preserving, to do what is most in keeping with self interest. Like someone said (maybe it was the mother) the senile grandfather was the past, the daughter and her education was the future.

When the father passes (and it didn't look like he had long) maybe Nader will re-think his behavior and join his wife and daughter where they are in their new life. Dealing with the decline of a beloved parent clouds one's thinking, maybe when the grief lifts the father will see where his life really is.

What a wonderful thoughtful insightful movie.

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[–] film_ophile 12 years ago

sageone, i completely agree with you and your observations, except your last paragraph. Another poster on a different thread said that the family all wearing black at the end- showed that the grandfather had died and they were in mourning. If this is correct, then he is not changing his mind so far. We also saw not one significant sign that he would ever change his mind toward her; i saw no love there myself. And i sure hope she moves forward and out of this unloving relationship.

I also think that the girl had finally begun to clearly see her father's duplicity and selfishness, a recognition that would likely keep her with her mother.

The way to have what we want
Is to share what we have.

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[–] sageonelove 12 years ago

I hadn't noticed the black .. but you make a good point. I am just a hopeful person but you're right the father will probably not change. Too bad, they could have had a great life.

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[–] film_ophile 12 years ago

MAYbeee, but we really weren't given much to think he COULD make a great life with her.

The way to have what we want
Is to share what we have.

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[–] dougla_1 12 years ago

I agree with film_ophile. The father is stuck in patriarchy and "honor" pride. Mother and daughter (decidedly realized by the end of the film) have grown apart from him. He refuses to change, and worst doesn't even see the need to for the well being of his family. Change would be revolutionary for him, but in my view it would be more spiritually rewarding and more life affirming for him, his daughter, and his wife.

Another fascinating exploration of the dynamics of this Iranian family would be if the child was a boy of the same age.

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[–] VicBooth 12 years ago

That's quite one sided. I think you're ignoring a lot of blame that was meant to be directed at Simin. She's not entirely innocent in the film either. Honour isn't completely ridiculous and he was somewhat justified in not wanting to admit blame unless he was to blame.

A lot of her actions ignored his honour in the interest of the least complicated resolution. Such things aren't as important to us a Westerners as they are in those cultures. I personally think hey represented a polarity in the film's message.

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[–] dougla_1 12 years ago

Simin was prepared to return a couple of times for the sake of her daughter. She obviously cares about her husband; she was willing to sell her possessions to move forward with him. The "honor" I write about was not about clearing his name in the case of the pregnancy miscarriage, but his manly honor in that his wife had walked out on him.

Yes, the film is fairly even handed in tone, but the husbands without really intending to are constantly sabotaging or disrupting their wives' desire to coexist as separate thinking individuals. There are separations of several sorts in the film.

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[–] rlb1957 12 years ago

She chose no one. Its up to us to decide who we think she would have choosen and why. I think there can be points on both sides. It was a little hard to follow since I don't know the culture and I think you need to to understand the issues. One was how the pregnant woman couldn't wash up the old man. I didn't understand why the husband went to the bank to get the job and then never went. If the father lied about knowing she was pregnant then he should have paid the money. Or if he knew his father caused her to be
hit by the car maybe he would have paid some money to her.

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[–] VicBooth 12 years ago

She chose no one. Its up to us to decide who we think she would have choosen and why.

Hence, the entire purpose of this message board.

I can’t help you with your questions as you seem to have some fundamental misapprehensions over the plot.

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[–] veryhornyfox 12 years ago

Very interesting to see many people against Nader, the father. To me he is the hero of the film, morally he is the best of most of the adult characters in the film. Nobody is perfect. Struggling to understand why people side with the mother for leaving the daughter without a mother in the family home. And not forgetting that she was ready to accept the father's guilt straight away, even saying to someone else, that yes he pushed Razieh and killed her when she didn't really know. For me the father's story is that of how someone largely good can make a very slight error and be very much punished for it, but also the story of standing up for yourself with great decorum in difficult circumstances.

As for who she chooses, I think she relates more to the father even when she is not convinced of his innocence. At the end when she finds out he is innocent and defended his honour all the more reason to stay with him. Earlier in the movie she stays with the father even when he says she can choose. Later, to get her to go with the mother, he has to pretty much order her out. Can't see what would change her mind later.

Then again, who knows for sure. She could decide either way.

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[–] NegNeg 12 years ago

I think the whole point of not showing which one she chooses,is that IT DOESN'T MATTER... in each scenario the family is ruined... what seemed to be a trick by simin to convince nader to come along with her to US, now becomes a real seperation that is destroying all 3 of them. just because of very little ignorant lies... (that's why she cries so hard in the end, she knows nothing good comes out of her decision)

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[–] takaladdie-net 11 years ago

I think you have it there, NegNeg.
In the end, everybody lost.

I think in the last scene in the hallway, you can see Simim looking at him, waiting for him to do something, perhaps apologise or change his mind or something.... or perhaps she is looking at him and realising that everything has gone to pieces. Who knows..

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[–] 11 years ago

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[–] ezzy666 12 years ago

I think she decided to live with another relative or be sent to a boarding school.

Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt.

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[–] 12 years ago

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[–] Geeky Randy 12 years ago

She chooses the father because she knows if she stays with him, her mother will always be around.

The final shot (over the credits), symbolizes the family's future. They will stay together (i.e. the mother and father in the same room), but will not be at each other's side. The only way for this to happen is if the daughter picks the father.

Votes: 2097
Reviews: 135 (http://www.imdb.com/user/ur0756238/comments)

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[–] 12 years ago

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[–] Geeky Randy 12 years ago

And the dumbest response [I don't mean to be rude to Randy or anyone else]

Nice try, but if you were really interested in a civilized disagreement, you would have made an effort to find a different word than "dumbest".

I remember when somebody asked the same question

That wasn't a question. That was a statement.

I am amazed how everyone wants to know about the ending and yet, nobody reads even one single director interview.

Why do the viewers have to resort to an interview to understand the film itself? If there is a definitive answer, it should be in the film. The fact that it is unclear leaves room for people to interpret it differently.

He clearly said more than hundred times what happens in the end.

Then why didn't he show it? The film addresses her choice to choose his father and why it would be the logical choice in the daughter's mind. Please pinpoint where she has such a change of heart and chooses Simin?

Votes: 2097
Reviews: 135 (http://www.imdb.com/user/ur0756238/comments)

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[–] 12 years ago

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[–] franche-comte 11 years ago

I think that she chose her mother.
The father was using her to get back at his wife who left him and hurt his pride. He was lying to her, he broke his promise, he was trying to accuse his wife of trying to cause a rift between him and his daugher but he was actually guilty of it himself. He was pressurizing her to side with him using emotional blackmail (I'll only take your mother back if you betray me emotionally by finding me guilty), and he knew that she did not want them to divorce, but he did not care - his anger at his wife was more important. He was manipulative and did not care that he caused his daughter anguish. He put her in a position where she had to lie to the judge to keep him out of prison, it had to be very hard for an 11 year old. He was stubborn and proud and he did not want to let go, he had to prove his right at all cost. I do understand him and his hurt feelings/situation, but I believe that his stiff-neckedness scarred his daughter and broke his family.

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