They had plenty of chances to take the gun.

No, I would have thought rationally. Just like when I had a damn Rambo knife pulled on me. There are people who freeze up and/or run away. And there are people that don't.






Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by rulers as useful.

nicver ^

"Guns are very intimidating and terrifying."

I was raised around guns and taught how to use them by a military-trained marksman (my father). I don't think that guns are as 'intimidating' or 'terrifying' when you are trained in their use (safely, I might add).


A gun drawn on you, though, no matter what your training, CAN be intimidating and terrifying, I agree. I have been there somewhat in (3) different situations. One was as a teenager: I had a .38 put right in my face in closed quarters (the back seat of a car). Nowhere to run in that scenario and I suffered because of it. However, I think I got out of the situation alive, at least, due to alot of fast talking and persuasion on my part. However, the victimizer in this situation was not the same kind as a mass shooter, who very often cannot be negotiated out of killing.


Second time was a would-be mugger, years later, in daylight. That time, I had more freedom of movement, I sensed what was happening just before the gun was coming out of his jacket and as the guy was trying to close in on me, and I managed to flee to an area where there were people and the guy took off (I had been at a supposed 'safe' tourist venue, and I had parked aways from it, and this guy apparently started tracking me when I left the public area, if not sooner). Although I reported him as soon as I could, he did manage to victimize another person shortly after my experience with him, but he was soon apprehended and, yes, he did have a gun and also a knife -- a wicked knife, at that.


Third time, a guy was coming up to me while I was at an ATM (again, in daylight) -- he seemed to come out of nowhere -- posing with something in his pocket (to this day, I don't know if it was a gun or just his hand/finger, but you must always assume that it is a gun). I did three things -- automatically and not with much forethought: I flicked my ATM card one direction (I had not yet input my code), threw my car keys as far as I could out in the street another direction, and ran off screaming a third direction. He fled. Probably thought I was nuts and too much trouble to deal with -- in micro-seconds, my card was going one way, my car keys another, and me very loudly a third. He *could* have popped me one, if he truly had a gun and wanted to, I suppose, but I successfully drew alot of attention to me, he surely did not want to get caught, and he may have been 'just a robber' and not a would-be murderer. In any event, if he was going to try to victimize me and even shoot me, I was at least not going to make it easy for him.


I am not saying that any or all of my actions were right or wrong. I just know that I (as a female) have been in dicey situations where I potentially could have lost my life, that the law essentially won't allow me to arm myself in a meaningful way (believe me, I would have zero problem shooting to save my life), and that my own experience has taught me that I have a better chance at not being victimized if I can get away and not allow the criminal to take full control of the situation (as possible) than if I 'freeze' or otherwise can't get away.


"We had role playing sessions in the military and even knowing the gun is not loaded puts you in some weird submissive mode."

Really??? My father was career military and fought in 2 wars, and I never heard this from him.



Also: I have been in 'school lockdowns' on more than one occasion (I frequently work in schools). During one, the aggressor was thought to have a gun, but he actually just had a screwdriver. During lockdown, we are told to lock the doors, hide, stay quiet, and stay away from the windows. Part of the training, however, does not entail much about self-defense or anything like that, which I think is wrong because just hiding your a*s, hoping & praying doesn't mean that will be all there is to it. We might not want to think about 'the next step', but I think better prepared than not.


People sometimes DO act on their own and defuse a situation. Look what happened with Kip Kinkle when he went on his spree at Thurston High School in Oregon. However, Columbine was different as it was very planned, there was a lot of different weaponry involved, and there were several shooters involved (there is controversy over whether there actually were more than 2 shooters). However, one thing I do know is that kids who ran, threw themselves out of windows, etc., had a much better chance at survival than those who either could not or would not leave. Not saying that fleeing or attempting to intervene will always work and all situations are different, but in my mind, the probability for survival is higher if you act.











"I can't stand a naked light bulb, any more than..a rude remark or a vulgar action" Blanche DuBois

Some keyboard Rambo's here. They are two teen girls - what would they know about MMA and conditioning themselves mentally to take on a loco dude with an MP5? Even with Special Forces types and elite Police units - they undertake constant training to deal with these scenarios, to condition their response. Yeah, average citizens have taken on crazed gunmen or loonies (and I think of that flight that went down on 9/11) but not everyone is going to react the same manner.

I saw the potential for a move to rush the dude on the reload too - and staring at death, I'd like to think I'd have a go myself - but seeing as I've never been in that situation nor trained for it, I might be just as transfixed by the barrel of that gun as most other people would be.

And having a concealed carry permit is in no way relevant to a couple 17/18 year old girls in a movie. In any event, they would not be able to be armed at school.