MovieChat Forums > The Princess and the Frog (2009) Discussion > The white sidekick being more popular th...

The white sidekick being more popular than the black heroine


How very sad. Even in a Disney movie you cannot escape racism and white privilege. I could not agree more with this confession:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/aac49a7f1defdd5bf43e370bf05e0617/tumblr_mfz gd6FMiy1r1uuc8o1_500.png

Especially these comments about it-

I think it’s extremely telling that she’s arguably the most popular character from that film… a film whose black female protagonist spent all of about ten minutes on screen in human form. She wasn’t even a necessary character. There weren’t very many characters in the film who were, if we’re being honest. But out of all of the characters in the film, Lottie is the one people in the Disney fandom seem most fond of. I can’t say I’m surprised by that, just really saddened. Of course, I did think up a nice sequel idea that could possibly redeem the character a la Anastasia in the Cinderella sequels, but I digress... Lottie is grating as a character.

PATF has so many issues, though, and I often feel like I’m fighting a losing fight when I try to defend it but the movie does mean quite a lot to me and even if fans of Tiana are few and far between, she’s one of my top three favorite Disney Princesses.


I didn’t like Charlotte either, because I feel as though Disney felt they had to throw in a Disney Princess Type (white, heart of gold, etc.) in order to make the movie work, which was really annoying. She got so much screen time, most of it when she wasn’t with Tiana, something that no other DIsney sidekick gets. I realize that in that aspect she’s important to the plot, but she’s nothing more than a White Savior. I understand they were trying to go for a friendship thing, showing a support system of women, which is rare in like 98% of movies anyway, but it just wasn’t working at all. I didn’t see Charlotte as malicious in her own way, but the essence of her character was detrimental to Tiana. Her whole friendship was based around keeping Tiana in her proper “place,” class-wise, and “giving” Naveen to Tiana. Change a scene or two, this movie could have easily been about our special fairy princess Charlotte and her perfection.

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oh Lord help me.

You're hideous and sexy!

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Comic relief characters are frequently favorites.

Furthermore, on the White Savior topic, Disney sidekicks almost always either get the main character into trouble or out of it. Timon and Pumbaa save Simba from death in the desert, the Genie saves Aladdin from the Cave of Wonders and drowning, Roquefort frees Duchess and her kittens from a trunk, Jaq and Gus deliver the key to Cinderella, the seven dwarfs bring about the death of the queen; if all of these protagonists were black and the sidekicks white, someone would be calling them White Saviors.

That aside, Charlotte didn't even save Tiana and Naveen. They basically saved themselves.

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^^lol preach it man!
wztch her come back and say thats not enough, white privilge blah blah..

You're hideous and sexy!

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You can deny the existence of white privilege if you want . . .I know I did for a long time, but I see things very differently now.




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Of course you do, it's called "white guilt".

Conformity to political correctness and the demands of greedy, privileged minorities is just sad and needs to stop. No wonder America is how it is.

We're collecting dust, but our love's enough.

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It really has nothing to do with guilt, I cannot feel guilty for anything I have not done. If you think minorities have privilege that is pretty hilarious.

Some people just feel more comfortable believing that, I guess. As long as overt displays of racial discrimination that a white person can see and experience then you declare that the war is over, equality for all!

Hear no evil, see no evil.




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I get really annoyed whenever a person throws in an entire group of people to prove a weak point. The reason black people have their own channels were because there weren't hardly any of them on tv at the time due to discrimination. MTV really took a successful risk by playing Micheal Jackson's music videos because the young fans wanted that and I commend them for breaking that barrier.

NAACP is an organization that helps ALL people nowadays. I mean, if it were the 1960s...I would say that it was only for blacks, but believe it or not white, brown, red, etc people are a part of the group as well. Might not be a lot, but they are there. Wish it was like that for the KKK...not really...

The reason for affirmative action goes back to discrimination from work, schools. (another reason that there are all black schools *that whites and other non blacks attend believe it or not*) But not all black students want to attend all black schools and sometimes there were unfair treatment. There were blacks who were definitely qualified for a job only to have their applications and resumes thrown away simply for the color of their skin.

There were (and still are) a lot of people who are afraid of change and feel threatened so the backwards Jim Crow laws, voting laws, interracial marriage laws and bad laws in general from the past came into effect unfortunately which led to all black organizations, schools, work. It was sad that there were people who couldn't stand seeing black politicians, black voters, black business owners. The small percentage of ignorant poor whites (not all whites were that way whether whatever class they were in) but those few who couldn't stand seeing that raised hell and that of course formed Jim Crow laws which got rid of the black rights. Thank goodness laws like Jim Crow are banish and unconstitutional so that's the end of that. (But you have to be blind or deaf if you're not aware of the small percentage of crazies running around simply because the US president is half black. Those crazy racists. lol. Not talking about the people who disagree with his politics either.)

Ignorance is the reason for affirmative action, colleges, tv stations, magazines for blacks (and even latinos and asians)! Not saying that the other magazines don't feature people of color. Just stating that there's a reason for those magazines.

And from what I've been told and see from the magazines (African American in particular) is to show America and the world the positive (and realistic) side of blacks. Family, love, music...

And as for the Disney movie. It isn't a black movie. Its a family movie just as Beauty And The Beast, Aladdin, Snow White...I don't see black people complaining about racism as you stated in your post. I see the OP stating their opinion, not the entire black people.

It isn't as if this stuff was handed to blacks. That's what I got that from your post, alboz11. If it isn't what you meant then I apologize in advance since I will most likely not return to this topic.

I'm not trying to start any trouble here. Like you I'm stating my opinion and what I learned from people and history books, videos. And this may not have anything to do with the topic, but I had to state my response/opinion.

PS...Charlotte was definitely not the popular one from the movie. Ray was(at least second to Tiana and Naveen! Not everyone even knows who Charlotte's name is...just the friend of Princess Tiana.


Breast milk is sweet!

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Which "black tv stations" are you referring to? The one owned by a white man, which frequently shows crappy TV that sets back the accomplishments of blacks like Rosa Parks by about 30 years? Black magazines? Like Essence, which is again owned by a white man? Affirmative action? Lmao, white women benefit from it more than any other group does, and yes they are considered minorities.
Black colleges? They are in steady decline, and they also have non-blacks enrolled. I know, what a shocker!


You can't be this dense, so I'm going to assume you're a piss-poor troll. :)

"Hunger Games is the Barney version of Battle Royale"-gchan1337king

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Yes, white women benefit most from the very things they are excluded from. That's... illogical.
I can get a full college scholarship unfairly and unequally based on my appearance because a white guy did it- Help, I'm oppressed!

And yes, "considered" isn't "factually". Whites are technically a minority in the world. Even in America black people are hardly outnumbered (and hardly oppressed, for that matter, but hey, first world problems rock).

And please, people, use "troll" correctly. If she was a troll, she'd be the winner here for successfully trolling you. Troll, like racism (for the OP), doesn't mean someone who hurt your feelings or whatever you want it to mean. Either way, your defensive tone and name-calling implies you believe she is right.

http://tinyurl.com/SocialJusticeLeague

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she was created to appeal to people, there's no point having a sidekick who doesn't. they are often the highlight of the film. it just so happens that she is white

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^ I agree.

Sidekicks are always more "fun", 'cause they don't have to be the main character, who goes through the "big" changes, etc.. Main characters usually have to be more "middle of the road". Sidekicks have the freedom to be more extreme.

It happens on all TV shows and movies.

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ARE WE REALLY GONNA USE TUMBLR AS A SOURCE LMFAO.

I ship ~~Makorra~~

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I disagree with the person that started this thread. I believe Tiana is more popular than Charlotte. Heck, even Disney places more emphasis on Tiana then Charlotte! They didn't even include Charlotte in the Disney princess lineup, something I almost expected them to do, even though she didn't get the prince in the end (spoiler).

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They didn't even include Charlotte in the Disney princess lineup, something I almost expected them to do, even though she didn't get the prince in the end.

Are you kidding??? Look, I know Charlotte was 'the princess of Madi Gras', but overall she has NO claim to being a princess, let alone sharing that status with ANOTHER girl in the SAME movie!

Heck no. That's never gonna happen in a Disney film, lol...

One princess per movie. It would be too much, otherwise.

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lols tumblr will never be as a strong a platform for "social justice" as it is a platform for funny overly photoshopped gif sets and memespouting.

o, ye of little faith.

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Tumblr is still better than IMDb ibr.

I ship ~~Makorra~~

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Uhm...this thread is pretty f!cking dumb.

Sidekicks are often pretty popular, and besides Lottie was awesome. Tiana is one of my favorite characters, and not because of anything to do with her race. I'm a white male, and didn't go into the movie thinking about race. Race is arbitrary, so you trying to stop trying to start nonsense threads about it.

Tiana is a great character. She works harder than Belle, Ariel, Cinderella, etc. She has drive and ambition. I thought she was pretty popular so I'm not sure what this nonsense from tumblr is going on about.

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Harder than Cinderella, the nearly enslaved girl?

The others yes, but they don't work at all (unless you count Ariel working to win Eric's heart) so that isn't a really fair comparison.

http://tinyurl.com/SocialJusticeLeague

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I liked Tiana much more; she was my favorite character in the movie.

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