I realy just didn't get it...explain plzzzz - The Broken (2008) Discussion

[–] angusahudson_bsc 16 years ago

::::::::CONTAINS SPOILERS::::::::

When Gina returns to her apartment and finds her dead double, she regains her memory everything falls into place and she realizes she is the evil doppleganger and she starts behaving like one. From the point Gina is in the telephone booth and sees her double drove by, the film follows the point of view of the evil doppleganger Gina.

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[–] 16 years ago

[deleted]

[–] martinmm-1 16 years ago

that is weird, but i want to see it
omg we are all gonna die!

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[–] Summer1984 16 years ago

thanks for explaining i was so confused, how u figure it out???

LOVE HURTS :(

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[–] kostej 16 years ago

How Gina gained memories of her victim? How could she see another herself, when she murdered her? How could she be so warm, when evil dopplegangers had no emotions? How could she remembered her good boyfriend while she couldn't remember where her good herself lives?

Atmosphere was good, however there were so many illogical things here...

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[–] ELKronos 16 years ago

SPOILERS:

QUESTION ONE: How Gina gained memories of her victim?
1) Gina never actually gained the memories of her victim:

Evidence:
A) She had the photograph in which she stated a few times she did not remember any such picture ever being taken.
B) If she gained the 'real' Ginas memories, she surely would have remembered where she lived.

QUESTION TWO: How could she see another herself, when she murdered her?
2) I'm not totally sure what you're asking here. If you are asking about the end scene when she is killing the 'real' Gina, she is not "seeing" it, this is just showing you what happened.

QUESTION THREE: How could she be so warm, when evil dopplegangers had no emotions?
3) It is common knowledge that when the brain is exposed to trauma, personality can often change. One classical example is that of Phineas Gage, who experienced a large personality change after brain damage. Remember that Ginas brain had bruises, which may explain not only why she was warm for a portion of the movie, but became 'cold' again when presumably the bruises healed.

More Information Here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phineas_Gage

QUESTION FOUR: How could she remembered her good boyfriend while she couldn't remember where her good herself lives?
4) This is the big question I have as well, which I am not able to find a totally reasonable answer for. I think that it isn't totally correct to say that she 'remembers' her boyfriend as being nice. She may have just sensed something was off. Perhaps due to her memory loss, and being treated extremely nicely from her father/brother who came to see her in the hospital (as well as the doctors) she expected this behavior, and thought it was odd he would be so cold, even to his dog which he did not care about (so why did he have one?). Also, the fact that her personality may have been different due to the bruises, could have created some sort of false expectations from her as well.

From a cognitive stand point, these types of situations regarding memory are always interesting. One speculation regarding memory is that when we experience everything which is around us, we actually may not take time to perceive everything (e.g. when you drive you do not actively take in all of the cars / road signs / surroundings) but rather fill this in from what you already remember to be there. If you remember, the film shows the 'real' Gina's family smiling around a table, but quickly flashes a sinister looking mirror family in the dark sitting around the table. If there was a 'mirror world', then 'mirror' Gina would have had 'mirror' memories of her 'mirror' boyfriend, presumably the same memories as the 'real' Gina. This means that something like her boyfriend was already present in her memory, but how it was remembered (e.g. being warm) was filled in incorrectly. This is actually one way that some account for error in memory. There are studies which show that when we are having a hard time recalling something, we often fill in what we think is likely to be there, or even what we would like to see. This could mean that the 'mirror' Gina could have wanted to remember her boyfriend as warm / nice, or at least filled that portion of the memory in incorrectly.

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[–] jbright23 16 years ago

Save your breath, you're putting way too much thought into a movie that doesn't deserve it. At all.

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[–] ELKronos 16 years ago

1) People do not use breath to type

2) Someone needs to explain it for those who have questions (like the original poster), and for those who aren't smart enough to understand it on their own (perhaps someone like you). ;)

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[–] inevitabilio 16 years ago

on the contrary - sucking your pencil could employ breath and even teeth :) haha
and really do you think this movie is original ? there have been many similar already, at least thats the feeling I got

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[–] ELKronos 16 years ago

lol, I suppose if you do that with your pencil?

As for your question, do I think this movie is 'original'? No, I do not think it is terribly original. I've always found capgras to be extremely interesting though, and am unsure I've ever seen a movie have a take directly on this syndrome (I always wondered why they did not reference it more in invasion of the body snatchers). However, I found some of its aspects refreshing. I'm not saying it is the best movie I've ever seen, but I did not mind watching it.

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[–] fulci_fan2000 16 years ago

It wasn't orginal but you could cut the atmosphere with a knife. If only MIRRORS had this much atmosphere. THE BROKEN gave me the creeps.

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[–] gotmyorangecrush 11 years ago

Agreed! I didnt look at mirrors the same way for some time after seeing this film. I thoroughly enjoyed it and could care less if some people out there didn't enjoy it. I don't watch films based on what other people enjoy or dislike. I watch films for my own enjoyment and again, I thoroughly enjoyed The Broken.

Still Shooting With Film!

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[–] capnmorgan5150 14 years ago

I agree. I got it. I did. It's just not that great a movie. Where did the dopplegangers come from, and what was their agenda?

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[–] sgraf_x 16 years ago

Your insight into the movie is very good ELKronos. One question that I need answered is what the hell did the mirrors have to do with the dopplegangers? This is a major part of the premise and the reason I have a problem with the movie. Perhaps there is something in doppleganger lore with regard to mirrors? Or perhaps this was a way for Mr Ellis to put his premise into action? Either way it didnt work for me.

Also to expect the audience to make the connect between the evil dopplegangers warm behavior due to her suffering from memory loss or brain truama is one hell of an expectation. That was another nagging question I had which you answered sufficiently but still...

There is, NO Gene for the Human Spirit. Gattaca

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[–] mladomic 16 years ago

One question that I need answered is what the hell did the mirrors have to do with the dopplegangers?

because mirrors are perfect object.they look like a portal to other door.when you see yourself in mirror and know that thing you see in mirror is not actual thing.when you see left arm in mirror its actualy your right arm.where everything is oposit..

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[–] sgraf_x 16 years ago

thx for the response but I have already forgotten about this film.

There is NO Gene for the Human Spirit. Gattaca

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[–] 16 years ago

[deleted]

[–] gotmyorangecrush 11 years ago

Please don't generalize Americans like this. While a good portion of the US has become completely idioitic over the last 10-15 years, there are still some of us left that can actually use our brains.

Still Shooting With Film!

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[–] 3sha214 13 years ago

This movie reminds me of another movie about creatures on the other side. I just forgot the title I thought the title was "the others" but unfortunately the only movie I see of the same title was Nicole Kidman's.

Update: I now remember this movie reminds me of Wes Craven's They.

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[–] Myth-and-Mayhem 11 years ago

ELKronos: I really enjoyed your thoughts on the film! I really liked this one, although the ending left me wanting more--which may be a good or bad thing. This is a film that stays with you after you watch it, the kind where things are not black and white but abiguious. A pesky aspect of films for some people, but I really believe that the ambiguity is a precious gem in filmmaking, therefore I loved it. I wanted to know who, what & where of the "mirror doppelgängers". That's my only criticism is that I wished for an explanation. But then again, explaining everything rules out the ambiguous 'unknown' element, which I'm now starting to treasure more.

I think if your the type of person who likes, or needs, to have everything spelled out for you in a film, then you'll most likely not enjoy this. This may not be for everyone, but I loved it. Great suspense, acting, cinematography--the slow-motion repeating car crash was awesome--story, although I'd liked to have a little more, & pace. Loved the breaking mirrors premise. It was so chilling when we'd hear glass breaking in the background.

I'd almost rather they wouldn't of had the "explaing what happend flashback" towards the end. It lessened the film, somehow. There would have been enough information without reliving the "hospital breaking glass & shot of a woman's pumps" stepping down. Felt excessive as if it had been added because of a focus group, or the like.

Anyway, ELKronos, I enjoyed your interpretation of the events/questions from the OP, especially the last bit.

My Ratings: http://www.imdb.com/user/ur10767293/ratings

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[–] Ltn-Rob_Ripley 16 years ago

ARE u the Nisse Hult from Lidingö in Stockholm?? I´m just dying to know,cause IF U ARE,u know me pretti well! I´m Robban From Huddinge...Just saw your name on this post and REALLY REALLY WANTED TO KNOW if its u???!!!!

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[–] hungaro 16 years ago

when the brother is painting, and the phone is ringing he seems to be the "other" or "mirror" brother, who has already killed the real one. But in the other parts of the movie, incluided the final part, he seems the only one who is still "real".

2. Why does she throw the X-ray in to the bin at the end?

3. Has everything happed, or this was just a "game" of her mind? After all, it hasnt been any appereance of the police.

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[–] alexstone-3 16 years ago

well, to answer question #2, I guess it's to "dispose of" the fact that she's a mirrored version of herself, at least that's what I thought...

but, the biggest question I asked myself, was why the mirrored version killed the originals and entered the real world at all? there surely must have been a motive, or is that putting too much thought into it?
I thought the movie was good, but the end kept me wondering if it was worth it, if I had know it would leave me with so "many" unanswered questions, making the whole flick pointless in a way....

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[–] ELKronos 16 years ago

I was wondering this too. I wanted to know, but the director obviously did not want to make the movie about the motive, but rather the story itself. I personally think I would have liked the movie more if a why was established, but the more and more I think about it, the more I wonder if any motive could have been stated which made sense / was seen as original. I suppose I would have rather had the movie how it is, than to try to explain why in a poor manner which could have ruined the entire film.

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[–] stillvendetta 16 years ago

The motive was very clear. It's the "how" that is unclear.

Their motives were obviously to enter their counterparts worlds, kill them and take over their lives.

But there was no explanation on how they accomplished this and where exactly they came from. But even with this question still up in the air, I found this movie to be a breath of fresh air.

This is exactly the type of movie I like. This was a great thriller with a great twist if there ever was one.

Imagine if David Lynch directed this movie.

Lena would have waken up at the end and realized that it was all a bad dream.

The movie is perfect how it is though.

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[–] ELKronos 16 years ago

You missed the question.

A "motive" is (as defined by the dictionary):

"something that causes a person to act in a certain way, do a certain thing"

So the question is (to quote you)... Why did they "enter their counterparts worlds, kill them and take over their lives"?

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[–] stillvendetta 16 years ago

So the question is (to quote you)... Why did they "enter their counterparts worlds, kill them and take over their lives"?

???

They entered their counterparts world and killed them because they wanted to take over their lives. "To take over their lives", that was their motive. That was made obvious when they actually took over their lives after murdering them instead of just returning to their world.

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[–] derirre357 16 years ago

That's OK, but seriously - WHY did they WANT to take over their lives???

Women are like deer - You can't just charge in, you gotta stalk 'em...

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[–] vitkogan 16 years ago

Two things I'm not understanding after this movie:

1) WHY did all this started. What was the reason? A broken mirror on the dad's birthday?

2) According to one of the final scenes, Gina's original brother is the only one who survived? Nice.. the film-makers could think about the sequel now. Gina's brother is tracking down and eliminating the evil dopelgangers :D

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[–] Dogood_Silence 16 years ago

Maybe it is kind of like an invasion of the body snatchers type scenario where the evil mirror image takes over the original body. Just a thought.

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[–] TheDharmaIsland 16 years ago

maybe they want to take over their lives, because the world is taller than a mirror? i hope you understand what i mean (sorry for my bad english)

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[–] Nomack 16 years ago

Well their world seemed drab and dark and at the end the doppelganger seemed to be enjoying the sun. Also did it hint at more doppelgangers, with that Korean guys wife?

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[–] dkleanthis 16 years ago

Although I get what happens I still have questions

1. Why do they seem to target THIS specific family? Ok, they show the Korean's wife and hinted she is a doppelganger but still, everyone seems to be normal except this family and people they know

2. WHAT are these creatures?Are they some kind of creature(like the one in Ginas dream that giot into Stefan?). Are we supposed to believe that everyone of us has an evil doppelganger behind a mirror waiting to come out or are they just creatures that take the form of a human?

3. Why NOW?What triggers this attack of doppelgangers?Why not some days ago or some days in the future. And what triggers a doppelganger to decide to cross to the other side? Also mirrors are everywhere. Why didn't the come of from a random mirror e.g. the surface of a window?If a human avoids 'classic' mirrors will he be ok or shall he avoid windows, tv screens etc anything having a reflection?

4. Why didn't the other doppelgangers(like Stefan) try to make Gina understand who she is?

5. If doppelgangers succeed and take over the whole family, then practically it takes away the motive of survival. I mean, at first it was Gina. It is understandable why she wanted to kill the true Gina. I thought she wanted to pass for Gina. But then, if everyone Gina knows is a fake, and they all know each other, what's the point of killing, of being evil? Couldn't they live to another place?

6. Do the doppelgangers have other doppelgangers?Can Gina look in a mirror and another Gina come and kill Gina No2?

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[–] kompressor 16 years ago

Verry annoying movie, just don`t want to see Lena Headey waste her time like this...

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[–] 16 years ago

[deleted]

[–] dkleanthis 16 years ago

About my own Question #1

I did some searching and I think that when the mirror broke during dinner, an evil doppelganger was created for all people reflected in that mirror. I know, it is lame, but at least it fits: When a mirror is broken, the person reflected in that time will have an evil twin on the other side now.

(I still think that this is lame)

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[–] BrrandBA 16 years ago

or they all have tried to get out, but decided not, because there were too many of them and they started to fight who was going to be the first out:)

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[–] stillvendetta 16 years ago

The thing that annoys me the most is the fact that they never explain why the doubles come to our side...or where they come from...or why they picked them.

All 3 of these were answered.

1. They came over to the other side to take over their counterparts lives
2. A mirror world. This was blatantly obvious, as well as the first one
3. What do you mean "why they picked them"? There was no picking involved. They were their counterparts, they wanted to take over their lives, so they entered their world, killed them and took over their lives.

What was so complicated?

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[–] ELKronos 16 years ago

You are still failing to explain why, unless you are simply assuming that they are taking over the other world because they are evil and can take it over. Some people had hoped that there was more (you know, something which actually requires some thought). Perhaps there wasn't, and if there wasn't, it's a real shame.

The problem with your assumption is the director/writer build up the story at several parts of the movie to allude to more meaning than "they are doing it because they are evil and can". This is why you have so many people coming here asking what the meaning was. For instance, why would they discuss capgras detailing how it started in the 1920s, but since then has been more common in the past decade or two? Also, why not just kill us and return to their own world? Is our world better? If so, how is it better? Furthermore, if they are just evil and taking over the world for the hell of it why do they do this so infrequently and make attacks which are so unplanned / uncoordinated with one another?

P.S. I think it's great you're trying to answer the questions, but I would refrain from doing so unless you actually know the answers, and not just simple assumptions which do not have any evidence backing them.

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[–] jeffrey-nimmo-1 16 years ago

I have to say that I think a lot of people are missing the point. This is a mood film based on one very simple and I think very creepy idea: what if the image you're looking at in the mirror wasn't really you? The movie then goes a little further and asks: what if that mirror image had some way of getting out? And if it did, how would it react to you?

As far as the physics of how this is done and why, the director doesn't feel we need to know, and I agree. It's a film to be felt and not over-analyzed. Seriously. The more you think about it, the more absurd it becomes. Reflected doppelgangers from some hellish parallel reality suddenly gain the ability to cross over to our universe to murder their alter egos, afterwards hiding (or not) the body in a silly way, like under a leaky pipe in the attic. The whole motive for all this, apparently, being to brood ominously. Their faces sometimes have a corpselike grey pallor, sometimes not. Sometimes that changes during the same scene for no logical reason.

For logical incoherency, you need only look at two scenes. First, when Lena Headey's character drops her bottle of medicine in front of the bathroom mirror, then bends down to get it, her reflection stays and becomes murderously enraged. This would seem to mean that when these alter-selves come over, they themselves also have reflections who would like to kill them.

Second, the scene that ends with the brutal murder in the shower. It begins with the character preening in a mirror, perfectly able to see herself. Then we shift to that hellish alternate reality I mentioned, where instead of a reflection, the mirror is somehow a two-way mirror, letting whatever it is on the other side see our side without being seen (because whatever it was that broke through walked up to the mirror while we could see that the character could see herself already). Then the character takes a shower, sees an eye in a grey face staring at her, and is then promptly punched in (actually into!) the mouth. Since the jaw muscles are the strongest in the body I would think this would be a great way to lose a hand but the creature remains unperturbed and uninjured. By the end of the scene the creature has lost her pallor.

There are countless other examples, not to mention the climax which ends up being an anti-climax when you find out that the character you've been empathizing with through the whole movie is actually the monster.

In summary, it's a pretty good atmospheric movie with an at once clever and absurd premise. Don't look too hard at it and you'll enjoy it more. In this it's more like Donnie Darko than anything by Hitchcock. Just stop thinking. ;)

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[–] Aquaman-5 16 years ago

I agree with the previous post by jeffrey-nimmo-1. Everything that you need to enjoy this movie is laid out plain and simple. You just have to accept it for what it is. Many are bothered by the lack of motive or some nuts and bolts explanation as to how the dopplegangers cross over and who they are and what they want. If this movie had tried to explain everything it would have been VERY tedous and would have destroyed the mood of the film.

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[–] earthinsoul 16 years ago

This is the best analysis of the movie I've seen yet. Very concise and helpful (to me at least). Kudos! :)

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[–] immystified 16 years ago

THIS HAS SPOILERS.

I think (my opinion) the why is actually explained during the movie but it is quietly understated.

They want to take over their duplicates' lives. Which is why they kill and don't return to the other side. They want this life. A life not in darkness. This explanation is hinted at in at least four places: when the real Gina has finished her shower and is brushing her teeth - she goes to wipe the steam off the mirror and it reverses sides (which is darker than the reflected 'real' side); when Gina has the 'nightmare' and it shifts from focusing on a family laughing and enjoying life to one who is not (and denoted by the use of a cool blue tone); when the blonde woman is checking herself out in the mirror and the doppleganger is seen approaching from the other side; and finally at the very end when she is driving in the sunlight and ... smiling(?).

I didn't see the theme of the movie as being 'we are taking over the world' like you saw in "Invasion of the Body Snatchers." These mirrored beings saw a close-knit family and were jealous of it: of life in general.

After some reflection, since the duplicated Gina was able to have emotion, I believe that ALL would be able to after a period of being incorporated into the world. So, what someone might consider to be uncoordinated and unplanned 'take over' might not be that at all. Slow integration.

Also, someone else asked if the mirrored image could have another mirrored image who would then try to kill the previous version. In MY opinion, absolutely. Mirrors are used as portals into other dimensions and if you have a mirror reflecting into a mirror, the image is endless.

As for Daniel, they don't really focus on him, but I would ASSUME that the man we saw in the film who was staring at the painting was in fact his doppleganger, but just like the father - it took some time to actually kill him off. Maybe it just hadn't happened by the end of the film. Totally setting it up for a sequel (though I hope they don't do it - it will ruin what I found to be an interesting suspense/thriller).

Finally, throwing the xray away - the name on the xray was 'Gina,' and the guy next to her asked if it was that same strange medical case that they eluded to in the beginning of the movie. She was trying to hide the fact that she was not the 'real' Gina. The fact that they eluded to the reversed heart in the beginning is also proof that this event had happened before, and is also eluded to when the Korean guy tries to suggest that something is wrong with his wife.

Anyhow, I got long winded. But this is how I interpreted the film. I could be wrong; but this is my opinion. Agree if you like, or don't. :)

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[–] MrGoneJediKnight 13 years ago

Although I didn't care for the movie, thats the best explaination I've read for it..

So thanks.

___
Our Universe is ruled by random whim, inhabited by people who laugh at logic. -Dexter

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[–] hardcorecactus2003 13 years ago

Okay, here's one I don't think anyone's brought up. Why do they HAVE to take over the original's lives? Couldn't they try to make peace with the originals, or try to live a life of their own? Hell, all they want is to be in the light. Why do they feel they have to murder to do that?

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[–] MrGoneJediKnight 13 years ago

Yea, I kind of had that thought too. And I thought at one point maybe she was gonna find her double had been living as her for awhile or something. But no.

So yea, not sure why they couldn't have made peace or just taken off to live somewhere else.

___
Our Universe is ruled by random whim, inhabited by people who laugh at logic. -Dexter

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[–] Gary-161 12 years ago

>>Okay, here's one I don't think anyone's brought up. Why do they HAVE to take over the original's lives? Couldn't they try to make peace with the originals, or try to live a life of their own?

Some people don't get it no matter how many times it is said. They are evil dopplegangers. Hence Gina's menacing stare at the end. The point of Satanism is to be blasphemous and perverse. Crush all good and feeling and emotion. That is why we see the boyfriend during coitus as being of bestial disposition.

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[–] s3196291 16 years ago

They don't need to answer it.... it's not your cookiecutter hollywood stereotype, it's was made in the UK, where people actually use their brain and draw their own conclusions.

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[–] AznSlick 16 years ago

''Well their world seemed drab and dark and at the end the doppelganger seemed to be enjoying the sun. Also did it hint at more doppelgangers, with that Korean guys wife?''

Yes it was just showing the 5 of them being taken over, but if you can also remember the scene on the train where that old woman seems to be walking through the train pointing out all the 'mirror clones'.

Seems like the 'mirror clones' are able to pass through into the real world not just now but in the past too, must be doing it for a better life. This is shown at the end of the movie the relates to the start of the movie with the x-rays. Gina's (mirror clone) x-ray, the one she's looking at at the end of the movie shows the same defect as the x-ray at the start of the movie, heart being on the right side of the body.

I think what it shows it that everyone who has their heart on the right side of their body is a 'mirror clone'. She said it was rare, like 1 in a 1000 I think.
The real world suits them better from the dark room they seem to come from and over the years have slowly been entering this world. Maybe the mirror breaking at the birthday party, capturing thier reflection was somehow the reason how their 'mirror clone' could come through into this world.

I would think the 'mirror clones' also have the memories of the original (real) people as they seem to be getting by in the real world quite well for people who haven't seen the real world before. Plus there is a scene just after Gina's (Lena) 'mirror clone' has entered the real world where she is in a pay phone callin up Stefan (the boyfriend). She wouldn't have known him or his phone number if she didn't share the same memories as the original (real) Gina. After seeing her in the car she goes after her to kill her, maybe that's why she was also at her place of work, to find and kill her but couldn't.

After getting the job done she had the car accident which caused head injuries and led to some memory issues and forgot she was a 'mirror clone' altogether.

ELKronos 6 days ago
''Furthermore, if they are just evil and taking over the world for the hell of it why do they do this so infrequently and make attacks which are so unplanned / uncoordinated with one another?''

If it wasn't planned then the world would of known what was happening on a larger scale, not just ppl like the old woman on the train. The 'mirror clone' could also have been checking in on her 'mirror clone' boyfriend when she made her first phone call to see if he was through the mirror and everything was ok and after they met he was just waiting for her memory to return instead of frightening her with the truth that she is also a 'mirror clone'.

The only original (real) person left from the 5 was Daniel (the son) but it seems like his 'mirror clone' has already come through. Unless the one who was looking at the painting was him in a daze and couldn't be bothered to answer the phone.

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[–] awhite787 16 years ago

Yes!! I am so glad someone picked up on this. The Korean guy's wife, and in the beginning of the film when Gina is looking at an x-ray of a man named Dr. Walters, her assistant comes up behind her and they both notice the heart is on the right side of the chest. She says that this is a rare case, "one in every thousand". At the end of the film, he comes up behind her again, only this time she is looking at her own x-ray, and he asks if it is another case, and she just turns to him and stares at him and says "yes". And he has that wtf look on his face when she walks off to greet her brother.

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[–] BrrandBA 16 years ago

Great explanation! I loved it:) And I've got another one - the mirror world was pretty the same save the light. It was dark in it, all the time. So ... it might be not the height - but may be the light?:)

regards!

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[–] ELKronos 16 years ago

Exactly! You are still not answering / understanding the question correctly.

Maybe this will help you understand:

EX1: A guy robs a bank because he wants money.
He wanted money, and found a way to take it.
*Motive

EX2: A guy kills his wifes lover due to jealousy.
He killed a man because his wife was having an affair.
*Motive

A guy killed another guy to pretend to be him.
There may be a partial motive, for perhaps the movie is simply that they
are evil and wanted to. If this is the motive, it is extremely weak.
*No clear motive

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[–] stillvendetta 16 years ago

A guy killed another guy to pretend to be him.
There may be a partial motive, for perhaps the movie is simply that they
are evil and wanted to. If this is the motive, it is extremely weak.
*No clear motive

I get the feeling that you don't understand what a motive really is.

A motive is the cause that moves people to induce a certain action.

Action being - the killing

Cause being - wanting to take over their lives

There is nothing more to it. They clearly had motive, just like the bank robber clearly had a motive for doing what he did. He wanted the money, they wanted their lives. He robbed the bank, and they killed them. He now has the money, and they are now living their counterparts lives.

How is this confusing you?

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[–] ELKronos 16 years ago

If ignorance was bliss, you'd be orgasmic.

QUESTION: "What was their motive?"

Here is YOUR answer [albeit a weak answer]: "To take over their lives."

HERE IS THE COUNTER QUESTION: "Why did they want to take over their lives?"

Here is YOUR counter-answer: ...

Oh never mind you ignored the question, because you obviously had not answer and realized the stupidity of your prior statement. Care to answer it this time?

Please provide what support you have to base your answer on. :D

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[–] earthinsoul 16 years ago

If ignorance was bliss, you'd be orgasmic.

Can I get that on a t-shirt? ;)

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[–] stillvendetta 16 years ago

QUESTION: "What was their motive?"

Here is YOUR answer [albeit a weak answer]: "To take over their lives."

HERE IS THE COUNTER QUESTION: "Why did they want to take over their lives?"

Here is YOUR counter-answer: ...

Oh never mind you ignored the question, because you obviously had not answer and realized the stupidity of your prior statement. Care to answer it this time?

Please provide what support you have to base your answer on. :D

Wanting to take over their lives IS the motive. You are asking what the motive was behind the actual motive and this could actually go on forever. Lets say the motive of the motive was because they were hungry, well why were they hungry? "Because they need to eat", well why do they need to eat? "Because they have to survive", well why do they have to survive? "Because the Earth needs to remain populated", well why does the Earth need to be populated? "So the natural resources could be used" Well why do the natural resources need to be used?

...

You see what I'm saying? You are making it more complicated than it actually has to be.

It was simple enough.

Doppleganger's want to take over their counterparts lives, so they enter their world and kill them. It's THAT simple. There is an act and there is a motive behind the act. Did you come out of The Dark Knight asking what is Batman's motive behind WANTING to save Gotham? No. Because he does what he does because he WANTS to save Gotham. That is his motive for doing what he does.

It's really funny how hard you are making this seem.

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[–] kursum1 16 years ago

what was their motive.

well a mirror is too tight to live in.

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[–] gotmyorangecrush 11 years ago

I hate to say this ELKronos, but you are absolutely CLUELESS. He has stated time and time again what the motive was. It was to take over thier lives. Now you want the motive behind thier motive. Jesus man, get an understanding of what motive means, lol. And there have already been multiple reasons given as to why they might want to take over thier lives in the first place. Maybe they wanted to take over thier lives because the outside world was nicer. Its not all dark and gloomy and people actually have purpose on the outside world. Maybe its so they can kill thier counterparts. Maybe its becasue they were jealous of the lives people on the oustide live. It could have been for any one of a hundred reasons, maybe simply to escape the other side becasue they were sick of being on that side. It doesnt really matter tho as the why is really irrelavant. Its not important to the film. Were told everything we need to know, that the Dopplegangers wanted out and wanted to take over the lives of thier doubles. You don't need to know anything more to understand and enjoy the film. Explaining things too much can be just as bad as not explaining them enough. The film wouldnt have had the atmosphere it had if they had taken all of this time to explain the why.

I honestly feel sorry for people like you, people that have to have everything explained and cant just suspend disbelief for the sake of a story.

Still Shooting With Film!

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[–] legnadibrom 15 years ago

you are one dense motherfunker

http://www.last.fm/music/Disuse

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[–] immystified 16 years ago

See my previous post for explanation of motive, from what I believe. Sure, it might still be 'weak,' but its a movie, and one that was made to make you question things and use your imagination. :)

A guy killing another guy to pretend to be him to have a better life is motive. And one that happens ALL the time. Watch Forensic Files or Cold Case sometime. :)

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[–] BrrandBA 16 years ago

Vanity of the living.

Jealousy of the dead.

Need more?

They explain the whole point at the very beginning with the quote of Poe's words. To apply the quote to the film we should remember some important things about mirrors: in symbolism (which is the key to understand Poe's works) mirrors are the windows to the world of the dead - we shouldn't look into their world too much not to attract their attention... because of the next thing to keep in mind - that they easily become jealous of life / of the living. And what do we do nowadays? We MUST be beautiful so we MUST check in mirrors ourselves :)

And I have the idea why Daniel is alive - he doesn't really care how does he look.... Remember the bruise on his head? After taking the picture Gina says: "You are so ugly. Look at you face!" So his 'evil - dead - impostor' didn't really have time to prepare itself.

I hope it isn't too far-fetched.

Regards.

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[–] ELKronos 16 years ago

As was stated Beeko, 'jealously of the living' or 'vanity of the dead' are ok motives (a little simplistic), but I think some people here were looking for more than that. There could be a million reasons as to the 'why', but I do not think one thing sticks out more than another. Perhaps there is nothing more to it than that. It's not a bad thing, the issue was that some people (specifically the poster the question was directed to) could not understand what was being asked.

As for the quote itself, and claiming that it is the land of the dead, this is sort of a stretch. Again, I'm not saying what you claim isn't true, I'm just saying I believe people were looking for something more, and that actually resonated with the movie in its entirety better. I think what you suggest would be an extremely cool idea, but I feel that there is really little evidence in the film to support this is what happened and why.

If that is the point that should have been made, perhaps the characters in the film could have been portrayed as vein, or actually interested in looking in a lot of mirrors to sort of incur the wrath of their counterparts or to at the very least attract the attention you suggest. It also does not seem to resonate well with the main occurrences in the film (e.g. how the main character forgets who she is / acts differently). If they are merely mindless / evil / dead, then it seems to make less sense she would behave in the manner she did through the vast majority of the film. It also I do not believe that the word 'dead' is correct to use here because the people in the film were still alive, and since they had not died, why did counterparts exist in the world of the dead, unless you are going out even further and suggesting an alternate reality in which dead counterparts exist, which is a huge stretch. 'Dead' has connotations implied with it, and using it in this manner does not seem to fit with the way the word is defined, and it almost seems a little too unoriginal to state that the dead are jealous of what we have (which again could be the case here, I just wanted to give the writer more credit here, which perhaps may not be justified).

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[–] BrrandBA 16 years ago

Thank you for your reply. You may be right, and I realize I could have applied too much in it.

I think the film was really OK, partly because we can have some ideas of what it is about, and because it was nice watching it. Scary - not much, a few scenes only, disturbing - yes, because not clear, without answers, some food for thought. As someone said before on IMDB about The Broken - a wink to Hitchcock, and some other old-school directors. I agree.

If I have some other ideas, I will write.

Regards.

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[–] ELKronos 16 years ago

Yeah, I welcome your ideas, and I by no means want to say they are wrong. I did not fully think of it in the manner you did, and I think the idea you had was pretty neat and I think it would be a great movie to do (if done differently). If this is what the broken tried to do, I think they went about it in a bad way which doesn't fully give your notion of the background all it deserves in originality. I just think it is easy to think of the 'dead' as 'bad' or 'evil', and I had just hoped there was more to it than that.

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[–] mattdsgirl 16 years ago

My two cents:

I believe that Daniel is alive by luck or chance. If you recall, Gina's double is seen by a co-worker before she is murdered. The father's double is seen by a co-worker before he is murdered. Perhaps Daniel's double had not gotten around to murdering him. Even the woman on the subway can recognize the double/imposter, but has difficulty when faced with Gina's double. I think that was due in part to the brain injury suffered during the transition process. Gina's double expresses emotion, or human mannerisms too well.

"Even if I wanted to express sympathy, I physically can't" - Wilhelmina Slater

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[–] 16 years ago

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[–] MovieGirl79 16 years ago

Excellent explanation, beeko-2. Spot on.

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[–] ezizabef1 16 years ago

I'm pretty sure it was just paint on his face--he's an artist.

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[–] awhite787 16 years ago

Yes, kudos, thanks for the reminder about the quote from Poe. I looked back at that scene, and zoomed in 3X to read it, after I read it, it made a little more sense.

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[–] catlebrity 15 years ago

Because life in the mirror world sucked. WE got a few images from the POV of people in the mirror world; it was dark and creepy, illuminated only by the light coming through the mirror.

----
http://blankingdelicious.tumblr.com/ Replace "blank" to get the real URL.

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[–] Mastadge 16 years ago

I have the same question. I get that they were taking over their counterparts' lives -- but why? Why come and take over a life when you're just going to live a cold version of that life? What's the appeal of the other side of the mirror? What's their incentive for invading?

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[–] immystified 16 years ago

I posted earlier about this, but it is my opinion that you'd see adaptation from the 'cold' to the 'warm' just as Gina (albeit through a head injury) was able to appear more human.

A slow integration into the world would give each mirrored image the chance to study and pick-up mannerisms as necessary to survive undetected.

Incentive and appeal? To live a better life. Every instance you see of these beings, they are encased in darkness. You even get a glimmer of a smile from Gina at the very end when she is driving in the sun.

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[–] lvas-206-321358 13 years ago

aye, I found it confusing too, but the more I think back on it and the counselor's diagnosis that she suffered some kind of brain trauma, is what led to the amnesia, paranoia and uncertainty Gina experiences about the people in her life. I think the reason why everyone else was taken over by their doppleganger was not to show that everyone was suffering from the same 'evil alien invasion' but more so to show an ENTIRE world where EVERYONE in Gina's life after her accident is distorted, because how she lives in the world is now changed, 'broken'. This film, I found, will confuse people quite easily (as it DEFINITELY did me) because the 'structure' and plot of the film is actually far more simple - I started to think of the film 'They' with paranormal creatures living inside the mirrors, where the dopplegangers are evil creatures that break out and take over someone's life.

Instead I do think it's more to do with Gina's descent into the symptoms of amnesia, paranoia, claustrophobia, fear - and like I said above, the reason why everyone else is murdered by their own doppleganger is to show an entire world that's taken over by her symptoms. This is why the accident is key, and why it keeps being flashed back to, because the trauma after the accident is what has changed Gina. Which, for someone suffering a syndrome like Capgras Delusion, IS their distorted reality - schizophrenics cannot connect to the 'real' world around them, the things/people they see and the way they see them cannot be changed and understood by someone who is mentally 'normal'.

Little spots of evidence I found in this film to back up the above ideas: after Gina gets the tests and the radiographer wants to continue them, when she leaves the hospital and the doctors are watching her from the window, this gives the audience suspicion of the 'authoritative' persons Gina is dealing with and that they cannot be trusted. Also, when she explains what she is feeling to the counselor and he calmly gives her a diagnosis, here - with some good acting, personal opinion - Gina is obviously distressed but keeps a lid on it and is happy to play along, but clearly doesn't believe him. This also makes the audience suspicious that the counselor is trying to help her, and is in fact in league with the unnatural occurrences.

The tension, fear and paranoia that she's being followed in the tube station and I honestly believed that she was being set up to be murdered by a doppleganger.
This paranoia and distrust of 'authoritative' persons that are responsible for Gina is also typical of how schizophrenic patients view their own doctors etc.

Gina's uncertainty when she's in the bathroom at Stephan's place, and keeps looking at herself in the mirror; the theme with mirrors, I think, is that you can no longer see your own reflection in the world and the way you perceive the world around you is also 'broken'. Another funny visual effect - after staring at Gina staring at herself in the mirror, I became so familiar with her reflected image that I started to think the cut above her right eye was in the wrong place, because in the mirror, it looks like it's on the left of her face. Her x-rays show that her heart is on the 'wrong' side of the body - everything is now parallel in her life, the opposite way it should be.

Also, when Stephan tries to break in - it's never clear if it actually IS him, but I'll go back to her paranoia and anxiety to creating this herself. And before anyone thinks that I'm being too far-fetched and writing it off so simply, if you research a bit into schizophrenic disorders you'll find that people do suffer very 'real' delusions of being attacked, hearing noises, seeing people/disturbing images, or strong physical reactions like suffocation.

And the final scene, where she remembers she 'killed herself' - if you think back to the first Edgar Allan Poe quote, Gina finally realises in some sense that everything that has happened to her after the accident is her, and no one else. She lives in Pembridge house, and has forgotten this as part of the amnesia. She cannot believe she is the woman who lives there. She was the woman before, but she 'murdered' herself because her mental state has completely changed, by nervous breakdown where she smashes the mirror and then gets into the car and crashes it, being preoocupied with her own reflection. Not only has she forgotten who she was before but she has no idea who she is now. Her father, too, unsure of who he is in reaching retirement as he won't have a purpose in life, also stares at himself in the mirror as if trying to see who he is anymore.

Sorry, this has gotten far longer than I meant it to. But like I said, I think the entire film is cleverly shown the distortion of reality that seeps through a person's whole reality (large panned shots of London, etc, to create an image of a larger world). The reason I think this film is clever, and worthy of watching, is because it instills in the AUDIENCE itself an idea of schizophrenia, feelings of suspicion, paranoia and anxiety - bloody, graphic and tense scenes to give the feeling of fear - so much so, that if you've actually read my entire description, you're still left disbelieving that everything that happens to Gina could have happened through her own mental illness.

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[–] 13 years ago

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[–] last-c 16 years ago

I will throw in another trivial thing: Mirrors are accepted as gateways in some ideologies. To where? It depends.

Legend says that children of Lilith (supposed first wife of Adam, who rebels and flees to mate with demons) can reach out to their mother through mirrors.

I can recommend "They", which is also about a parallel "dark dimension" on the other side of walls & mirrors.

How many of you believe in telekinesis? Raise my hands.

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[–] deniro1 16 years ago

Too many here are worrying about the "why" or the "motive". It doesn't matter. They are evil. Evil beings do evil things. It's just a horror movie!

It kind of makes me think about Hitchcock and his "maguffin's". Where there is something in a movie everyone is after, but what it is doesn't matter, it's just a plot device to make a movie where people are after something. Like in Pulp Fiction, what is in the suitcase is never told or explained. It doesn't matter. All that matters is people want it.

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[–] Pestarzt 16 years ago

"Too many here are worrying about the "why" or the "motive". It doesn't matter. They are evil. Evil beings do evil things. It's just a horror movie!"

Exactly. I too came to the question "Who are they, why are they doing this, how does it work, blah bla.." but it really doesn't matter and it wouldn't change a thing because that's not what this movie is about.

I thought it was a good movie which made me feel fear again while sitting in front of a screen. It was no reinvention of the genre but let's be honest, we're looking back on 100 years of movie making - it's a rare case that something is really new.

I loved the silence of the movie and the disturbing noises when mirrors broke. And of course the twist was good. I didn't expect it to happen that way.

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[–] Famazon-chester 16 years ago

According to Wikipedia:

Some stories offer supernatural explanations for doubles. These doppelgängers are typically, but not always, evil in some way. The double will often impersonate the victim and go about ruining them, for instance through committing crimes or insulting the victim's friends. Sometimes, the double even tries to kill the original. The torment is occasionally earned; for instance, in Edgar Allan Poe's short story William Wilson, the protagonist of questionable morality is dogged by his doppelgänger most tenaciously when his morals fail. When doppelgängers are used as harbingers of impending destruction, they are almost always supernaturally based.[15] Some works of fantasy include shapeshifters, as either talented individuals or as a separate race, who can mimic any person.

Personally, I think not more clearly stating the "why" and the "how" are the film's big weaknesses. I kept bugging me throughout. Just a little more bit of reasoning would have been helpful, especially at the end after the big twist.

But then again, I'm an American.

Betsy
Famazons.com
"I like him, he says Okey Dokey." - Dean

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[–] andromache3 15 years ago

I think peoples' frustrations with the lack of apparent motive shown by these creatures/entities or whatever the hell they were supposed to be had a lot to do with the fact that we didn't know what they actually were. Were they doppelgangers or demons? It's never fully explained and that's my main grievance with the movie. This movie was a rip of of "Mirrors" and "Invasion of the Body Snatchers". It borrowed too heavily from those stories. The scene where Gina's brother's neighbour was complaining about his wife was almost identical to a scene in the seventies version of "Invasion of the Body Snatchers".I would have liked to have watched something a little more original.

"When we make mistakes, it's evil. When God makes mistakes, it's nature."

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[–] nsmadsen 13 years ago

Agreed - radders999. I liked the overall feel and some of the performances were quite good. But the fact that the film never addressed the key point of HOW doppelgangers are busting out of mirrors then killing the "originals" - makes the overall film very flawed. I get everything else about the story and the reveal at the end - I just hated that the film expected the audience to just accept that an evil doppelganger is going to bust of the mirror and kill you. Stupid really.

--
Nathan Madsen
Composer-Sound Designer
www.madsenstudios.com

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[–] 11 years ago

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[–] Pania8407 11 years ago

It's a stupid movie, that's why you don't get it.

So many plotholes. I usually look past particular ones but this one just a pointless movie.

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[–] sandifay62 11 years ago

I don't think this movie is the greatest or the worse. But It's not pointless to people who are into this kind of thing.Being taken over and having someone you love taken over is a common horror theme that scares a lot of people.

The people that made this movie made it for people that are scared by this. All anyone can do when they make a movie is make it and hope enough people feel the way they do about it.

For people that are terrified of this theme, the movies aren't necessary. The IDEA of being taken over is the scary part. The motive is that there's some entities whether demonic or extraterrestrial want to kill you and become you. The movie established that this is happening slowly but surely all over. No one is safe and there's no way to stop t. That in itself is nightmarish if that's a them that scares you.

Once the woman started to think her boyfriend "wasn't the same" I figured it was a take on the "Body Snatcher" theme.

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[–] Pania8407 11 years ago

Have you seen a David Cronenberg film called "Spider"?

I recommend this film to you.

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[–] sandifay62 11 years ago

Yeah, I saw it a long time ago. It was OK, too.

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