Those bikes were just too big - Long Way Round (2004) Discussion

[–] evilbungle 19 years ago

A dirt bike would have been best through Mongolia but you wouldn't want to ride it for 6 months. The BMW is big but is comfotable, I doubt you could get a better bike for all terrain situations.

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[–] Nikon11 19 years ago

I think that I would've taken a 650 dual purpose bike (Suzuki, Kawasaki, or Honda), if I were doing the trip. Much lighter for the trails, and big enough for a ride on the highway. I never would've considered those BMW tanks.

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[–] nme1963 19 years ago

Interesting comments. I haven’t seen the TV docos but I’m reading the book at the mo, so hopefully I’m not quoting what is already common knowledge.

After Charley drops his bike before leaving London Ewan states “Had we chosen the wrong bikes? Were they too heavy? Had we overloaded them? And how the hell would we cope with them on the rough roads, swamps marshes and deserts of Asia…”
Charley States “I’d always favoured the lighter KTM over the BMW. And now it seemed I might have been right”.

Charley favoured the KTM from the beginning and won out over Ewan who initially wanted the BMW. Ultimately KTM declined sponsorship without imposing unacceptable conditions, so they went with BMW who were very enthusiastic and supportive of the whole adventure.

So the choice of BMW was based on politics not practicality ultimately.

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[–] eldenhiemer 19 years ago

I think that you nailed it on the head with that one. There was a lot of politics involved in the bike choice. Not to mention the comfort issue, I have done a lot of offroad riding and to talk about how easy the trails are is not practical; there is no way to see how easy a trail is or is not until you can ride it. How many times have you droped into something that looks "easy" to end up eating dirt...I can tell you with me, it has been many. The roads always look good and solid but what about the factors we don't know. The sand content of the them, how dry they are, the wash out weakness and things like that we can't see on tv...not to mention the overall general weakness of the riders on an adventure like that. It is easy to say that they bite it on easy roads if you ride for 4 hours (on just then bike with no additional gear) then go home to your supper and bed...but after riding for even 3 days straight over terrain like that, and with that much gear, even the most fit riders would be tired and suffer general fatigue.

They needed a good all around bike, they found it. They needed a company that had a big name and lots of money to throw at them...they found it. The only thing that would have helped is if they had loaded down a little less..but even for me to say that, well I can't because I was not doing that trip. Unless you know the distances you can acheive (estimates only work for so long) and then the intervals between supply stations, etc..etc...yes they had support vehicles but if you just load up the trucks with all the gear you wil need there is no adventure in that at all...it would be like hiking the appalachian trail with a guy on a ATV behind you towing your gear.

The bike choice was good...the adventure was good..and some day I hope I can get time, money and the balls to pull off something like this as well.

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[–] james20a 19 years ago

A lot infact most of BMW bikes i have seen are big and bulky.. i don't like them =/

† Steph †
Spikette #161
"So does he have a hump? a hump and a hair peice?"

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[–] 19 years ago

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[–] Nikon11 19 years ago

That kind of makes sense. But then again, why do Ewan and Charley even need sponsorship? The bikes cost around $15,000 each, and I'm pretty sure that they could've afforded it themselves.

Whatever.

While it is hard to tell how difficult a trail will be before riding it, it makes sense not to take a bike you can't even lift on your own onto terrain that may be rough.

I loved the series. I just got hung up on the bikes - being a trail rider, I kept imagining riding in those areas with those huge bikes, and it seemed like a bad idea.

I'm not criticising them for choosing the bikes - I'm feeling sorry for them.

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[–] james20a 19 years ago

I'm thinking that insurance would have had a lot to do it. They need insurance for everyone and everything. Yeah they still could have afforded it themselves.. probably.. 2.. maybe 3 times over. But maybe they needed a sponser inorder to get the show eligable to TV?

† Steph †
Spikette #161
"So does he have a hump? a hump and a hair peice?"

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[–] joey_pesci 19 years ago

Yep, I've been thinking that. Hence it slightly put me off Charley when he went off on a hissy fit when KTM wouldn't give them the free bikes. If he really wanted them, they could of afforded 3 of them themselfs. I know they had to pay for the show to be made, but I'm not sure if they got a budget from Sky for the making of the show or part cost of the show, as it was on Sky that it was aired and I'm sure that would of been finalised before they set off.

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[–] naynay245 19 years ago

I think Ewan wanted the BMW because it was big and he could see himself riding across the world and being safe with such a big reliable motorcycle. Those bikes got dropped in dirt, sand, gravel, and even water yet they held together for the most part to New York. On the point of being able to afford bikes they probably could have but I doubt they could afford the whole trip. Which is why they were sponsored by BMW and made a deal to turn the trip into a show. They had to rent an office, hire workers, buy tons of gear, pay for visas, and tons of paper work. Not to mention when they had to pay off some border guards!! In the book Ewan mention how they needed to find someone to finance the trip because Charley would not be able to take that much time off and not work. I also believe they did give the BMW bikes back didnt they? I will have to double check on that....

It scares me to think that you could find takers other then me and better then me....

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[–] EasyRider32 19 years ago

Besides the lack of sponcership from KTW, to sum it up. BMW was a better choice because it uses an axel drive vs the chain driven KTM. Chains require constant oiling and maintanance.

A good article is in the March 2006 Canadian Biker "Travels with Charley" its an interview with Charlie Boorman at the 2006 Toronto Motorcycle show. Here is a interesting question and answer regarding KTM.

Steve Bond (Interviewer for Canadian Biker) "Is there still a spot in your heart for KTM even after they pulled out at the last minute, leaving you a bit in the lurch?"

Charlie Boorman "It's a shame as I'm still rather fond of KTM's and I;m still quite confused at why they said no. I think Eqan always wanted to go with BMW, and to be truthfull, BMW was definately the right choice. Look at the KTM adventurer, there's a lot of plastic there and the bike was quite new when we were making plans. Honestly, I don't think KTM would have done the trip"

I think Charlie most likely made this remark basically because KTM really screwed their plans. Now BMW was smart. Look at all the publicity they have after they beat up their bikes for 6 months and they keep on running.

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[–] 19 years ago

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[–] HaChayalBoded 17 years ago

Although a smaller dual sport might have been better for some of the terrain it simply would not be the ideal choice for a trip like this.

First it is very uncomfortable for long distances.
Second, they are chain driven, meaning more maintenance and care, especially when there is no one around to fix it. They had a pit crew but others would not.
Third, even with aftermarket tanks the smaller bikes do not have the same range as the bigger BMWs

With that said, there have been many, many people who have done round the world trips on smaller bikes, Harleys, scooters, Urals, Vespas e.t.c. There was even a double amputee who rode a Harley around the world for a few years, with no support vehicles and definitely not a few million in support like these two. Clearly those other bikes were never designed for such a trip or to take such abuse but they made it.

I am planning a similar trip, perhaps in the next year or three. I plan on doing it on an older R1100GS or similar bike. I will have no support vehicles other than myself, and the remote possibility of a second rider and bike.

However there are forums and websites with like minded riders and a "black book" of names, phone numbers, addresses of people along the way who are willing to help in any way they can. I was surprised that Ewan and Charlie didn't use since it is called the BMW Black book. But as you can see, 99% of the people in this world are kind and willing to help in any way they can.

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[–] bumrash85 19 years ago

Did anyone stop to consider how much gear they had to take along with them? And, for that matter how heavy a bike they would need to withstand all the conditions they were going in to? Perhaps a smaller bike wouldn't have taken as heavy a beating as what the BMW's did?
OK ok, I don;t know a lot about bikes but I'm sure the boys had their reasons for choosing the heavier BMW. Also, I would say it was a good thing that they did because when Ewan got hit in Calgary, or just outside of Calgary, a smaller bike may not have made it through the accident. Ewan has said that the heavier bike probably saved his life because it was so heavy to get off the road.

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[–] art-by-sadolf 19 years ago

I'd have thought the lighter BMW F650GS would have been a better choice as its that much lighter but still big and comfortable.

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[–] Nikon11 19 years ago

That was my point.

If you've done any off-road riding, you know that those bikes weren't the ones to ride for the rough stuff.

You can ride almost any dirt-bike on a paved road, but you can't ride many street-bikes off-road.

I guess it's a moot point now, anyway. But I'm guessing that if they were to do it again, they might make a different choice.

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[–] 19 years ago

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[–] 2narnia 19 years ago

I dont agree that the bikes were too big. They had to cover a lot of ground over many days. The heavier bikes provide a smoother ride over poor roads. The lighter the bike, the more punishment the riders would receive, and that added fatigue would have made the impossible sections of the trip all the more grueling. Even with the larger bikes, the frames cracked numerous times under the load they had to carry. It was a trade-off to be sure, but I think they would have regretted using a smaller bike.

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[–] mrwelvrig 19 years ago

BMW was the best choice for one main reason, shaft drive. I think the fact that the bikes performed as well as they did should prove that BMW was as perfect a choice as any other. It seems strange KTM backed out because they were afraid of "failure". If the riders fail, so what. They're humans after all, KTM still gets some publicity. If the bikes fail, that's a different PR situation. BMW knew their product wouldn't fail. As for the big tanks, riding for hundreds of miles with no real civilization to speak of, I'd probably wished they were bigger. Tip the bike, pick it up. Run out of fuel, hope help is close, hope no one with a gun wants your stuff, hope no bears want your stuff...
I should also mention I ride BMW, maybe I'm just bias.

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[–] rabid_halfling 19 years ago

They may have been big, but as they state it was a runner up choice, i think they did a great job in general. What an adventure. I was so jealous. LOL

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[–] soft_spread 19 years ago

You need to look at the whole picture the 1150gs they rode had long service intervals shaft drive and tough frames and suspension if you do a lot of miles on bikes and understand the diffrences of German and Jap bikes you will know.

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[–] Nikon11 19 years ago

Hey, you guys do what you want. Ewan and Charley did - so fine.

I was just making an observation based on my own experiences of being knee-deep in mud, while trying to drag out a couple 250 and 350lb bikes.

I understand that driving 60 mph on one of these on a highway can suck. But I was looking at the whole picture.

So, when planning your own trip, please keep in mind that after you leave the pavement, and you eventually get stuck, and you will get stuck, there will not be a camera crew coming out to rescue you. You will not have BMW sponsoring your trip. It will be you and your buddy, exhausted, and probably wishing that you had something a little smaller and more maneuverable.

Again, I was just picturing myself in their situations, and forming an opinion based on my own experiences, and I know what I would do.

I was not criticising them, but had more of a feeling like, “oh, *beep* a smaller bike would ride a lot better through that.”

As I said before, you can ride almost any dirt-bike on a paved road, but you can't ride many street-bikes off-road.

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[–] 19 years ago

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[–] flagday53 19 years ago

I haven't ridden in years but I had some of the same questions:

You're Ewan, why not have two bikes? Couldn't you get them from the same company? One for off-road, one for on? And couldn't you buy them yourself?

But then the frames, even on the big bikes, were cracking under the load. And buying them didn't get the company involved - sponsoring - it was big venture.

Question: you can't ride off-road bikes with camping gear? I know at the end they trashed MANY pounds of equipment, which they might not have needed all along. HOW MUCH WERE THE BIKE'S HAULING?

And then the other consideration was the goal. I think the guys wanted to demonstrate that YOU TOO COULD DO THIS. And it's hard enough for the common man to do let alone have a support team with a second set of bikes to switch back and forth as conditions warranted.

SPOILER
Claudio was obviously doing better off-road with his small Russian bike and he was carrying gear, but he definitely screwed up when he was taking in the view and hit boulder (was that when they replaced the BMW with the Russian Bike? didn't he mess up afterwards again? They probably stole from him because he was on the Russian bike. And he comes to UK with no license.)

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[–] Nikon11 19 years ago

I was just thinking that one like this might be a better bike for what they were expecting. A lot lighter, and you can attach saddlebags, and carry enough supplies.

I think that the BMW’s frames cracked partly because of the bike’s own weight as much as from the load.

http://www.kawasaki.com/product_detail.asp?product=60&category=2&tag=motorcycle

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[–] odyssey1 19 years ago

Well we can all bag out the big beemers but they did an awesome job on a whole. How many bikes can go 20,000 miles through that kind of treatment and only end up with frame and exterior damage?

Also how many of you would want to ride a harsh dirt bike carrying those loads 20,000 miles. I would put my life savings on the line in saying that a handful of other bikes would have had much more trouble and not have made it half as far.

One more point, was it not priceless watching the 3 falling consistenly and the frustration and strain in trying to lift the bikes off the ground!!!

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[–] tinpan56 17 years ago

I can understand what you're saying, but I think the simplicity of the air-cooled R series may have been a factor. The F series are chain driven which may have been a factor in their decision due to the added maintenance - the guys had enough to deal with without cleaning their chains and oiling them all the time.

BMW was definitely the right decision - their engines never broke down, only the frames cracked. Whichever model you'd choose it'd have to be a BMW.

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[–] Nikon11 17 years ago

They looked like great bikes, and I would love to ride them on pavement or dirt roads - but not through some of the rough terrain in Mongolia and Russia.

It must've been tough pulling them out when they got stuck.

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[–] Sonatine97 17 years ago

I've only ever ridden up to 1100cc sports bikes and the odd sports-tourer, but never an off-roader like the Beemers they rode.

However, I feel they made the right choice with the 1200s. Beemers have superb engines and will take a hell of a lot of beating before they break. Ultimately it was only the frame that let them down (and rear suspension in the sequel - they still used Beemer 1200s for "Long Way Down" which proved their faith in the model in spite of the weight factor)

I don't know if KTM feel like idiots now that they've been so publicly abashed. Perhaps they just didn't have the confidence in their bikes for such a trip (more so given it was going to be filmed and broadcast to millions). Kudos to BMW for having the gonads to walk the walk, while KTM just talked and ran!

I also believe Charley's hissy-fit at the news was not because he wouldn't be getting a free-be KTM but more because it was so last minute. And because Charley had always loved and placed his faith in KTM in the past to deliver the goods. And then they pull out. Is it any wonder he was amazed and angered!

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[–] RedWheelbarrow 17 years ago

"I also believe Charley's hissy-fit at the news was not because he wouldn't be getting a
free-be KTM but more because it was so last minute. And because Charley had always
loved and placed his faith in KTM in the past to deliver the goods. And then they pull out.
Is it any wonder he was amazed and angered! "

That was my reading of Charley's hissy fit, too. I loved this program; it was amazing how the guys stayed positive, for the most part. Ewan, especially, would give himself a little "talking to," like when they'd had a rough day and it was raining a bit on his diary camera and he said something like "I'm sorry for the drops on the lens, I can't be bothered to clean them off." And then says to himself, "that's not the attitude to have, is it...." and wipes off the lens.

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[–] Sonatine97 17 years ago

Yes I agree you there. Ewan especially, could have simply resorted to his "I'm a big movie star, don't you know who I am? I don't do video diaries or wipe camera lenses!" Btu to his credit he mucked in and became "one of the lads", for this show at least.

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