MovieChat Forums > Inception (2010) Discussion > The threat of limbo

The threat of limbo

posted 8 years ago by micholeon-18825
15 replies | jump to latest

In the first dream level, the chemist tells them that the sedation is so strong that "dying won't wake us up - dying will put us in limbo."

Everyone gets concerned. "Cobb why didn't you tell us this?! We'll be stuck there for a decade!" But ... Cobb has been to limbo before. He's escaped before. Escaping looks easy. All you gotta do is kill yourself.

So, if they die in the dream they go to limbo. But if they die again, they escape limbo. There shouldnt have been a concern there.

[–] realbullet 8 years ago

Everyone gets concerned. "Cobb why didn't you tell us this?! We'll be stuck there for a decade!" But ... Cobb has been to limbo before. He's escaped before. Escaping looks easy. All you gotta do is kill yourself.

The danger is (as the movie shows us) you can't escape from Limbo unless you realize that you are in Limbo. This is how you lose yourself in the dream. Mal never escaped Limbo because she never realized that she was dreaming.

👿 I know something you don't know ... I am ambidextrous!

[–] micholeon-18825 8 years ago

Mal did escape Limbo. When they put their heads on the train tracks. But she thought she was still in Limbo, so she jumped from a window.

[–] realbullet 8 years ago

Mal did escape Limbo. When they put their heads on the train tracks. But she thought she was still in Limbo, so she jumped from a window.

Mal did not escape from Limbo sane. She was insane, because she could not distinguish between dreams and awake. That is the threat of Limbo.

👿 I know something you don't know ... I am ambidextrous!

[–] PreachCaleb 8 years ago

But she thought she was still in Limbo, so she jumped from a window.

Exactly. That's a danger.

Let's be bad guys.

[–] billreynolds 8 years ago

I don't agree that you can't escape from limbo unless you realize you are in limbo. You can escape - you just may not realize what is real and what is a dream anymore.

In the Fischer inception, Yusuf says very clearly that "you can't even think about trying to escape until the sedation eases" and that to the dreamer the perception of time passed in limbo would be "decades" or even "infinite."

So the danger is, you drop into limbo and you cannot escape by a normal kick such as killing yourself until the sedation (which lasts ten hours in the real world) has worn off. Meanwhile, your mind experiences decades in limbo and you forget that it is not reality.

Cobb's mission at the end was to remind Saito that he was in limbo, so that Saito would be able to remember the "arrangement" when he came back to reality. The problem is that Cobb had to keep going back over and over again (the opening and ending castle scenes are different), getting Saito to remember and kill himself until finally the sedation wore off and they were able to kick themselves back to reality.

"The tastes and weaknesses of an artist but [] no actual creative inspiration." -- Fitzgerald

[–] Chopperbubba 8 years ago

Interesting. I've always been under the assumption that Cobb washed up to shore at the beginning, was a continuation of him meeting Saito in limbo at the end?

[–] realbullet 8 years ago

Interesting. I've always been under the assumption that Cobb washed up to shore at the beginning, was a continuation of him meeting Saito in limbo at the end?

If you look at the scene in the beginning and the end, they are different. I agree with billreynolds in that my interpretation is that they have to keep repeating the end scene over and over again until the sedative wears off.

However, you can escape with a normal kick so long as that kick is concurrent with a kick in the layer above -- this is how Fischer and Ariadne escape Limbo. PreachCaleb seems to be agreeing, but using too few words to satisfy billreynolds.

If you wake up without realizing that you are dreaming in Limbo, then you are in danger of losing track of reality (like Mal.) Cobb and Saito help to remind each other that they are in Limbo -- without that, either one or both could be lost in the reality of their mind. Each time they die, they wake up in Limbo again and have to remind each other again. This is repeated over and over until the sedative wears off.

👿 I know something you don't know ... I am ambidextrous!

[–] AndrewGS 8 years ago

Everyone gets concerned. "Cobb why didn't you tell us this?! We'll be stuck there for a decade!" But ... Cobb has been to limbo before. He's escaped before. Escaping looks easy. All you gotta do is kill yourself.

The danger is (as the movie shows us) you can't escape from Limbo unless you realize that you are in Limbo. This is how you lose yourself in the dream.

Why would you not realize that it is a dream? The film was pretty unclear about whether Mal (and Saito) or Dom were more unusual in, respectively, not realizing or realizing that the dream world was a dream but it suggests that what initially kept Dom and Mal aware that it wasn't real was that they were together and they were consciously creating things. On the other hand it suggests that Mal made a deliberate effort to forget that the dream reality was a dream although maybe also that most people would do so.

[–] midwestdawg83 8 years ago

Am I the only one who thinks that the whole movie is limbo? Cobb is stuck in limbo. To me, his wife escaped, then went back down to rescue him, but instead he refused to believe and as a result created this elaborate backstory to convince himself that she was the 'crazy' one and he was sane.

He couldn't accept the reality.

 me.

[–] Painbow 8 years ago

You can interpret it that way but it's a pretty thin explanation. If Mal went down there to save him then why is she so odd... so disconnected... so fücked up?

Had Nolan wanted us to entertain that possibility then why push the crazy wife agenda?

I guess it's still possible but I don't buy it. The only real interpretation left is whether Cobb got out of limbo the second time (spinning talisman suggests not).

[–] realbullet 8 years ago

Am I the only one who thinks that the whole movie is limbo? Cobb is stuck in limbo. To me, his wife escaped, then went back down to rescue him, but instead he refused to believe and as a result created this elaborate backstory to convince himself that she was the 'crazy' one and he was sane.

He couldn't accept the reality.

The ambiguity is set up to give you that possibility. However, IMO, the movie makes no sense by the end if he is the one still in Limbo.

First, if that is the case, then Cobb has no catharsis. The movie sets up the Fischer scenario as a way to describe what Cobb is going through. Not only does Fischer achieve his catharsis and change -- so does Cobb.

Second, Cobb tells us that he would not be satisfied with the shadow/faux memories of his mind.

Finally, as a story, the entire plot has to make sense. For Cobb to be stuck in Limbo, there has to be a specific character arc which fails. This does not happen in the story, so it does not make sense as a plot.

👿 I know something you don't know ... I am ambidextrous!

[–] kmags84 8 years ago

I've watched the film with this idea and I agree, it doesn't hold weight IMO. The story lacks the emotional punch when viewed that way.

[–] AndrewGS 8 years ago

First, if that is the case, then Cobb has no catharsis. The movie sets up the Fischer scenario as a way to describe what Cobb is going through. Not only does Fischer achieve his catharsis and change

Fischer has a catharsis of sorts, and indeed personal growth, but while it's real to him in a larger, more objective sense it's not real, it's others manipulating him (for their own ends, thus making it a rather cynical, self-serving claim that it was catharsis) and getting him to manipulate himself. Cobb (or his wife or someone else) could likewise be manipulating Cobb (or, less sinister, helping him) into think he's accepting reality and growing.

Finally, as a story, the entire plot has to make sense. For Cobb to be stuck in Limbo, there has to be a specific character arc which fails.

That he risks himself to save Saito is certainly noble but could also (especially given how confident he is in thinking he can) reflect that he still thinks of himself as a god or a hero or savior.

[–] GreyHunter 8 years ago

It was made clear that they were heavily sedated. As such, they couldn't leave limbo prematurely just by waking up. In normal circumstances, you can just kill yourself to escape immediately. Under heavy sedation, you're pretty much stuck until enough real-world time has passed for the sedative to wear off.

So think of the time frame involved. If telescoped through three levels, they'd be stuck in limbo for an entire lifetime, and quite possibly stuck there alone (as Saito was, in fact, on both counts,) A person could go insane stuck in that situation, which is the exact danger mentioned (they refer to a man losing his mind there.) People mentioning that you have to know you're in limbo aren't taking the next step...if you know you're in limbo, you know all the projections are just illusions, which makes it even lonelier. It might seem like a fun thing at first, but as Cobb knows very well, it could get extremely unsatisfying after a while. That's what started all this trouble in the first place, after all -- he wanted to escape limbo, which led him to plant an idea in Mal's mind, which led to her ultimate death.

[–] 8 years ago

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