MovieChat Forums > The Pacific (2010) Discussion > Landing Craft on Peleliu

Landing Craft on Peleliu

posted 11 years ago by rjd1-1
16 replies | jump to latest

I was just watching the episode dealing with the landing at Peleliu, and something surprised me: the landing craft that required the guys to jump over the side. I'm used to the ones used in Europe, where the front comes down, and the soldiers disembark that way, versus the ones from this episode where guys jump over the sides. I'm sure this wasn't an error, so do you think this is one more example of not having the same equipment used in Europe? Really seemed like a dangerous way to land troops.....

[–] nickm2 11 years ago

I might be wrong but I think it's because the ramp is at the front of the vehicle. If the 'front door' is directly into the line of enemy fire then I think more than a few will go 'over the side' to reduce their exposure to enemy gunfire.

Why can't you wretched prey creatures understand that the Universe doesn't owe you anything!?

[–] rjd1-1 11 years ago

That makes sense. Look what happened in Private Ryan during the landings. The door would open, exposing all those men to machine gun fire....with nowhere to go.

[–] nickm2 11 years ago

I always wondered why the 'AmTrack" was never made with the ramp in the rear...

Why can't you wretched prey creatures understand that the Universe doesn't owe you anything!?

[–] rjd1-1 11 years ago

Especially considering most of the passengers are probably armed!

[–] rjd1-1 11 years ago

Especially considering most of the passengers are probably armed!

[–] nickm2 11 years ago

I am guessing it had something to do with the placement of the engine & the craft's 'pilot'-they had to be less vulnerable to enemy fire even if the 'cargo' got 'scuppered'.

Why can't you wretched prey creatures understand that the Universe doesn't owe you anything!?

[–] dubyahsrobotminion 11 years ago

AmTracks are armored, not like a tank, but its enough to seriously way it down so it sits very low when transiting the water. The LVT-4 did include an Aft Debark Ramp. Many Marines still went over the gunnels(sides) though. Many debarks happened while still in the surf because lowering the ramp might swamp the vehicle.

You're taking a dump and they call GQ do you pinch it off or finish your business?

[–] davidwile 11 years ago

Hey folks,

The landing craft you mostly saw in Band of Brothers were called Higgins Boats; they were not the same type of landing craft as described by dubyahsrobotminion in the previous post.

The Marine landing craft was a tracked vehicle which could travel overland. It had a drop ramp in the rear - not in the front. Marines could go over the sides while still in the water as noted previously, or they could exit the rear ramp if the landing craft was actually on land.

Higgins boats, which were largely used on D-Day, were completely different in design. They were actually engine driven boats made mostly of plywood, and they had a steel ramp in the front from which the troops could enter and depart. A Higgins boat was designed to slide up on the beach, drop the ramp, and when the troops had gone out, the front of the boat would be lighter and enable it to slip back into the water and make its way back to its mother ship for the next load of troops to be landed.

I am not sure about this, but I think the Higgins boat and the Marine landing craft seen in these films were designed to carry one platoon or about 30 men to a landing site.

Best wishes,
Dave Wile

[–] Clintessence 11 years ago

Hey Dave,

I was talking with my Father-In-Law a week ago about this very subject. He was in the Navy, and his job was to drive a Higgins Boat. He was at Okinawa, so yes, they used Higgins Boats in the Pacific.

After watching the entire series of "The Pacific", I bought Robert Leckie's book and also "Sledgehammer's" book, "With The Old Breed", which was probably the best book on war I've ever read.

Best Wishes,
Clintessence

[–] davidwile 11 years ago

Hey Clint,

Maybe I am way wrong on this, but I suspect the Higgins boats were a good bit less expensive to build than the landing craft which were shown being used by the Marines. The Marine landing craft shown were amphibious units which were tracked vehicles requiring bigger and more complicated transmissions than Higgins boats, and I think the hulls were all steel. With the Higgins boats being made largely of plywood and being boats rather than amphibious units, I would think they would be a lot less expensive to make.

Not too many years ago, I saw a documentary show on the development of Higgins boats, and it was very interesting. I wish I could remember where I saw it. I know when I worked for the Marines, they still used amphibious landing craft which to my untrained eyes seemed similar to the ones seen in The Pacific. Back in the 1970s, when you crossed the Potomac River on the Woodrow Wilson Bridge, on the Virginia side of the river just north of the bridge, you could see a whole bunch of what appeared to be Higgins boats stored on the river. I have not seen them there for many years now. Being made of plywood, I would think they would deteriorate rather quickly and require a lot of expensive maintenance.

Best wishes,
Dave Wile

[–] Clintessence 11 years ago

Hey Dave,

My father-in-law served on the USS Noble. If you "google" it, you can plainly see the boats slung on the sides of the ship. These were different than the Landing craft shown in the "Pacific", and as can be seen in the photos, there is a different delivery system. The Higgins boats in the photos of the Noble, are lowered from the sides of the ships by "arms".

Best Wishes,
Clintessence

[–] myturn21 11 years ago

The Amtrac was the one with the ramp in the rear. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amtrac

The Higgins had the ramp in the front: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Higgins_boat

The one that Leckie & his comrades ride in when they deploy to Guadacanal is the Higgins. Leckie later lands on Peleliu, same wave as Sledge but later & we see Leckie firing the Browning M1919 before he jumps down to the beach.

Christ, can you imagine how insane that landing must've been?

Also, if you watch the landing in Saving Pvt Ryan you'll hear Miller yell for his troops to go over the side when the bow of their Higgins is sprayed with MG42 fire.

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ARRET! C'est ici l'empire de la mort!

[–] andy610 11 years ago

Sledge explains that they had to use amtrac's on Peleliu because of the coral reefs extending around the island. Amtrac's could ride over them, while other landing craft would get stuck.

Amtrac's generally had a rear gate that dropped, however at least in Sledge's case they used an older model that didn't have a gate, thus they were forced to go over the side.

[–] rjd1-1 11 years ago

Thanks. That was interesting.

[–] Prof68 10 years ago

Originally the Amtrac or LVT didn't have the capability to offload troops or equipment except, literally, over the side. Subsequent models had a rear ramp installed to make offloading much faster. Also initial models were lightly armored but received upgrades to the armor and powertrains including the addition of turrets from old Stuart tanks for added firepower.

[–] gubaaan-662-230607 10 years ago

He said in the book, they had a mix of older ones and newer. Unfortunately, only the newer ones had the drop down ramp.