MovieChat Forums > The Man in the High Castle (2015) Discussion > Resistance Headhunting Julianna

Resistance Headhunting Julianna

posted 8 years ago by doranbriscoe
11 replies | jump to latest

I'm completely blown away by the all-around quality of this show. The one thing I don't necessarily agree with, though, is how petty the Resistance is in regards to Julianna. I can accept that they're imperfect, but the way they will stop at next to nothing to see her dead is kind of irksome to me. So what, she lost a film (which she made amends for with the MITHC). So what that she let one Nazi get away. Risking your secrecy and lives to shoot at her in public? (Which both coast resistances did, by the way.) And then they blame her for the girl operative getting killed by the Japanese guards? What?

It just doesn't make sense as to why the resistance sees her as such a threat, when the revered MINTHC is on good terms with her. And if revenge is their main motive in killing her, that doesn't make sense either, because why would they focus more on getting a vengeance killing rather than their main objective, which is, you know, to overthrow the proven bad guys (with as much help as they can get)?

For me, this appears to be the only major weakness within the story, and really just feels like a stretch in order to carry the plot along. I understand the main characters need to have a fire burning beneath them in order to provide motivation, tension and conflict, but I guess it just bothers me that the people who are supposed to be the only ones willing to stand up for the ideals of freedom are also inherently petty and underhanded, for no good reason.

[–] ehaas-3 8 years ago

I think it's that many (not all)members of the Resistance don't actually have democratic or humanistic values. They are highly authoritarian themselves and I wouldn't like to live in a state some of them would found if they won.

The way they treat Juliana reminds me of how terrorist organizations and Communist revolutions treat their members.

[–] Mononoke-hime 8 years ago

Hawthorne Abendsen didn't order to kill her.

It was the creepy Gary Connell who tried to kill her. Karen didn't agree with him, but she was frightened enough not to say anything.

George Dixon wanted her dead, too. He knew the Resistance would try to strangle her. He wasn't better than the Nazis. Juliana saw it and acted rightfully when she shot him.

Most people cannot accept that the show doesn't portray the fictitious Nazis as 100 % bad and the fictitious Resistance as 100 % good.

As in real life, there are shades of grey. This is why the series is good.

It makes you think: How would I behave in a situation like this?

Juliana tries to make humane decisions. That's why she is hated by all, the Nazis, the Japanese and the Resistance. And that's why, in the end, she says to Abendsen that she has no place left to go.

[–] ehaas-3 8 years ago

Hawthorne Abendsen didn't order to kill her.

It was the creepy Gary Connell who tried to kill her. Karen didn't agree with him, but she was frightened enough not to say anything.

Yea, I know. I think Abendsen is definitely good and the rest are a mixture like any group of people, but a few are barely distinguishable from the Nazis. It's probably safe to assume that if there is a person who is acceptable in the Resistance, there are some other examples of their type in it as well.

As in real life, there are shades of grey. This is why the series is good.

It makes you think: How would I behave in a situation like this?

Absolutely.

Juliana tries to make humane decisions. That's why she is hated by all, the Nazis, the Japanese and the Resistance. And that's why, in the end, she says to Abendsen that she has no place left to go.

I think Joe is kind of like her, too.

[–] isabellaxxac 8 years ago

I think Joe is kind of like her, too. >>>

I love this; so true . I think her and Joe are very much alike, hope they end up together. Franks a dullard

[–] Mononoke-hime 8 years ago

Joe?

Actually, in this season he has become totally indecisive and a laggard.

He clearly doesn't know what to do and who he should trust. He dislikes the Nazi behaviour (bombing of the ship) - and then dives right in (when he is sworn in on the new chancellor).

And Nicole is like poisonous bait, always trying to hold him back in Germany.

BTW, isn't Frank Frink dead?

Or do you think that the timeline reset changed his fate?

[–] Korios 8 years ago

BTW, isn't Frank Frink dead?
Or do you think that the timeline reset changed his fate?

Nothing was reset, and Frank Frink of that timeline is most definitely dead (if both he and Kido survive that bombing it will be too ridiculous). You do not appear to have paid attention to the talk between TMITHC and Juliana : There were some tapes with potential futures, where in all of them but one San Francisco (and, unknown even to TMITHC -which suggests he is from the same timeline and he is just handed over the tapes- almost half the rest of the world) is annihilated.

Imagine it like reaching a crossroad which leads to many other roads. One of them is optimal, and all the rest lead to disaster. In this case the optimal road was chosen and at that moment all the other potential ones (aka not existing in parallel realities, like "our" reality) were erased. However the road toward the optimal path and beyond it, in the optimal path (where the show is now) is still linear. Nothing was reset and most certainly that "road"'s past was not and could not have been affected in any way.

You do not even need TMITHC's information to realize the above, just a bit of common sense. There was no reset because no sort of time travel or any transfer of information to the past(specifically to a point before the bombing of the Kempetai building) took place, so there could have been no reset.

Fanboy : a person who does not think while watching.

[–] isabellaxxac 8 years ago

Most people cannot accept that the show doesn't portray the fictitious Nazis as 100 % bad and the fictitious Resistance as 100 % good.

Yes. Very true. Do any Jews watch this show just by Interest?

[–] doranbriscoe 8 years ago

Most people cannot accept that the show doesn't portray the fictitious Nazis as 100 % bad and the fictitious Resistance as 100 % good.

You all have brought up some good points, and your differing opinion/ perspectives is what I'd hoped for in posting.
Don't get me wrong, though- I definitely do like the moral imperfection of the Resistance. Maybe some may disagree, but I do believe that this delicate balance between right and wrong that most of the characters struggle with is one of the things that makes this show so compelling. So I definitely agree with that.

My complaint is just that it seems to go a little overboard with the Resistance at times, bordering on the extreme. But yeah, there have been good points made that I can get on board with, like how extreme individuals can be in terrorist organizations, and just that it could be the individuals taking it upon themselves to want to kill her for their own benefit.
And maybe it's also some wishful thinking on my part that the Resistance starts showing some more of its better attributes too, haha.

[–] smithjgs 8 years ago

The one thing I don't necessarily agree with, though, is how petty the Resistance is in regards to Julianna.

They have good reason to not trust her and their whole thing is to get rid of the opposition and their collaborators.

It all makes sense although it was silly to try and kill Julianna until the plan was complete. They have now lost two top people because they couldn't wait 2 days to kill her.

If I were you, I'd wanna be me too. 

[–] NotASpeckOfCereal 8 years ago

While I agree with you that it's not squeaky-clean perfectly done, that mostly it's just a plot device to explain Juliana defecting to the Nazis. The show runners wanted to get her in the Reich under Smith's nose, have her be a party to the whole thing with Thomas's illness, etc.

But as another user pointed out, that Gary Connell guy was a real *beep* And since he was hell bent on doing her in (you know, lose ends and all that), it could have been his word sent across the wire to the east coast for those remote operatives to snub her out. They don't necessarily know the big why, just that a high-ranking resistance member told them to off her if she showed up. And she did, so shoot out time in the market.

Brevity is the soul of wit.

[–] Korios 8 years ago

I found particularly interesting that no-one blamed Gary, aka the real responsible for the death of Karen. I mean no-one blamed him at all. Juliana did not kill Karen, Gary's idiocy and stubbornness did. Yet no-one, for some inexplicable reason, even thought of pointing out his complete unprofessionalism during the Karen incident.

The others knew exactly what happened, since Gary and that other dude did not distort the facts, yet blamed Juliana for.. trying to save herself. I highly doubt the liberation from the Nazis and/or Japanese will be the product of these idiots.

Fanboy : a person who does not think while watching.