Now I haven't actually viewed this film in two years, so my memory may be fuzzy, however..... A Serbian Film is so-over-the-top that I can't take it seriously. I mean multiple deaths by dicks. Come on! I don't think anyone in their right mind can view that and think it's anything more than absurd. As I don't remember ever reading anywhere about anyone in the real world being killed by a penis being rammed in their throat or skull.
You've heard of men being killed and having their own penis stuffed in their mouths haven't you? And I'm sure people have been killed by having other things put into their mouth to suffocate or mortally wound them. To enjoy watching the suffering and death of another human being, under any circumstances, is cause for distrust. Put another way, you'd never be on anyone's shortlist as a baby sitter,
if they knew you could watch that and react with amusement instead of wince with empathy and disgust.It might be sick to you, but you don't realize it's supposed to be absurd and nonsensical.
It was not absurd and nonsensical. It wasn't presented in comical way and I don't see how you act like these deaths could not occur in real life. If it was presented in a moronic way like
The Toxic Avenger murders, sure, but there is nothing about
A Serbian Film to indicate a humorous element. Your mind is applying that humor and that says more about your mind than anything else. I also don't accept your "it's art" argument or the "it's purpose is to cause us to question" argument. That's your opinion, so you should preface it as your opinion. You don't know that as fact. I don't even care if the creators say that, it doesn't make it so. People can invent highbrow motives after the fact, to get people like you thinking you're being cultured. I don't hate the movie, but I do have a problem with morons who revel in it's brutality and gore. I think I offered and anecdote from my life about a friend reveling in the violence of
Mother's Day(1980). I kicked him out of my Aunt's house over that and though we're still friends, I wouldn't trust him as well around someone vulnerable. And this isn't a PC perspective. I'm as far from PC as you can get, but you don't have to be PC to not enjoy the fictional (but realistic) suffering of another human being. I'm so anti-PC that I can't watch a Hollywood movie without driving my wife crazy with all the agendas that irritate me. They force and inordinate amount of minorities, gays, drugs and crude deviant sex into everything.
Both comedies and horror films should not be polite. That's not the aim of their genres when they are trying to do something, anything other than entertain.
It's not about them being polite. I have no problem with Rob Zombie's
Halloween or
Dawn Of The Dead(2004) for example, but
A Serbian Film indulges in the brutality and gore. And it's not the movie that bothers me, it's having someone laugh or enjoy the most graphic scenes. Whether you realize it or not, there is a sickness in this world. Go visit
bestgore.com. There are people that look at those brutal
real life deaths and make jokes and are amused. That's where my problem lies.
Yea, Tho I Walk Thru The Valley Of The Shadow Of Political Correctness...🇺🇸
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ngs091
9 years ago
Your 1st post: Like I said I was using your logic against you. That was all.
Your 2nd Post.....
Like I said, in my original post, we all have our limits.
I just see this film almost akin (not quite, but almost) to the over-the-top horror-comedies of Re-Animator or Evil Dead 2. You obviously wouldn't.
A Serbian Film simply doesn't disturb me at all, when I think of disturbing I think of films that take their content much more seriously and are much more grim, such as the modern films Martyrs (2008) and Eden Lake (2008), and the 2010 Hong Kong film Dream Home is another one, as well.
I do get disturbed by films, such at the above, but at the same time sometimes I still think they are powerful. I like those 3 films above a great deal, as well, for many reasons.
The only film that disturbed me so much that I thought it was sadistic and that made me not like it, ironically as you brought up the original, was the remake of Mother's Day back in 2010, from Saw-sequel director, Darren Lynn Bousman. The content wasn't as brutal, but something about its moral conscience or the glee it presented itself --or perhaps something else, as it's been a while-- sickened me.
However, I wouldn't outright condemn people who like it or feel different emotions about it, at least just based on that. As I know we all react differently to films. A film, art in general, is supposed to make us emotionally react. There's much amount of spectrum's of emotion that we can react with.
For instance, I once had a girlfriend who would laugh at some romance scenes in films because they seemed corny and unrealistic, but I would be tearing up.
It's not my fault, your fault, the filmmakers fault, etc. if we react one way to an piece of art, whether that reaction is intended, or not.
Also realize that everyone's perception of a film varies. That may say something about the person and it may even be negative some of the time, that's true.
However, if a person is actively defending this perception, and constructively saying they saw something greater in the film that gives the film a different meaning, then you one should at least be open-minded enough to respect it, even if you don't agree.
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Thought_Criminal_J62377
9 years ago
I wouldn't outright condemn people who like it or feel different emotions about it, at least just based on that. As I know we all react differently to films.
I chose my words carefully when I said "reveled in." Liking the movie doesn't bother me but cheering the brutality on is worrisome. I would always have a problem with a person who cheers on brutality and suffering. As I mentioned, my friend had no compassion for the women in Mother's Day(1980) and that is disturbing. In my opinion, that's as much of a predictor of sociopathy or sadism as harming small animals.
But in
A Serbian Film watching the guy manipulated to the point of beating and butchering women was not pleasant. Maybe you were amused by them drugging the guy to make him like a breeder bull?
Have you ever wondered if you've seen too much evil?
Yea, Tho I Walk Thru The Valley Of The Shadow Of Political Correctness...🇺🇸
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ngs091
9 years ago
It's all about context. And everyone's perception of context is different.
I don't 'cheer on' brutality and suffering in a film that, I feel, doesn't want me to cheer on brutality and suffering. But that's guided by perception, too.
Here's a quote by Roman Polanski that makes sense: “You have to show violence the way it is. If you don't show it realistically, then that's immoral and harmful. If you don't upset people, then that's obscenity.”
Obviously for you, A Serbian Film, was realistic enough to upset you. I think that is a great thing.
However, my different 'perception' of the film's intent and emotion was a bit more absurd to be taken seriously. That's fine, too.
As while the above quote illustrates violence in movies when it is done in a serious manner. I would say that it's always better to show it realistically in a serious film, but I would argue with Polanski some of the time and say that not all films are supposed to be serious in their violence.
While I wouldn't cheer on violence for violence sake in the real world, I understand in art, violence can be used in different contexts. Much like how racist language in art isn't always racist. It has a great point sometimes, or at least, shows racism for how it is.
Case in point-- Slapstick comedy is violence, but many people laugh at it because it's so over-the-top they realize that it's not real. Is that sick? Or it its context just different.
Violence-wise, some people cheer on Charles Bronson's character in Death Wish, while other's think his gun-toting revenge-fantasy is a redneck dream. I can see both ways, myself.
A Serbian Film is not quite slapstick, but there is a form of comedy called, "Dark Humor'. I believe that is what A Serbian Film is.
PS. You said: "Have you ever wondered if you've seen too much evil?"
No. I live a pretty peaceful, upper-class life. Some-- not all- of the films I watch are violent, but I realize its-- gasp!-- not real.
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Thought_Criminal_J62377
9 years ago
No offense to you, but where I'm from, Roman Polanski is a pedophile and rapist. I don't respect his opinion. I don't care how talented or beloved he is.
Yea, Tho I Walk Thru The Valley Of The Shadow Of Political Correctness...🇺🇸
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ngs091
9 years ago
Well, that's truly sad. If you said you disagreed with what I said with constructive criticism that's one thing. But you didn't, and started hating on Polanski for a reason not even related to his art.
It's obvious with that statement that you don't understand art-- or don't connect with with it-- enough to realize its beauty. It can reflect life, be an abstraction of life, and can also transcend life.
But it is not life.
As even when taking Polanski out of a social-political contextual argument of what makes a criminal do crime..........Please! PLEASE! Do realize someday that art is only emotional expression.
In that, Polanski may be a pedophile and a rapist, that's true. But -- even if you hate his work.. and certainly can for many reasons, but not the reason you gave-- he is still an artist and therefore he bears his soul in his artwork.
Therefore, I think your problem is you don't realize that art is not life in its pure form, but rather an interpretation of life distilled down to its meaningful essence.
Therefore, Polanski's quote is just as justified as any other artist. Because art is expression, and therefore not reserved to people who only think or act by your (mine or anyone's) moral standards. In art it doesn't matter what someone thinks or believes, so long as they express.
Please know the difference.
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Thought_Criminal_J62377
9 years ago
Polanski may be a pedophile and a rapist, that's true. But -- even if you hate his work.. and certainly can for many reasons, but not the reason you gave-- he is still an artist and therefore he bears his soul in his artwork.
Please re-read my previous post. I didn't say I hated his "art," I said I don't respect his opinion. I've liked Polanski movies, but when he speaks of violence and the darker side of life, I'm gonna require the opinion of someone of higher character.
Yea, Tho I Walk Thru The Valley Of The Shadow Of Political Correctness...🇺🇸
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ngs091
9 years ago
Well after reading my entire post and thinking about it, it should have lead you to at least realize about the point that I am TRULY making-- and it was not if you liked his films or did not like his films.
...And that was not his opinion of violence and the darker side of life in REALITY, but rather, how he shows it in MOVIES. Which is NOT PURE REALITY.
Art and reality can be SEPARATED. Simply because art is expressive emotion. Therefore, an artist is not restricted by his actions in 'real life', but rather by his art that works as an outlet for his own self.
And that you should be able to argue his opinion on valid, constructive grounds, not just say you don't think that way because you don't like the guy in real life.
Period.
So, please argue with the point of the quote. As I really don't give a crap if you would allow Polanski to have dinner with your family.
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Thought_Criminal_J62377
9 years ago
I'm gonna try this one more time. Roman Polanski possesses a deviant mind. So his opinion about how violence, etc, should be depicted (in movies) comes from a mind that I don't trust. Does that make more sense? It would be like letting Charles Manson's lead me spiritually.
All this "art" talk is pretentious, in my opinion. I appreciate someone with the vision to create a quality movie, but I think "art" is overblown. Some people even call a Yoko Ono performance "art" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdZ9weP5i68
Yea, Tho I Walk Thru The Valley Of The Shadow Of Political Correctness...🇺🇸
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ngs091
9 years ago
OK. Fine. I give up.
But.... Maybe it's the fact that one thinks having a discussion about what art is and means is 'pretentious' that is the very part of your problem. The problem, both in debating about it and even seeing merit in such a film as this.
I agree, sometimes it's best to leave the debating and philosophy of art to those who don't find talking about it in that way 'pretentious'. Yet, actually love it enough to discuss it and let their heart and soul go free.
Or we can just continue to hurl *beep* at people for expressing themselves-- whether the expression be for better or worse-- without thinking about it. And getting on some Fox News-style pedestal against it.
I don't claim to know if you are in fact a creator of art yourself. But through reading your posts, you don't sound like one.
And if you are, I assume if I saw your art, that I may think that you are not involved in it enough for it to be a true part of you.
Therefore, I would deem you not an 'art lover,' but merely a spectator for entertainment, that caca's on people who have 'made it' in their field without caring enough to even express the 'why I think that' properly.
I pity you.
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Thought_Criminal_J62377
9 years ago
Or we can just continue to hurl *beep* at people for expressing themselves-- whether the expression be for better or worse-- without thinking about it.
Using "art as an excuse, doesn't make it acceptable to portray just anything. Do you not understand influence and desensitization? Sometimes the things depicted in the name of "art" are bad for society and though I don't condone censorship, the "artist" should have the moral fiber to know when to say when. I don't hate the movie
A Serbian Film, I see it's qualities, but I do believe it goes too far.
Did I mention
bestgore.com to you? There wouldn't be sites like that if not for the influence of "art" gone too far. As Max California(Joaquin Phoenix) said in
8mm, "There are some things that you see, and you can't unsee them. Know what I mean?" and "Pops... If you dance with the devil, the devil don't change. The devil changes you." People don't seem to grasp these facts. Especially art lovers. They generally think the further the envelope can be pushed the better.
I don't claim to know if you are in fact a creator of art yourself. But through reading your posts, you don't sound like one.
No, I've dabbled in writing, but I'm not so pretentious to call myself a "creator of art."
Therefore, I would deem you not an 'art lover,' but merely a spectator for entertainment
That's true. I'm a humble spectator for entertainment, that is keenly aware of the "artists" intentions to influence us. Today they want to completely destroy belief in God, because it get's in the way of their self expression.
Yea, Tho I Walk Thru The Valley Of The Shadow Of Political Correctness...🇺🇸
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ngs091
9 years ago
Today they want to completely destroy belief in God, because it get's in the way of their self expression.
Ya, I figured you were some Conservative, Religious nut.
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Thought_Criminal_J62377
9 years ago
I guess having values and morals makes one a nut.
Yea, Tho I Walk Thru The Valley Of The Shadow Of Political Correctness...🇺🇸
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ngs091
9 years ago
I believe that I have values and morals, too. As I assume you believe about yourself, too.
But it's all perception. You seem to think that I don't because I am defending a fictional movie.
While I think you are a neo-con in a political party and religious ideology that is the last dying breath of the Dead Zombie Confederacy.
Believe what you want. But, as you admitted, your faction in the USA is falling to bits. Gloriously!
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Thought_Criminal_J62377
9 years ago
your faction in the USA is falling to bits. Gloriously!
Cheering for the death of Christianity sounds like wickedness. I hope you'll wake up and find forgiveness, before it's too late.
Also, I can't say it's falling to bits, but the liberal elites of the entertainment industry and media are doing their evil worst to turn everyone away from God. Some say it's because time is running out and Satan's making his final push to win us over.
I wish you the best.
Yea, Tho I Walk Thru The Valley Of The Shadow Of Political Correctness...🇺🇸
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ngs091
9 years ago
And I am glad your reasoning for thinking like this just frankly boils down to Religious Zealotry and extreme proselytizing. For a while, I thought you were at least more open-minded.
I wish you the best too.
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Thought_Criminal_J62377
9 years ago
Yep, I'm a radical nut, because my religion doesn't change to suit societies moral revisions. It's sad that people see things that way. This world really has gone downhill.
Knowing your age seems relevant, if you don't mind giving it? I'm 38 years and 6 months old. My birthday is June 23rd if you want to send me birthday wishes. 😉
Yea, Tho I Walk Thru The Valley Of The Shadow Of Political Correctness...🇺🇸
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ngs091
9 years ago
Yep, I'm a radical nut, because my religion doesn't change to suit societies moral revisions.
I never said I wasn't religious, and while I am not too far off of your age (I am above 30, and might even be older than you), I don't think that's relevant.
However. I would sincerely call you a nut if you put your one religion ahead of society.
As any kind of belief-- religion, atheism, spiritual etc--- is often reinterpreted, revised, and recreated to suit the current society.
One has to understand that society defines morality. Not religion. Even if there is a god and one knew what the 'True" religion was, anyone should realize that all religious texts can be interpreted by every single reader in a variety of ways, much akin to art.
And.....Happy Late-Half Birthday!
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Thought_Criminal_J62377
9 years ago
As any kind of belief-- religion, atheism, spiritual etc--- is often reinterpreted, revised, and recreated to suit the current society.
I try to live by God's law and that doesn't change to suit society. For example, society has deemed homosexuality to be valid and perfectly normal. But God didn't change his contempt for it, even though alot of churches have. Satan's influence at work.
The entertainment industry celebrates and rewards actors(male/female) that are willing to be filmed fully nude. They're said to be fearless, courageous and dedicated to their "art." And if they'll appear fully nude and do something raunchy with Billy Bob Thornton, they're guaranteed to win an academy award(See Halle Berry). My indictment of "art," is that it's used as an excuse for profanity. Can you say "groupthink"?
When Adam and Eve tasted the fruit of sin, they were at once, struck with shame of nudity. God intends for us to feel shame and modesty. Hollywood (in particular) loves influencing people to flout God's intentions and it should be apparent to everyone. But alas, Satan has hypnotized a great number of people.
Yea, Tho I Walk Thru The Valley Of The Shadow Of Political Correctness...🇺🇸
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Thought_Criminal_J62377
9 years ago
I think it's nuts to say you're religious and then say it's okay for religion to change, to suit the times.
The truth doesn't change because it's convenient.
Tolerance Ends, Where Politically Incorrect Thought Begins...{US]
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ngs091
9 years ago
The quote-unquote truth can be interpreted in many different ways.
I doubt you live your life as purely as you think. As even a perfect believer should realize that they only live their life according to their interpretation of whatever text they live for. But that it truly not every believer in that religion's interpretation.
That's all I have to say on the matter. Just think about it.
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Thought_Criminal_J62377
9 years ago
I doubt you live your life as purely as you think.
I never said I do. I'm a sinner, as we all are, but I said "I try."
Interpretation and revision are two different things. I think you're backpedaling now. For example, (again) the Bible calls homosexuality an abomination, but because it's been championed by Kurt Cobain, Oprah and many, many other high profile personalities, the churches are revising their beliefs. Otherwise, they won't have a congregation. Revising because the
"right way" is unpopular, is
wrong! Tolerance Is Intolerant Of Politically Incorrect Thought...{US]
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ngs091
9 years ago
Interpretation and revision are two different things.
It can be. As if one views the bible as akin to art-- which it is--- then interpretation is always subjective, not objective. And that, of course, can lead to revision of society and culture.
Much of the bible comes down to how one interprets it. And there is a great amount of passages in there that you probably choose to ignore, but more likely, are just ignorant about...
Here's one example: "Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material." Leviticus 19:19
You might want to start checking you clothing labels.
Besides, I believe, that god-- if he exists-- wants us to think for ourselves, which is why he has given us free thought. And that includes what we can interpret in religious script.
As thankfully for believers, Paul makes it very clear that the sacrifice of Jesus means that individuals do not have to abide by every single rule in the Book of Laws,
This is good for any Christians who like to eat sausage. The difficulty comes when Christians must decide which of the laws they will follow and which they will not. It’s a gray area, and living a religious path of how one chooses is up to each reader. But then again, how we read the bible and interpret it is ultimately up to us, much like all of life.
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Thought_Criminal_J62377
9 years ago
Besides, I believe, that god-- if he exists-- wants us to think for ourselves, which is why he has given us free thought. And that includes what we can interpret in religious script.
Oh, I agree. And that free thought allows us to also choose poorly, follow the wrong shepherd and end up where no one wants to find themselves.
As thankfully for believers, Paul makes it very clear that the sacrifice of Jesus means that individuals do not have to abide by every single rule in the Book of Laws.
Agreement once again, but I don't believe you can consciously disobey the word. For example, I don't believe an adulterer can plan to keep cheating, then simply ask to be forgiven after each offense. You have to actually be trying to live right. Jesus's sacrifice was not meant to be a get-out-of-jail-free card, that could be abused whenever needed.
Tolerance Is Intolerant Of Politically Incorrect Thought...🇺🇸
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abraveliltoaster
9 years ago
Rob Zombie didn't direct the remake of Dawn of the Dead, you religious *beep* nut. Get off your high horse.
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lagcats
9 years ago
People just love the way this movie is disturbing and how it is pushing the limits.
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CharmingAss_hole
9 years ago
If someone like Pistoff white misguided guy knew much about this movie going in, why the hell would he/she/it watch? You owe yourself that punishment, guy. Also, you're way clearly into the god thing which completely disqualifies you from having input on any normal real life events, but especially a movie like this. Have fun not having fun with god, dude.
Maybe. Maybe not. Maybe f_uck yourself.
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