MovieChat Forums > Cloud Atlas (2012) Discussion > a few questions

a few questions

posted 10 years ago by reko-716-854614
13 replies | jump to latest

1. Why the title of the movie is "Cloud Atlas" ?
Does it have a connection with the Cloud Atlas Sextet ? But I can not see the connection, as the Sextet appear in the "second stage" from the movie. (the "first stage" I assumed is Adam Ewing story) ?

2. Can anyone please explain me the logic of the condition after "The Fall" ? How come there are in one side an advanced group (Meronym) with the knowledge that Somni is not a god while another side is primitive (backward?) group (Zachry) with the knowledge that Somni is a god ?

Is it something like the mythical story about Noah's flood ? after the Noah's flood, humankind is divided into one group back to primitive (as years ago we still find primitive tribes in a certain place) and the other group is more advanced than this primitive one ?

3. Why Cavendish doesn't have the money from the books sold ?
It seems the movie didn't tell about this ?

4. At first, Zachry follow the instruction from his "witch" to hide under the bridge ... and it turn out he is safe - it's a good thing to obey the "prophecy" (instruction from the witch). The second time, Zachry disobey his "witch" instruction to not to kill the Kona man ... and in the end it turn out it is a good thing also to disobey the "prophecy" (instruction from the witch).

Does it mean, whatever we do - obey or disobey ... our life is our own self to control/determine it ?

or is it,
whatever we do, if it was predestined then it will be as predestined. Zachry is predestined to marry Meronym ... so, even if he obey not to kill the Kona man - in the end he still marry Meronym ... it will not change.

I'm sorry of my broken English.

Any kind of explanation would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you in advanced.

beautiful fossil coral
http://www.indonesiangems.com/

[–] NotASpeckOfCereal 10 years ago

1) Why not?

2) It's explained in the film--see it again. Because some people directly suffered the fall and receded into a dark age where history is lost and fables are created, while some are more fortunate and escaped the fall intact with some knowledge and technology. But they're still living on a dying planet.

3) It's explained in the film--see it again. He was very much in debt. The bank woman told him that when he called the bank to ask for money.

4) It's the 3rd time, not the 2nd. There is no one "why" I think. It's left open to interpretation. It's obviously vengeance for his sister, even though he did not see which Kona did that killing. He felt strongly enough about this that it over-road the premonition.

Be sure to proof your posts to see if you any words out

[–] reko-716-854614 10 years ago

1. I know it's up to the movie maker to give the title :).
I just wonder if there is a connection with Cloud Atlas Sextet.

2, 3, 4 ... thank you for your explanation.
My bad that I didn't catch all the English subtitles.
I should see a few more times before ask about this, sorry.

Thank you once again, NotASpeckOfCereal.

beautiful fossil coral
http://www.indonesiangems.com/

[–] freakctc 9 years ago

Actually, as far as the shaman's predictions:

Zachry did follow all three. The last one is important, but easy to overlook.
The shaman tells him not to kill the Kona while he sleeps, which Zachry doesn't do. The Kona wakes, and Zachry kills him. Here's the difference:
If Zachry would have killed him in his sleep, it would have been a vengeance kill, done in hatred, over the death of his sister and his people. Since Zachry stalled, and the Kona woke up, Zachry killed him in self-defense - fear - and has a different effect on him as a person.
The Shaman didn't want Zachry to give in to his anger and vengeance and become like 'old Georgie'. Zachry DID listen to her about all 3 predictions.

At least, that's how I saw it.

[–] Farshnoshket 10 years ago

I'd say the other responses are fine, but your first question, why the film is called Cloud Atlas?

Well first, because that was the name of the book, but beyond that did you give the title any thought yourself? What is a Cloud Atlas or what it could be?

I believe if you thought about those possibilities you'd come to a very logical conclusion to something that is illogical.

[–] reko-716-854614 10 years ago

No... actually I don;t have any thought for other title than Cloud Atlas.
I'm just wondering if there is a connection with the Cloud Atlas Sextet.

Thank you for your info, Farshnoshket.

beautiful fossil coral
http://www.indonesiangems.com/

[–] rob-2253 10 years ago

...just my little stream of consciousness: a cloud atlas in real life is an atlas of clouds (duh :-)). It shows pictures of clouds and what their shapes tell about the weather. That works because there are ever recurring shapes of clouds, recognizably similar, but never exactly the same. Such as the stories in the film, which share important aspects at their core but are still very different. People also have fun looking at clouds and wondering what they look like. We might as well look at the world, and try to recognize the patterns, because humanity makes similar mistakes over and over. Sometimes we don't see them and sometimes it takes others, who see more than ourselves, to go ahead and show us. By their actions, their words, or their music.

[–] reko-716-854614 10 years ago

That's interesting thought, rob-2253
Thank you for sharing.

beautiful fossil coral
http://www.indonesiangems.com/

[–] Ivor_Bucket 10 years ago

I realise from what you say that English is not your first language, but I thought I'd comment on your use of the word "witch". That you put it between quote marks suggests that perhaps you were hunting for a suitable word?

Although there are many good witches in literature and folklore, the word witch more commonly implies evil intent, someone using magic and spells for malign reasons. I didn't see the Abbess character (the one played by Susan Sarandon) as a witch. Indeed, the word abbess signifies a spiritual leader. I think words that better describe her are shaman, seer, oracle or medicine-woman.

I'll also respond with my own interpretation of this bit of your post:

Does it mean, whatever we do - obey or disobey ... our life is our own self to control/determine it ?

or is it,
whatever we do, if it was predestined then it will be as predestined. Zachry is predestined to marry Meronym ... so, even if he obey not to kill the Kona man - in the end he still marry Meronym ... it will not change.

I see the whole film as reflecting the eastern concept of karma, that actions have consequences, whether in this life or a subsequent one. I didn't see that there was any predestination concerning the relationship between Zachry and Meronym. Rather, that at that point in his life, Zachry was finally able to confront and disempower the Old Georgie spectre and that his redemption, which included a life with Meronym, flowed from this act of courage.

Others may have different interpretations, and that's fine.

I'm glad you seem to have enjoyed the film.

[–] reko-716-854614 10 years ago

I'm sorry as I don;t know other word to write what I mean. That's why I use apostrophe when I wrote "witch". Ah... yes... your word is much better "Shaman". Thanks for your correction, Ivor_Bucket :).

Thank you also of your explanation about the concept of karma in this movie.

regards.

beautiful fossil coral
http://www.indonesiangems.com/

[–] jmhow 9 years ago

4. IIRC the prophecy was if the enemy was sleeping, don't slit the throat. The enemy woke up, then Zachry killed him.

www.freerice.com

[–] reddkryten 9 years ago

1 in the novel it is explained that Frobisher wishes there was some way of keeping track of people and their reincarnations. Like an atlas, however because people are constantly dying and reincarnating, it would be like an atlas of the clouds.

2 there was a fall of some kind, some people got lucky, others did not.

3 Cavendish was in debt, as soon as money started coming in, people started collecting on those debts. When on the phone to the bank this is mentioned very quickly.

4 If Zachary had just walked away, he would have been fine. However he disobeyed the Abbesses instructions, almost got caught, ended up with a scar on his face and Meronym ended up with a limp.

It's also a but debatable. If Meronym hadn't helped, Zachary would have died. Perhaps the Abbess did not see Meronym assisting, or maybe it was a 50/50 thing.

Either way, it was safer not to slit that throat.

[–] reko-716-854614 9 years ago

Thanks for the explanation jmhow & reddkryten.

beautiful fossil coral
http://www.indonesiangems.com/

[–] shikha-raturi12 9 years ago

I think your #1, 2, and 3 are already explained.
I would like to add a little bit more to the #4 - This is totally my interpretation.

4. At first, Zachry follow the instruction from his "witch" to hide under the bridge ... and it turn out he is safe - it's a good thing to obey the "prophecy" (instruction from the witch). The second time, Zachry disobey his "witch" instruction to not to kill the Kona man ... and in the end it turn out it is a good thing also to disobey the "prophecy" (instruction from the witch).

There were three prophecies given to Zachry by the "witch"
First, "Bridge'a'broken, hide below" - he did obey this one, where he takes Meronym and hides under the bridge that saves him.
Second, "Hands'a'bleedin', can't let go" - while climbing the mountain he was pulling Meronym with the rope and his alter ego (If I may call him that) was asking him to leave the rope and not trust Meronym. He did not. Here also he obeyed Abbess.
Third, "enemy sleepin', don't slit that throat" - Here he clearly disobeyed and Slit Kona's throat. As I see it, If he had not slit Kona's throat Kona would be still Alive when his friends called him. When Kona did not answer to his friend's call they came inside and caught Zachry and his niece. He was lucky Meronym was there to save him later.

*Just my interpretation*