MovieChat Forums > 3:10 to Yuma (2007) Discussion > Insulting to the Western Lawmen

Insulting to the Western Lawmen


Lawmen of the old west were tough, they certainly wouldnt back down to criminals because they were outnumbered 7 to 5. Just ridiculous and insulting.
Also there was no need to take him to the train, just kill him, the movie was silly.

reply

Although I agree that fictional western lawmen we grew up with in the movies and on TV were tough, I have no idea how real western lawmen would have reacted when the odds were 24 to 5. (remember the towns people had taken up guns to get the $200.)

And killing him would not have gotten Evans the $200 he needed.

I disagree that the movie was silly, although there were parts I thought were less than believable. For example, when the gang was outside the hotel, any one of the lawmen could have shot Charlie Prince and that would have ended the threat.

Also unbelievable was when the Evans boy had the drop on Wade back in the mountains, Wade gave up. Nope, don't think so. He would have walked up to the boy and taken his gun because he knew the boy would not shoot him.

"We're going to need a bigger boat..."

reply

Actually remember toward the end, Ben said to Dan "I really thought your boy was gonna shoot me back there" and adds something like "he had a wild look in his eyes"

Everybody Wants Some!!

reply

Also the way Crowe was confined was ridiculous, tie him up like a mummy, and if he kills one of your men you must kill him on the spot.
The worst part was the way the Lawmen were portrayed, they had to be tough and couragious to be a sheriff in the old west, and these guys caved like a bunch of pansies, its just disgraceful!
I like Russell Crowe, he was great in Gladiator, but this movie was just awful!

reply

Just to throw in my two cents, I found this movie more believable. There are no Dirty Harries or James Bonds in real life. What those lawmen did was show some common sense. Same as when Wade dropped his gun when the kid had him under shot. It even slightly bothered me that Wade could draw his gun as fast as it was shown.

Gladiator is different, those were practically all man-on-man fights, not to mention fights there was no escape from. Nah, this movie nailed it good imo.

reply

[deleted]

"A few hundred bucks"? You seem to be handy at throwing around understatements. Money was worth ALOT more in those days.

I'm not going to reply to your moot argument about good Westerns. You'd much rather have stereotypes and rehauled storylines just because most other movies that took place in 18th-19th century America did so?

"No town folk would bla bla etc. " Unlikely, but you can't know for sure. Nobody that was there still lives, and books can lie too.

I can't argue about them being charged for murder, or the marshals being idiots for not shooting them from the window. Many characters in this film made stupid decisions, but not without reason. The kid obviously seems to have some hormonal issues, which bothered me at first because he looked like he needed a good whooping, but that changed throughout the film. Dan just doesn't seem as bright as a character and simply wanted to be held in high regard by his son.

Nevertheless, good sir, for calling someone you hardly know a moron you simply suck, period. I bet your social skills are about as rotten as your ego. Take this advice and hold it high: It's one thing to have an opinion and state it, but it's another to state it as a fact.

Now shoo.

reply

[deleted]

I just watched the movie, and it was good enough. It wasn't great but there aren't a lot of westerns being made right now so I take what I can get.

However, I think you, mgtbltp, might want to go get some therapy or something. You have posted on about every thread I've read thus far tonight. For someone who hates the movie as much as you, it would seem the last place you'd spend your time is on the forums of a movie you can't stand.

So it's either one of two things: 1) you are just trying to start fights for the fun of it or 2) you are not right in the head. I hope it's more a case of #1 and someone will just report you for trolling, but I believe it's probably a case of #2 and you should seek help from a professional.

reply

[deleted]

You know, most sheriff's were former gunmen themselves. Its how they were elected. You could think of it being more like a town-wide bouncer than what you would consider a police officer.

Read up on the real Wyatt Earp.

reply

[deleted]

"mgtbltp"

I know enough, good sir, to call them as I see them, the film obviously appeals the non discriminatory souls, your case in point, and to those of lower intelligence.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
What a tool.

reply

since you're into pseudo-intellectual online snobbery, i have attempted to apease your foppish sensibilities in this reply.

firstly, it was not $200, you dim-witted mouth-breather, but $200 _per_ man killed.

this was obvious to all but the slowest of intellects. assuming your mental impairment continues to this day, the product of $200 times the number of men to be killed (which was five if you are able to maintain sigle-digit numbers in that thick skull of yours), is no less than $1,000.

the amount of $1,000 was specifically established to be a considerable amount of money; enough to re-stock a man's cattle, hire ranch hands, send two children to school, and provide a life of relative easiness for one's wife.

your desire for the adherence to established Western conventions makes me wonder if you are in fact the viewer of lower intelligence, bolstered by the apparent distaste for "action" in a Western. tell me, you ignorant git, how much of the established Western convention have you actually absorbed?

perhaps watching films about the drama associated with hard living and the continual process of determining what is right and wrong is too much for your delicate intellect.

reply

[deleted]

"Yea sure, provided that EVERYONE in the town became ACCESSORIES to the MURDER of their ELECTED law enforcement officers. What a MORON, its complete STUPIDITY to accept the scenario of the film"

Isn't that what happened in Clint Eastwood's Pale Rider. So what did you think of that movie?

reply

[deleted]

"Adhering to established Western conventions"?

So, basically, you'd rather see exactly the same movie made over and over and over again for decades on end than see something a little bit different?

Honestly, if you're going to be arrogantly dismissing other people as "non discriminatory souls" (I'm assuming what you actually meant is "non-discriminating"--it wouldn't hurt to proofread your posts), then you're going to have to do a lot better than that.

reply

[deleted]

So basically, since this movie included US Marshals acting in a cowardly or incompetent fashion, it no longer counts as a Western? Do you seriously think that cowardly and/or incompetent people did not exist in the 19th Century US frontier?

reply

[deleted]

Even as a lawman it's nok ok to shoot a villain on plain sight...

The father wanted to be remembered for something good in his sons eyes, the only reason he wanted to fight so hard for 200$ at that time...

Although i found it strange that Ben Wade ran so fast and to the destination that Dan Evans told him at the end of the movie, when you are being kept prisoner, you usually doesnt help the person holding you, and at some points Ben Wade could easyli have jumped him when he were shooting in opposite direction...
And this is before Ben Wade found out he pettied Dan and wanted to help him show off to his son.

reply

mgtbltp, you are one serious troll.

The city of Contention was a mining town that only lasted for 8 years. The movie is set right in the middle of this. The population at its peak was probably only 200 and since the town was all built around the mills, the vast majority of the population was likely lone males with little in the way of roots or ties to the town. Using the price of gold as a guideline, $200 in 1884 would be roughly equivilent to $10,000 in 2010. For a transient miner, that's a huge amount of money. (Also, the movie is supposed to be taking place during a drought, which would likely put a greater number of people in desperate times). Arizona Territory was also fairly remote, and the presense and reach of law enforcement was not nearly what it is today. If you take all that into consideration, it would have been more unbelievable if men in the town hadn't accepted Prince's $200 offer.

As for shooting Prince from the window, no, a good lawman wouldn't have done that. First off, in the real world, making that shot isn't guaranteed. Secondly, unlike the viewers, a lawman wouldn't know how important Prince was to the cohesiveness of the gang. Thirdly, a lawman wouldn't know what was going on in the rest of the town. He wouldn't know if the gang had reinforcements out of sight, or if help against the gang was on its way. All He would know is that if he started shooting from the window, what was currently just a standoff would quickly escalate into a firefight, and once that happened, what little control they had over the situation would be completely gone, and the train was still a ways away. A smart lawman, who didn't have ESP, and was intent on getting Wade to the train, would have tried to maintain the standoff for as long as possible so as to make sure he wasn't in the middle of a gunfight when it came time to actually try to duck out of the hotel.

Oh, and just to make your blood boil, mgtbltp... The 2007 version of 3:10 to Yuma is MILES better than the original. You can cry about it all you want, but people who watch movies agree with me, as do people who judge movies, write movies, act in movies, finance movies, and direct them. In other words, the people who actually have a say in the business of movies think your opinion on movies is nonsense... and thank god they do.

reply

[deleted]

[deleted]

[deleted]

Well as a Native Arizonan and someone that lives in the path of teh contention yuma line I will say these things, neither Contention nor Bissbe were "mining towns" then or now. that minng segments was digging to lay track for the southern pacific. in 1884 200 dollars was a farm mortgage. and I guess Sheriffs were more respected because if you dont think here we will turn on an elected sheriff ya best look up sheriff Joe. Also this is a tale based on a true story. this is MY state history you are spouting off about. the law here was mostly useless then. the men wanted to sae their tails and go home to their families. There were no lawmen on the trip to Contention, and dont say McKelroy because he was not a cop, Marsshal or sheriff. he was a dirty, low down, woman and child killer working for the Pinkerton security company. He was introduced by Butterfield as a Bounty Hunter. Dan and William were ranchmen, that moron that got it with the fork was a leg breaker for teh bank,Butterfield was an accountant for teh Pinkerton Securities Company and the Doc was a Vet, not a war vet, a animal doc.

Yeah Wyatt Earp woulda shot Prince outta his saddle but there was a reason there were several warrants for Sheriff Earp's arrest on man slaughter and assault in several states.and if you recall it was 200 dollars per man, 5 men thats 1000 dollars. I went to a funeral where a 16 year old kid shot a friend for 15 dollars and some change.dont start spouting the upstanding morals of the southwest. I live it.

reply

[deleted]

Agreed! terrible story, terrible acting. Love the actors in it though. huge disappointment

Is it just me, or does this rape room have the same floor plan as our kitchen?

reply

Crowe may look good in a skirt but he's a pathetic little brat and a wretched actor. at least Glenn Ford had some sense of subtlety.

reply

[deleted]

Lawmen of the old west were tough, they certainly wouldnt back down to criminals because they were outnumbered 7 to 5. Just ridiculous and insulting.
Also there was no need to take him to the train, just kill him, the movie was silly.
And the idea that the twonsfolk were so corrupt and stupid they'd murder the town's lawmwen and face the consequences for $200 is clearly absurd.

But then the movie was silly. I don't think it was really taking itself too seriously.

I had been expecting a serious Unforgiven type western but it was a bit comic book - not what I think you'd call a serious western.

reply

Yes, if all movies pertained to your logic, then they would be short films without a plot, and character development. Idiot, go back to your cave. I'm sure there were corrupt lawmen in the time, the FBI was up and coming, so where do you think he got all that money from? Washington.

reply

[deleted]

the FBI was up and coming




"All right then! Nobody told you to stop working!"

reply

I thought the dumbest thing about that whole scene was that the lawmen thought they could give themselves up and live. They all knew what cold blooded killers the gang was and they honestly thought we can just walk outside and they'll let us leave. They would have chanced it against the town and gang and if they were going to die take out as many as they could. Having the high ground and being inside would have favored them immensly. And yes also, Christian Bale in real life would have stuck his shotgun out the window and blown a few of the gang away with one shot. The gang couldn't have filled the hotel full of holes considering they may kill Russell Crowe accidently. Of course, like many have already said this film was a fantasy and wasn't suppose to take itself seriously. When you ask someone outside, "how do I know someone isn't holding a gun on you?" and the response is sliding your badge under the door which totally reassures the person inside that everything is safe you have to laugh yourself silly.

reply

Unless you somehow found a way to time travel (or this info was passed down from generation to generation), then i don't think you have a right to call this movie "insulting" or unrealistic. You seem to be forgeting that Hollywood likes to over exaggerate things. They're very good at making up fictional things and having the audience eat it up like it was white rice. Nobody likes to see the truth or "scared characters" on tv, but guess what? people aren't always tough. Everyone wishes they were tough, but aren't always, and it's a bitter pill for them to swallow and accept. You're human, you're allowed to be "scared" and not always "tough". If someone wants to laugh at you for that, then that's their problem..

"Behind every great Woman, there's a Man hating " - Anonymous

reply

[deleted]

I have a question for you: Why are you still trolling these boards if you hate the movie so much?

"Behind every great Woman, there's a Man hating " - Anonymous

reply

[deleted]

Dude what the hell is wrong with you, its just a movie and it came out like 3 years ago, get over it. It advertised itself as an action movie in the first place. I don't understand how you could possibly be so upset about this, it is pretty hilarious though.

"What about special occassions? Do you just *beep* hit her in the head with a baseball bat?"

reply

[deleted]

mgtbltp=wannabe cop, or cop who pissed himself first day on the job and still gets *beep* for it. Let the poor guy get his anger out here.

If you kill that man you die next. Repeat, if you kill that man you die next.

reply

[deleted]

Hey, mgtbltp, change your *beep* tampon and get over it. You've said "live with it," twice now, and yet you seem unable to heed your own advice. Bitching and moaning on IMDB isn't going to magically change a movie that came out three years ago.

Burn the heretic
Kill the mutant
Purge the unclean

reply

[deleted]

mgtbltp - I liked this movie. Sit on that, because I'm not coming back to this topic. I just want you to know that somewhere, out there, I am liking this movie. Forever.

reply

[deleted]

I agree with mgtbltp that this film isn't so good compared with the great Westerns that have been made and even the original 1957 film or even that it seems to stretch logic at points. It just irritates me that he and others resort to insulting others, calling them morons and so on because they liked it or disagree.

reply

Lol, mgtbltp really, really, really, really... really, really likes westerns.

"By the time i turned all my clocks back, my ass had turned to jello!" - TourettesGuy

reply

[deleted]

Yup, you sure love westerns.

"By the time i turned all my clocks back, my ass had turned to jello!" - TourettesGuy

reply

Yes, this movie is insulting to the common sense of the Western Lawman. But it's also insulting to the intelligence of the audience (well, most of them).

It's not just idiotic that the sheriff and his men easily give in to the demands of the bad guys and are then gunned down anyway, making the lawmen the dumbest human beings on earth, and showing the hero that he CAN'T surrender to the outlaws when convincing him to surrender was repeatedly the goal of the outlaws. But after the townspeople witness this useless massacre, how in the hell can any of them be stupid enough to think they'll actually ever see the $200 from these outlaws? The outlaws have just proved in front of all of them that they are totally untrustworthy. What are the townspeople going to do if the outlaws don't pay them? Take their claims to court? Demand that the sheriff arrest them for breach of contract? Oh, wait...

reply

The problem is is that you're attempting to instill logic onto the movie's plot which is utterly futile.

I couldn't count the sheer number of times in which it was patently clear that this movie either fails as a western, is completely illogical or is entirely inconsistent.

Literally, from sudden personality changes to numerous times in which the antagonist could have murdered the entire group of lawmen to the fact that our protagonist is the worst thing that has happened to the western franchise in a long time.

Seriously. Everything about this movie aside from the acting is just terrible.

"And so it begins..."

reply

[deleted]

I don't know why everyone on here is trying to sway mgtbltp from his opinion. He's got his ideas of what he believes a western law man was like in those days and he's gonna stick to them. Hell, he probably got dumped by his sister/cousin recently and is taking his anger out on imdb.

I believe in Steve Austin and his plan to put a casino on the moon

reply

[deleted]

To mgtbltp: I'm curious what you thought of Brokeback Mountain?

reply

[deleted]

The odds were THE WHOLE TOWN to 5.

reply

$200 back then probably worth $2,000,000 in 2013.

reply

Everything about this movie aside from the acting is just terrible.
agreed

reply

I doubt the western lawmen of yore are insulted. They have been dead for ages!

Its that man again!!

reply