Through flashbacks, we see what happened to Joseph and Samuel's parents in Tauron, and how the brothers come to an important decision. Daniel catches the hint that the Guatrau will want him dead next. Meanwhile, Zoe and Tamara's new-found fame in New Cap City eventually draws Daniel's attention.
Some background on the Adama family this week. We see the heart-wrenching story of how Sam’s theft of a gun leads to the death of both their parents. We learn some background details on the Tauron fight itself – the Hercs being the bad guys and attempting genocide on the poor Taurons – labeled Dirteaters no doubt to ridicule their allegiance to the Tauron soil. I know madp said that the rebels aren’t necessarily the good guys and he makes a valid point. But from what we know now, I’m going with the Adamas are better than the Hercs. I was actually delighted when Joseph took out the four of them, and was disappointed to see the female one still breathing at the end. Hopefully she died painfully and slowly. This all mixes in with Joseph discovering his brother is secretly smuggling Cylons to his fellow Taurons. But after his trip down memory lane, Adama goes not only with the Taurons but more important with family. Good for him. Also, I was glad to see him with Evelyn again. They make a nice couple.
Joseph also tries to help Daniel, knowing the latter’s days are numbered. Daniel takes the hint from clues Joseph drops during their boxing match, and checks on how others have fared after joining with the Ha’la’tha. The answer is not well, not even breathing. He launches a trade of Cylons for Sam in exchange for him getting more time for his Resurrection program. So far, he’s still breathing. Also, he’s discovered that Zoe is alive in V-world. It pays to advertise – even when you don’t really intend to. One lucky Zoe fan gets 100 cubits for his T-shirt with the Avenging Angels. Nice. Next week, Daniel and Amanda try to find Zoe.
Poor agent Durham is outdone by Gara and booted off the force. His (supposed) CI gets burned by his boss, but he’s the one kicked out. How ironic that the evidence against him contains the scene where he says “I work for Caprica,” meaning he works for the people, not corrupt bosses. And just after Amanda has managed to plant the bug, too. Darn.
Finally, we have the V-world story. Zoe and Tamara are quite the team. Their would-be assassins shout “No fair. She brought a gun to a knife fight. Who let her watch THE UNTOUCHABLES?” At the end, we see Zoe actually remaking New Cap City to her own design. Can she do that because of her superior programming skills? Is that why Clarice wants her avatar? Because with it each person can create their own virtual paradise as she is promising? Could be. Either way, we seem to be getting one step closer to apotheosis, whatever that actually is. I’ll give this one 8 Adama family lighters.
Now a few questions: I thought I saw some dialogue in the recap that I don’t remember hearing in prior shows. I’m wondering if they had an episode they never aired or they just shot a scene that they couldn’t use due to time limitations so they used it in the recap instead. Or do I just have a bad memory?
Is it agent Durham or Duram? The subtitles this week spelled it Duram, but IMDB lists it as Durham, and they’re usually right. Anyone remember if he had a nameplate on his desk with it spelled out? (Maybe they’re too cheap to buy nameplates on Caprica.)
When Daniel asked the fate of companies that merged with the Guatrau, he is shown five companies with “bankrupt” or “dissolved” printed over them. Then he asks the fate of the CEOs and he gets six pictures, his own included. So why weren’t there six companies in the previous slide, with his the only one still active?
by brimfin » Finally, we have the V-world story. Zoe and Tamara are quite the team. Their would-be assassins shout “No fair. She brought a gun to a knife fight. Who let her watch THE UNTOUCHABLES?”
Or Raiders of the Lost Ark...
Can she do that because of her superior programming skills?
Good question. I always thought Zoe and Tamara had complete control of "the Matrix" like Neo had. They are part of "the code" or whatever... New Cap City is supposedly an extension of themselves.
Is it agent Durham or Duram?
It's Duram. Last week's episode (I think) shows a caption with his name, when some of the key characters were named.
When Daniel asked the fate of companies that merged with the Guatrau, he is shown five companies with “bankrupt” or “dissolved” printed over them. Then he asks the fate of the CEOs and he gets six pictures, his own included. So why weren’t there six companies in the previous slide, with his the only one still active?
Nice catch and good question. I half thought that and then thought that I must have missed Greystone Industries in the previous slide. Nice to know I'm not that old and senile.
Yet.
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I'd've gotten away with it, too, if it weren't for you meddling kids.
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OK, in the beginning I thought the Tauron flashback wasn't really telling anything we didn't know already, but in the end I'd say it paid off. let's see. We already knew Sam was more tradition-oriented, and it seemed Joseph ("Yussif") had sold out to the Caprican ways. It was a sign of weakness.
Now, however, we know that Joseph, as the older brother, had to carry the greatest burden. It was Sam that was reckless to bring a stolen gun home (never do try that at home, kids). And it was Joseph who did the brave act of returning his father to the soil. It was Joseph who suggested making a pact with Sam so they would always be faithful to each other. And Sam, still reckless, still wants to help the Tauron people to pay a personal debt he'll never be able to pay, not just for the love of tradition. So, at first, I thought Sam was simply more dedicated to the Tauron ways than Joseph, but things are not quite like they looked like. Come to think of it, the flashback was a great part of the story. Oh, and I loved the transition in which the image of the kids dissolved and was superimposed with the image of their adult counterparts.
As for whether the rebels are the good guys or not, well, so fat that's the only piece of information we got about where both sides stand. The rebels are faithful followers of tradition, simple folks really, while the other side (brimfin called them Hercs but I don't remember that from the show; I'll stick with Hercs anyway) seems to be a fascist state which disdainfully call the Tauron folks "Dirteaters". Of course, there could be more sides to this fight, but so far i'd say the rebels are the proud victims. And it's disturbing that after all these years, the same gang remains in power, and the rebels still seem to be the same. And big and rich planets like Caprica won't do anything because "they weren't asked" or something.
Agent Duram's attitude ended costing his badge. Someone said last week that he should have pretended more shock when telling Singh about mar-Beth's death, considering she was his pretend CI. Now, he directly confronted Singh and apparently lost. But I'd say Duram simply isn't devious, he isn't equipped to be like that. While Clarice is pure deviousness, he is direct as a punch to the gut. But anyone can see this isn't the last we see of our favorite GDD agent. I just felt concerned about Amanda now that she realized her handler was out of the department. What is she gonna do?
The girls are kicking ass, and normally I support bringing a gun to a knife fight, especially if you might lose. But come on, that was a low blow. They are invincible as it is, even fighting with blades, and they will win anyway. To me that was pure lack of sportsmanship. This way people will flee New Cap City like people fled Orkut.
Not that there's much of New Cap City to see now that it was transformed into a forest with mountains in the background. Cool CGI trick, by the way. It shows that nothing we see in a show has to be real, and with enough budget they can create any illusion they want for a show. That sort of spoils the movie magic. But the girls, now protected in their castle, are shaping V-Reality to their own image. I wonder when they'll decide to leave V-World and start reshaping R-World to their own image too.
So,Clarice subtly (well, not so subtly) suggests "statues" in paradise. Statues of the "people who were there from the beginning," which would feature her prominently, of course. I wonder if her husbands will get to be some tiny statuettes at least. Some trophies? Book-ends? Anything?
Anyway, concerning my discussion with dtmuller last week, what did Clarice effectively do for the STO, well, if it was Barnabas who orchestrated the mag-lev attack, then Clarice only has promises on her behalf. She's not the big shot I thought she was. But in this episode we see at least that while her husbands are part of the "tech support" team, they seem perfectly aware of what their tech skills are going to be used for. Unless they have no idea the idea of man-made paradise will come in the aftermath of the implosion of a stadium full of people? I find that hard to believe, but it could be the case.
There was also the part with Daniel and Sam, and Sam finally sending at least one Cylon to back the rebels on Tauron. And Daniel is a survivor, and he knew what buttons to push when talking to Sam. He's like a cat with 9 lives, and the Guatrau will not get rid of him so easily. In fact, I'd bet on Daniel, now that the Adamas have joined the fight against the Guatrau, that Caprican traitor..
Anyway, it was a solid installment, even though it was not heavy on action. It left a very good aftertaste as it made significant additions to some important characters' background. This one proudly gets 9 manhood tattoos.
The rebels are faithful followers of tradition, simple folks really, while the other side (brimfin called them Hercs but I don't remember that from the show; I'll stick with Hercs anyway) (madp)
They were actually referred to as Heracliedes; I went back and checked. I was too tired to go back and check when I was doing my write-up, so I just said Hercs; I knew it would at least be close.
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the name heracliedes is weird, because i wonder if we are supposed to assume they are linked to hera, to heracles, or (somehow) to the greek philosopher heraclides
as for this episode, i like that with only a few episodes left, we seem to be setting up a few major elements to end the season--i'm trying to remember when the producers would have known the show was not returning, if they had time to plan the finale as series finale rather than season finale. but, the graystones wanting to meet zoe as she and tamara are redesigning v-world, daniel, joseph, and sam all turning against the guatrau
and the tattoo stuff intrigues me. i remember reading about the tattoos for the ha'la'tha when this show first aired, each one had a specific meaning so the production actually put some serious thought into what tattoos each ha'la'tha character had, even if the audience would never get to know them all... that is the kind of behind-the-scenes detail i love in a show
since folks in these threads make a habit of rating the episodes, i'd say this one rates 8 out of 10 neck tattoos, especially because it distracted me from some homework
by robertegblack » since folks in these threads make a habit of rating the episodes, i'd say this one rates 8 out of 10 neck tattoos, especially because it distracted me from some homework
Thanks you for your participation. I personally like grades because they allow us to compare episodes and shows in a sort of objective way, besides saying something vague as "I liked it" or "I didn't like it" or "I sort of liked it."
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I personally like grades because they allow us to compare episodes and shows in a sort of objective way, besides saying something vague as "I liked it" or "I didn't like it" or "I sort of liked it."
I was offput by it at first because it reminded me of those Frackin' surveys you see from every corporation with whom you do any business, or even of health care workers demanding you rate your pain on a scale which I call meaningless as every person has different perceptions and thresholds of pain.
Although I did get a kick out of one doctor who didn't know or perhaps just didn't care that I was overhearing his comments to his peers grumping about people overrating their pain and giving rather colorful and frightening examples of what a 10 would be.
I've since come to appreciate the practice within this group, though.
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I'd've gotten away with it, too, if it weren't for you meddling kids.
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Well, to tell the truth, I mainly supported doing it because when I joined the group it was already being done, so I decided to carry on with the tradition.
Sorry about the later postings. I've got a new job on second shift and I'm still adjusting to a new schedule.
When Joseph got Daniel into a boxing ring and advised him to learn his opponent's weakness and use it against him, I thought he meant the Guatrau, not Sam. Daniel always did think outside the box, though. Interesting that he could research one's past and know a guy's buttons to push, though. Perhaps his attempt at reverse-engineering Zoe's sentient avatar creation program did leave an influence on him.
Sort of fitting that Clarice's husbands would get such a juvenile charge out of the Avenging Angels and not even catch on that they were the original Zoe Avatar and another one created with her original program. I thought that was funny.
Nice background on the Adama's past life on Tauron, and why the newly restarted civil war means so much to Sam.
Also nice to see little Willie again. Still running interference for Uncle Sam against his daddy. Also glad to see that Evelyn and Joseph are still an item.
Cool transformation of New Cap City into a medieval fantasy world complete with a castle with the Avenging Angels in charge. Those two rule!
Gave awesome background and still found time to move the story ahead in the process. 9 unused red suicide capsules.
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I'd've gotten away with it, too, if it weren't for you meddling kids.
I liked this episode a lot going on Sister Willow trying to perfect her heaven program seems like she wants less of god and more of herself when people start arriving. Poor Detective gets screwed I guess the GDD is corrupt like most big city police forces. Daniel has made the connection that he might not make it too much longer history tells us that the Guatrau takes no prisoners. So he makes a deal with Sam Cylons for his own life. Spent some quality time on Tauron what a place to grow up watching their family being murdered for what reason well that’s still un-clear to me. Guess I should have paid more attention watching. Will the real Amanda stand up never really sure when Daniel is talking to the Avatar or the real Amanda. Well next week they both take off in search of iZoe and the new world she is making.
Going to give this one a seven.
Oh forgot to mention will be heading north next month fly into the mistake by the lake and head west for a few day. Should be nice weather up there maybe a little humid.
by bob-402-252005 » Sorry about the later postings. I've got a new job on second shift and I'm still adjusting to a new schedule.
It's all right. As long as it's not a mysterious third shift at Graystone Industries, you'll be OK.
by wlcebtg » Will the real Amanda stand up never really sure when Daniel is talking to the Avatar or the real Amanda.
Yep, I have that very same feeling. I always wait a few seconds to assess the scene and decide whether it's the Avatar or the real Amanda. But in theory the Avatar is gone, right?
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I'm trying to let go of figuring out how we got here from where we supposedly started. There are too many unanswered questions and too much tossed aside; it'll never be tidied up, so I may as well just enjoy the rest of the ride for whatever it's worth. But I'm having a hard time with that.
To the extent I can, however, it did make this a rather enjoyable episode. The backstory on the Adama boys was well-done, and I have to give credit to the guys who played young Joseph and Sam--they even managed to work in some of the adults' mannerisms.
Zoe and Tamara have just managed to throw away New Cap City. I have no clue how that happened, but I was so sick of that place that I'm happy to say, "Good riddance!" and leave it at that.
Loved the look on Daniel's face when he read "DECEASED ... DECEASED ... DECEASED ... DECEASED ... DECEASED" and his photo was next in line.
The only downside to this one--and it was significant--is that I'm getting really sick of the brutality on this show. As I mentioned a couple of weeks ago, I keep coming back to Zoe's condemnation of all the people who use V-world as a source of gory entertainment, and I can't help but think we're doing the same thing. Well, it'll all be over in a few weeks. I'm ready to move on.
wlcebtg: Oh forgot to mention will be heading north next month fly into the mistake by the lake and head west for a few day. Should be nice weather up there maybe a little humid.
Hey, I've spent a lot of time there; although I was born in Detroit, both my parents are from Cleveland. They have pretty much the same weather we do, so you might be surprised. It hasn't been very humid this year. Very odd, because it's been raining more than normal.
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Shows don't like to kill off the main characters, particularly if said characters exist in a later series (like Joseph Adama and his son) due to the continuity issues, so these shows do everything they can to psychologically torture them.
At least when someone is killed, they are dead and the pain (for them) is over and done with. Maybe not if reincarnation exists, but you get my point. Ongoing hardships... now that's ugly, particularly as they're being enacted by the show's writers.
What does it say about us when we create shows like this with un-people specifically to be abused?
Jake Meridius Conhale, at your service! "Old Man" of the BSG (RDM) boards.