How could she still have parental rights after the trauma she loads on her kid. Also how is she not locked up. So far fetched its a joke. I don't live in the States but in all the shows I watch Child Services are called if a parent looks at their kid funny, here she can mentally damage her for life and she still gets to keep her, somebody explain it to me.
shareAll of this stuff with Franny this year is contrived. It was last year and it is this year. There is no good reason for them to be doing this. After tonight's episode I'm really beginning to believe they don't have a clue that what they're doing is so contrived.
sharethis has happened with a few of these shows (Dexter, Lost, etc)
they go for broke in hopes of being renewed.
pregnancy is one of the tropes used -- but then you're stuck with kid and the task of writing around it.
maybe this custody thing will make her go away.
But she did indeed have problems with Child Services -- Franny was taken away from her last season and she had to jump through hoops to get her back.
Granted, what's happening this season would qualify for her to be taken away again, but CPS doesn't know yet, unless Carrie's sister reports it -- and it looks like she wants to.
I wish they'd never written in a child resulting from Carrie and Brody's relationship. At first it made for a good "OMG!" thing where Brody "lives on" in a sense.
But then they did nothing with that legacy! Franny doesn't "do" anything in the story of the show. She's just there, and she could be ANYBODY'S kid, it doesn't even ever get mentioned that she's Brody's. He's now a forgotten memory almost, as the show has moved on far beyond his initial storyline.
Carrie having this kid is just an empty drag on the storylines now; when [spoiler] they raided Dante's apartment[/spoiler] I honestly thought they would take that opportunity to get Fanny killed in the crossfire, but no. They need to ditch the child so that Carrie can just be Carrie.
I think they'll ditch the kid thru this custody battle. Carrie will give her up to her sister instead of fighting the idea.
shareYep, it's the only solution, both from a writing point of view to clean up the storylines of dead wood, and also from the characters' lives point of view.
Harsh as it sounds, (!) I'd rather the kid would be killed outright in the line of Carrie's work, but it's probably too soon to have yet another massive personal tragedy right after the same happening to Quinn.
Glad you two are not TV writers.
share> all the shows I watch Child Services are called if a parent looks at their kid funny
Watch less TV! ;-) Yeah, this is done to promote a plot quickly or portray unfairness and tweak people's emotions. It does happen that people try to use CPS, APS - Adult Protective Services, to manipulate people. I had a Real Estate guy call APS when acting as Conservator for a sick parent, and then agent told me I should sell their house. I told him we were not interested and he file a false report against me. APS came out, said everything was all right, and helped me file a complaint against the realtor. But they have to investigate.
I agree with your complaint though, but I think this is used to add even more tension to the plot. Carrie ought to be smart enough to mediate between the two loves of her life, country and daughter, and realize that the best thing for Frannie is to live with her sister. I guess we are supposed to realize that Carrie is sick and cannot make these decisions, but even criminals and drug addicts have the awareness of what is good for their kids and leave them with parents or grandparents when their lives are in crisis.
I don't think Frannie is going to be damaged for life, the problem is that taking her out of the stable home, and then putting her in the middle of a national security espionage operation where guns were drawn, and her mother was screwing her mark in the next room is incompetence at best and abuse at worst. Carrie should have had better judgement than that. I think the crack-up when she leaves the school to connect with Dante at the hospital
Also, is it not understood that the first run-in she had with CPS was fake? That it was instigated by Dar Adal to manipulate Carrie? And so, what happens when because of Carrie's work cracking Dante saved the country from a Russian takeover basically, and she wins a Medal of Honor ... does that mean she gets Frannie back?
As much as there are cracks in this show and plot, it is gripping, thought-provoking, very suspenseful and just all around absolutely brilliant.
Although we know that Dar Adal instigated the first report to CPS, therefore that much was fake, wasn't the rest real, though?
By which I mean, a real CPS agent genuinely investigating Carrie and therefore it doesn't matter if the report that triggered it was by a manipulator with a covert scheme, or just a concerned neighbor like in ordinary life, the result was real in that the real CPS department could have taken Frannie away.
I like the Franny character. It’s cute she looks like Brody.
Carrie is not a fit parent, but Franny needs her in her life. The sister should get full custody and Carrie have full visitation, though perhaps supervised until she gets her illness back under control with legal meds.
Frannie is what is left of Brody's presence on the show. She needs to be there and help us remember what happened with Brody and what he did in sacrificing himself for Carrie. I love Frannie and want her with Carrie. Maggie only did what she did out of spite, not true love. She was the one who threw Carrie out of the house and drove her to Dante's place. Instead of trusting Carrie, she chose to believe bad things about Carrie. Maggie should know by now that nothing Carrie does has a bad intent. Maggie's just pissed daddy loved Carrie more than her. Spite is no reason to take a kid away from her mother.
shareI agree, Maggie is acting out of spite, and also kind of a control freak thing.
However, I disagree that Frannie needs to be there to help us remember about Brody. I feel like that use of her character just isn't being utilized at all, as it never even gets mentioned or becomes part of anything written into the story, regarding Frannie.
She's now just "there," and besides the fact that we all know from watching that she's Brody's legacy, she could almost just be anybody's kid. The fact that she's supposed to be the ongoing echo of Brody doesn't seem to come in to play at all, and, now, as a character, Frannie is just kind of an appendix organ, which I think is poor writing.
Carrie got her hackles raised with all the stress piled on her. When she cooled down in the hearing she saw the light. That was reasonable, but in the meantime she did some very dangerous things. Her life is based around the CIA and being an American patriot.
The thing that makes more sense to me to ask is how she lives with all the trauma that she has seen. It all looks great in TV land, but she has a lot of death and violence and trauma in her. Her responsibility for what happened to Peter Quinn, and what she let happened. The great thing about this show is how Carrie driven and wound up so tight it take electric shocks to relax her from all the trauma and feelings she has to shove down into unconsciousness.
We see it every day, TV shows where the stars have to kill someone every episode, and so we rarely consider what that would be like. Most police do not even have to remove their guns from their holsters in their whole career, but Carrie has seen death and violence that is unbelievable. There are psychological effects from that that are not even considered ... it is presented as cool, and super cool for a girl.
I wish they would make some effort to show that.
If you think Carrie shouldn't be able to parent, than neither should Maggie. She broke the law by being Carrie's doctor and prescribing her and running her blood work. Carrie could have blown Maggie's life apart by revealing those papers. Maggie could have lost her license to practice medicine. Carrie acted as a parent and sister by allowing Maggie to keep Frannie. All I wanted was for Maggie to be given a good ole bitch slap for what she did. And I'm pissed Saul didn't come and be a witness for Carrie.
shareTotally agree about Maggie. She's being a heavy-handed bitch, and it's not all out of a pure concern for Frannie.
I don't know why Carrie doesn't remember that she could RUIN Maggie with the shenanigan prescriptions revelation if she wanted to.
Maggie's "concern" wasn't so concerning when she went to the lawyer. This was pure spite and nothing more. She's been on Carrie's ass all season long. What she said about Saul coming calling and Carrie jumping is blatantly a way for her to shame Carrie. She knows that Carrie has worked for and with the CIA. Instead of understanding what that means, Maggie chose to make it about her own needs. The credit card overages isn't really her concern. She should have given Carrie some understanding, if not outright a pass given what she's done in the past. Maggie seems to forget the bomb Carrie thwarted in Germany. And don't tell me Maggie didn't know about that.
Carrie knew she could ruin Maggie, unlike Maggie she chose not to. Same as Maggie could have chosen to support Carrie and her continuing to be a mother to Frannie as she has been so far. Instead Maggie chose to impugn Carrie's character and to take the one thing away from Carrie that has kept her sane. Maggie should know this given their father's issues. I have no passes for Maggie. Taking a child away from her mother is big. Maggie crossed a line I won't soon forget.
I'm totally with you.
I hate Maggie.
At this point, it's clear that in Maggie's jaundiced view Carrie can do no right. I hate the way Maggie's face even has that look all over it of "you poor, insane delusional liar" when Carrie even says something about the work she's doing. There is now no saying anything to Maggie that she respects, from Carrie, now. And I do think that is profoundly unfair.
I have a sister who has dealt me that kind of "talk to the hand" rough justice.
And that is my point. Maggie is choosing to believe Carrie is delusional rather than believing her when she says the country/president is under attack and she's working to save both. It's that lack of respect that is my problem with Maggie on the whole. Why couldn't she continue to support Carrie. She knew of Carrie's issues when she was pregnant with Frannie and how Carrie doubted her ability to parent. Carrie made that decision to be Frannie's mother with Maggie's full support, but now all of a sudden Carrie can't parent because of her job? Nice hit below the belt there Maggie. Inconsistency be thy name.
I also have no love for Maggie's creep husband. That's all I get from him is the creepy vibe.
Oh god that husband, yes! With his snide remarks to Carrie. Most brothers-in-law kind of stay out of sister trouble instead of piling on. He piles on.
shareYep, that's how I felt about it. All I could think of when I saw him was what kind of a creeper he is. Also could you refresh my memory it's been a while since I saw seasons one and two, but didn't Maggie have two daughters not just the one?
shareOh, I can't recall either, about Maggie's kids! Seasons 1 and 2 feel like a lifetime ago. I wouldn't be surprised if they quietly changed the family head-count though -- I think they did that in Happy Days, famously, lol!
shareI was right. Checking at the Homeland Fandom site it has two daughters listed Ruby and Josie.
http://homeland.wikia.com/wiki/Maggie_Mathison
I'm thinking Ruby is the oldest and perhaps is at University or something. Josie is the youngest and therefore still in high school.
Soaps add one kid and subtract six all the time. Kids have even gone up to the attic and never been seen or heard from again. On the former soap opera All My Children, show diva Erica Cane got an abortion back in the 70s. However, in the 2000s, that "abortion" came back as a living breathing young man. Apparently the "abortion" was transferred to another woman who carried the pregnancy to term.
Wow, you have a better memory than I do! You're correct about the two daughters.
Lol, RE the transferrable fetus! I guess that's All My Children for ya, anything's possible!
Maggie should have suffered for covering for Carrie so that Carrie could work?..
That's... uhm... an interesting outlook on things. And you surely have a peculiar understanding of gratitude.
If I write prescriptions for you off books isn't that illegal? Isn't that risking my license? Sorry if we have an odd understanding of Maggie's hubris.
shareTo exater, not quite; what's being said is that Maggie has a nerve wanting to prove Carrie an unfit mother -- which will have to involve tattling on all the ways in which she's done risky things -- while Maggie herself has broken the law in ways that could drum her out of the doctor business, in a nutshell.
Carrie could equally ruin Maggie's life for that, but instead Maggie is conveniently forgetting her own dodgy ethics and being heavy handed about Carrie's.
It's classic 'pot calling the kettle' is what we're noting about Maggie's high horse she's on.
What I feel should have happened is this: When Carrie asked to speak to Maggie alone away from the lawyer, Carrie should have shown her what was in the envelope. Carrie then should have said to her, "This ends right now. You don't take Frannie away from me and I won't let it be known you wrote scripts and ran blood work for me. I don't want to wreck your life Maggie, but it seems that's what you're trying to do to me. You've not given me any support since I moved here and nothing would have happened with Frannie if you hadn't forced me to walk out. Quit sabotaging me. You're just like mom."
share