MovieChat Forums > The Apprentice (2004) Discussion > Please do not vote for the Donald

Please do not vote for the Donald


If you have watched this show you know that Trump has no patience for things that don't go his way nor for people who are weak or don't have money. This country has a responsibility to everyone, not just to the citizens who make millions every year.
Please do not elect a man that hates everyone. He only tolerates people who can make him money. How is that a good presidential candidate? This country has not recovered from the last financial collapse at the hands of greedy New Yorkers. Why would we want a greedy New Yorker as president?!?!

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If donald is indeed only this description how the hell is he different than any other politician we have elected? Do you know anything about the bushes or the clintons? Obama was horrible. Any person in that job is going to be a sell out. People should care more about their mayors, governors and congress people anyways. President is just one person with limited power and limited accountability. I guess people wish for a king after all, they can't handle the complexity of democracy.

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On the one hand, you say Obama has been horrible (eventhough Obama has decreased unemployment and the uninsured dramatically since Bush and has reduced the trade deficit with China) and, on the other hand, you say the president is an unimportant figurehead. You can't have it both ways.

I can understand you wishing that Trump could be the President if it was just a figure head meant to entertain you, but the President's responsibilities include appointing some of our greatest leadership positions and signing into law bills from congress. That is not an insignificant position. It is also one in which the Donald doesn't understand nor does he have the necessary skill.

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The man has no self control. He reacts without thinking. The fact that this man could not refrain from Rubio's comment about his 'part' just proves it. As President you have to let things like that go. He has proven he can not back down from any agrument. He calls Rosei O'Donnell a fat pig, Marco Rubio a little man, etc. He has a nasty name for every one. I hate to see him get into it with other world leaders. I feel this man is a danger to the safety of this planet.


...............ZING!

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That is the most sober comment that I have, to this date, read on the I internet in reference to Trump's Presidential campaign 2016.

In light of the fact that what you have said about him is true, the entire campaign and response to it seems to me to be the biggest social experiment done in history.

The voters dream of an outsider coming in and running the Presidency like a perfect elected official, making every person's dreams come true. If what I would want are to be true if Trump won the Presidency, then the result would be that the world is perfect in four years and our economy stable and growing. I don't see Trump having any qualities about himself to make that happen.

Could Trump be a secret genius who, in-spite of his obvious inability to express one straightforward, socially appropriate, emotionally neutral comment, he could actually be capable of leading the largest, most important government in the entire world for four years? It doesn't seem to me that Trump would be able to handle a consistent, daily level of serious and personal restraint as needed to deal with people in military positions or with those who have a background in government and military. These things matter. He will no longer be a member of the general public, staging grand media moments. Serious people wouldn't behave like he does. It is obvious he is a joker. A real power hungry egomaniac with a lot of fans who, like many people, look at his net worth as some kind of personality trait. Having tons of money does not mean you are smart or good. It just means you are really greedy.

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I've watched this show many times. Not sure where you get Trump has no patience. This sounds like something a leftist would say.

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#trump2016

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I dont watch the show--I remember seeing Trump in the 80s--didnt think much of him. However--his campaign is interesting--although he is kind of obnoxious, he says things that no other candidate would say: i.e. the candidates are beholden to the corporate donors and special interests. Or, invading Iraq was based on a lie and Bush knew it was a lie.

Compared to Clinton and the other D/R candidates-he is the progressive. That includes Sanders.

Clinton might well lead the US into a war with China or Russia but I doubt Trump would.
The media is literally attacking him left and right--he has to be saying things the corporate bosses dont like. It's fun to watch him insult Bush and Clinton and others.


"Cruz..the oil companies control him and others. You look at Jeb Bush...Poor Jeb I mean here's a guy who spent over a hundred something million dollars already and he's almost last. He doesn't want to use the Bush name-he's ashamed of the Bush name...Then Jeb brings out his mother and I say to him Jeb--your mother cant help you with ISIS, she cant help you with China...she cant help you with these people Jeb-you got to do it yourself...He spent over a hundred million and he's nowhere. I think he's disgraced himself to be honest with you. All these people Jeb, Hillary-they are all controlled by the people giving them money."

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I already voted for Trump. He won in my state by a large margin.
I haven't voted for many years and he was the person that made it worth standing on line for. Trump is the most kindest and honest of all the candidates running. The message that Trump hates everyone is untrue no matter how many times you read it to yourself.

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The reason why you have been taken in by this real estate salesman is because you are new to politics. The fact that you (and many others) are choosing Trump and believing that his campaign is something "new" and you feel excited by it is simply because you have not studied political history.
Further, the title of the "kindest" candidate clearly goes to Bernie Sanders. (Bernie doesn't say awful things about women and disabled people who don't bow down before him, and Trump, frankly, is the king of mean. Lol. There is no debate on that.) But, that doesn't necessarily make Bernie the best person for the job. The most honest? I have no idea how you come to that conclusion considering that Trump has been proven to be lying time and again in his speeches. From racist "statistics" that he made up early in his campaign, to claiming he "knows terrible things" about other candidates and their wives- ones he has never met, that is just dishonest. Also, he claims that he is going to make mexico pay for the wall, that he alone can solve the ISIS problem, those are lies.
Trump is the least qualified. He is nothing new. Our political history is full of fancy political nut jobs who say outrageous things. And your support for the nut job is nothing new. Surprising candidacies just don't end up being a big part of history. Failed presidencies do. And Trump is doomed to fail if he gets in the White House.
Here he is lying and convincing others to lure yo you, his audience: http://thinkprogress.org/default/2016/04/03/3766021/watch-donald-trump-convince-foxs-chris-wallace-to-lie-in-the-middle-of-an-interview/

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If you have watched this show you know that Trump has no patience for things that don't go his way nor for people who are weak or don't have money.~tereseatbiocybernaut~


I watched every single episode of every single season of 'The Apprentice' and never got the impression that Donald Trump had no patience for things that didn't go his way. What gave you that impression about Trump after watching 'The Apprentice'?


He only tolerates people who can make him money.


'Celebrity Apprentice' has raised millions of dollars after 7 seasons for a variety of charities that the public wasn't even aware of until the show.

And, once again, how did you get the impression that Trump only tolerates people who can make him money?

Please do not elect a man that hates everyone.


Why do you believe that Donald Trump hates everyone?


This country has a responsibility to everyone, not just to the citizens who make millions every year.


What do you mean that this country has a responsibly to everyone? Do you mean that the United States has a responsibility to everyone in the world, or just its own citizens?

And, why do you think this country has a responsibility to everyone? While the American citizens have a right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness as long as it doesn't harm or interfere with others. All, the US government is responsible for is to uphold the Constitution, Bill of Rights and to keep the citizens safe. That's the only thing that the American government is suppose to do.

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You really idolize that fool, don't you? He is a pathetic, disgusting man who has never worked in public service or shown any inkling of civic duty throughout his entire life. He is not a self made man.
And he knows nothing about the spirit of the American Dream.
He is also a very divisive person who alienates those who do not agree with him. That is a terrible trait to have as a president.

Being a fan of the show does not mean he would make a good president. I feel sorry for you, who has watched every single episode and has obviously become a big fan.
To be an informed voter, you need to read more than just the trending articles. Go to each candidate's website and read about their policy views. Supplement that research with your own research about the history of our economy and quality of life as it relates to presidential terms of office.
These are the things that will give you good reasons to vote for someone. Being a fan of an obnoxious reality show is not helping you make a same, rational, informed decision. Nor can following the trending news articles inform you.
Good luck @brnlsr

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Sorry, you didn't answer a single question that I asked you. All you did was respond with more baseless personal opinions and ad hominem attacks, without even the slightest attempt at making a reasonable argument to support your personal opinions about Trump.

You feel sorry for me? Dude, we have never met. I have no idea who you are, nor do I want to know. So, why would I care what you think of me? You're just a bunch of words on a screen, nothing more.

He is also a very divisive person who alienates those who do not agree with him.


Again, can you explain why you believe that Trump is "a very divisive person who alienates those who do not agree with him". Why do you believe that? Are you at all capable of formulating a reasonable argument to back-up your personal opinion? I'm starting to believe that you're absolutely incapable of doing that.

If you can make an actual argument based upon reason and evidence to explain why you believe Trump is all these horrible thing that you claim that he is? Then you will have a lot more success at convincing others why they shouldn't vote for Trump. But, all you're doing is tossing around a lot of insults with no reasoning or evidence to back them up with.

To be an informed voter, you need to read more than just the trending articles. Go to each candidate's website and read about their policy views. Supplement that research with your own research about the history of our economy and quality of life as it relates to presidential terms of office.


LOL.... okay, thanks for the advice, I'll keep that in mind. But, for your information, my support for Trump to be the next president has nothing to do with his TV show.

I also have a degree in Political Science and have been a contributing writer to several different political websites over the years, along with personally participating in several political protests across the country while actively supporting several state and federal candidates. So, how does that fit into your false personal belief that all Trump supporters are these uninformed voters who are "new" to politics?

I've also watched most of the presidential republican and democratic debates, visited the candidates websites and have done more political research in the past 6-months than I'm sure most of the general public will do in a life time.

I've also already taken my very informed butt to a local voting center earlier this year and casts my vote for Donald Trump in the primary election, and plan to vote for Trump again in the general election too.

So, good Luck commie socialist Bernie supporter. You're going to need it.

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Sad that you think asking me questions is how to use your self-professed education to debate Trump's worthiness. Next time you disagree with someone's statements and you call their opinion baseless you should back it up with information that contradicts the statements. If you have all the information about this election and specifically, if you are truly informed about the candidate you support, why not provide the evidence that refutes the statements you disagree with? That is what educated and informed people do. It really doesn't matter what degree you paid for if you can't do any of your own thinking. I doubt a political "science" major can do more than the average uneducated individual. From your responses, I don't see any evidence of your "higher" education. Same exact response any internet troll can give.
Here is your responses in a nutshell:
"Don't say that!" ... "Prove it!" ..."I'm smarter than you!"
Lol. You are ridiculous.

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Sad that you think asking me questions is how to use your self-professed education to debate Trump's worthiness.


All I did was politely ask you to explain "WHY" anyone should take your personal opinions that you posted about Trump seriously. And, if you have any actual evidence that you can cite or point to, that support your personal opinions about Trump.

However, all you responded with instead, were a few more disparaging remarks about Trump, that you never attempted to qualify with any evidence. Along with a bunch of ad hominem attacks and baseless personal assumptions about me, whom you've never met.


Next time you disagree with someone's statements and you call their opinion baseless you should back it up with information that contradicts the statements.


For your information, it's not the responsibility of everyone else in the world to disprove every single baseless irrational statement that people routinely make on a daily bases. It's up to the person making the statement to prove their claims are True, by constructing objective rational arguments based upon actual evidence.

For Example: If someone claims that pigs can fly and Unicorns are real? The burden of proof is immediately placed upon the person making the claim that, pigs can fly and Unicorns are real. Otherwise it's just a ridiculous statement made by what could be an absolute complete loon. And, there is no point in attempting to have a rational discussion with a complete loony who can't be reasoned with.

So, when you post comments like "Please do not elect a man that hates everyone.". You definitely need to provide at least something in the way of proof or evidence, to explain why you believe that Trump hates "EVERYONE", before your outrageous statement can even begin to be debated.


Here is your responses in a nutshell:
"Don't say that!" ... "Prove it!" ..."I'm smarter than you!"


First of all: I never tell anyone what they shouldn't say. So, I know that I never said to you "Don't say that!". Therefore, your claim is either a bold face lie or, it was something you heard from the voices in your own head.

Secondly: YES, I did say "Prove it!", because it's actually important in this world to back-up your own opinions, claims and statements with actual PROOF.(see above)

Thirdly: Here's why I know that I'm smarter than you are, and it has nothing to do with a college degree. It's because, I understand the basic principle of how to formulate rational objective arguments, based upon empirical evidence, as a means to persuade the opinions of others. Which you don't even seem to have the slightest clue about.

And, at this point.... I seriously doubt that you have the ability to construct a rational argument, even if you understood why it's important that people are able to do that. Which makes YOU, a very sad commentary on the awful current state of our public educational system, and another reason why I'm voting for Trump.

To make America's educational system Great Again! Trump 2016

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Trump has no policy on education. The democrats have policy on education. Both Clinton and Sanders have made education a primary focus of their campaign. Trump has not. If you need proof that he has not, simply read the newspaper and you will see that while education continually is a topic in the democratic candidates' speeches, it never has made the headlines as part of Trump's campaign focus.

The reason why you have not provided any proof contradicting my statements is not your fault and I apologize for implying that your Political Science major and six months worth of study has left you lacking. I'm sure you are the expert you claim to be and the only reason you haven't demonstrated that is due to the fact that it is impossible to contradict my statements.
The bottom line is that you really can't contradict my statements because Trump's entire platform is based on fear and anger. You are a perfect example of the efficacy of an emotionally charged, negative campaign that inspires anger and lacks solid principles. Your enthusiastic support of Trump is entirely reactionary and lacks any particular moral or ethical drive.

Campaign policies matter to me. Yet, to you it is all about negativity and being riled up against your opponents, "choosing sides" so to speak. While I made a statement about a Trump, you make personal attacks on me. All of your assumptions are wrong by the way. Even your assumptions about my education. But, that really does not matter. If Trump had any policies that are not based on fear, hate and anger you would have been able to provide details that would clearly disprove my statements.

For example, if I had said anything like that about either Democratic candidate, it would be very easy to contradict me. You'd have your choice of a handful of policies which focus on bolstering the working middle class with healthcare, education, and loan repayment programs aimed at stabilizing the forces which have been eating away at the pay checks of working class families. You would also have been able to note statements from both democratic candidates that are talking about bringing people together, bridging the divide between left and right, between opposing political views, for the purpose of fixing our fragile economy. And, the most powerful argument of all, you would have been able to point to both Democratic candidate's desire to further human rights, protect the liberties of United States citizens, and further the cause for justice and equality for individuals and communities experiencing discrimination.

You just can't do any of that with Trump: not for lack of an education, not because it is "not your responsibility", and not because of anything I have failed to do. The simple reason is because he is the exact opposite of inclusivity, of supporting freedom and equality, and of having the desire to be a leader for all Americans to believe in and for the rest of the world to admire. He simply does not fit the bill. He is divisive, has made a point to threaten litigation against his opponents and the media, has continuously put forth demeaning remarks towards defenseless people, and stirs anger and fear as a way of mustering votes.

Your reactionary voting motives are anything but sincere.
Personally, I believe America is great and that we should build on our greatness. I don't want to, nor do I believe it is possible, to regress to some arbitrary time period that Trump remembers as being "great". His policy to tax imports at a much higher rate would further gouge the paychecks of the working class and would still do nothing to bring jobs back. It simply means you and I will pay more for cheap goods (economists suggest each household would pay between $1,000-2000 a year on import taxes with the added burden of wage decrease since domestic products require imports of raw materials and other components so competing with imports would be that much more difficult). High import taxes are used by small failing countries and there is no evidence to suggest it will bring jobs to the U.S. Further, deporting poor people won't help the economy because we already deport illegals and it costs more money to do that than they are worth. By definition poor people don't have any money, so how does deporting them get us money? Illegals don't have a social security number, and as such are not eligible for any government benefits. If you decide to round them up and deport them suddenly you are spending millions of tax dollars on people who otherwise were existing without any tax money. They live off of jobs that no one else does. They are largely not even a part of our economy until they get deported, whereby we feed and house them in jail until the courts order them to be deported and then they get a free airplane ride back to their country. If you want money for the middle class, you need to look at how to generate value. The deportation of illegals does not generate any revenue. How can you end up with a better economy by spending more money deporting them than they are worth in the first place? The more you deport the more tax money you spend, the less you have for real programs that actually help American citizens.

The United States does not exist in a vacuum. We rely on cheap imports to fuel our economy. We export innovative technology and telecommunication systems, infrastructure management, investment opportunity, and high end manufactured goods. You can't expect to start making cheap plastic toys here and other goods based on large scale environmental destruction. We won't allow child labor. We won't allow the pollution of our communities, and we don't have large, untapped resources to exploit. Trump plays on simple ideas that appeal to the lowest common denominator, meanwhile our economy is more complicated and the things which are hurting the middle class are going unaddressed by his unproven, undeliverable ideas.
The democratic candidates are on the right track to keep America great.

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Trump has no policy on education.


Here are a few links describing Trump's policy on education

http://www.ontheissues.org/Donald_Trump.htm

http://www.ontheissues.org/2016/Donald_Trump_Education.htm

http://thinkprogress.org/education/2015/08/17/3691685/trump-university/

http://edexcellence.net/articles/donald-trump-quotes-about-education

It took me literally under a minute to find several links describing Trump's policy on education. Why couldn't you?

Then, after claiming that Trump has no policy on education (which clearly he does) you once again go off with a bunch of inaccurate, self-righteous, personal opinions without providing any facts to support even one of your many statements.(as usual)

Which I'm not even going to pretend qualifies as an actual argument that is deserving of a response. However, I will address one statement you made about immigration, to illustrate just how wrong your uninformed self-righteous opinions are.

Illegals don't have a social security number, and as such are not eligible for any government benefits.


Really? Then what do you make of the 2015 "USA Today" report that 51% of the illegal immigrants currently in America are on public assistants?
(Source:http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2015/09/01/immigrant-welfare-use-report/71517072/)

Also, the 'Federation for American Immigration Reform' has estimated that the cost of annual government benefits for illegal immigrants is $113 Billion a year.

Education for the children of illegal aliens constitutes the single largest cost to taxpayers, at an annual price tag of nearly $52 billion. Nearly all of those costs are absorbed by state and local governments.

With many state budgets in deficit, policymakers have an obligation to look for ways to reduce the fiscal burden of illegal migration. California, facing a budget deficit of $14.4 billion in 2010-2011, is hit with an estimated $21.8 billion in annual expenditures on illegal aliens. New York’s $6.8 billion deficit is smaller than its $9.5 billion in yearly illegal alien costs.
(Source:http://www.fairus.org/publications/the-fiscal-burden-of-illegal-immigration-on-united-states-taxpayers)

And, putting aside for the moment that a lot of illegal immigrants who have been deported several times have later re-entered the country and committed violent crimes, like murder and rape of American citizens....

The most common way that 51% of illegal immigrants are receiving an estimated $113 Billion annually in government tax payer funded benefits (despite not having a legal social security number) is to obtain an illegal social security number.(DUH!)

According to the Center for Immigration Studies 2015 report: Illegal immigrants are not “undocumented.” They have fraudulent documents such as counterfeit Social Security cards, forged drivers licenses, fake “green cards,” and phony birth certificates. Experts suggest that approximately 75 percent of working-age illegal aliens use fraudulent Social Security cards to obtain employment.(http://cis.org/IdentityTheft)

Most (98 percent) Social Security number (SSN) thieves use their own names with stolen numbers.(http://cis.org/IdentityTheft)

Children are prime targets. In Arizona, it is estimated that over one million children are victims of identity theft. In Utah, 1,626 companies were found to be paying wages to the SSNs of children on public assistance under the age of 13. These individuals suffer very real and very serious consequences in their lives.(http://cis.org/IdentityTheft)

Source:
Center for Immigration Studies
http://cis.org/Welfare-Use-Legal-Illegal-Immigrant-Households
http://cis.org/IdentityTheft

Now, did you see what I have done here? I first stated a position like "Illegals immigrants are receiving Billions in government benefits", then I backed that statement up with links to actual facts and data collected by studies to support my position on immigration.

Okay, I didn't just spout off a bunch on self-righteous personal opinions and expect everyone to just accept them as Facts. I actually presented facts to support my positions. Do you understand the difference?


All of your assumptions are wrong by the way. Even your assumptions about my education


If I'm wrong about you being educated by the horrible public school system, but you still don't know how to construct a reasoned argument based upon empirical evidence, or even understand why it's important? Then you should sue what ever privately funded institute of learning you attended for financial restitution. Because you obviously Got ROBBED!

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Lol. Let's look at these policies...

TRUMP: We're going to be cutting tremendous amounts of money and waste and fraud and abuse. But, no, I'm not cutting services, but I am cutting spending.ÿBut I may cut Department of Education-- Common Core is a very bad thing. I think that it should be local education. If you look at a Jeb Bush and some of these others, they want children to be educated by Washington, D.C. bureaucrats.

TRUMP:
Competition is why I'm very much in favor of school choice. Let schools compete for kids. I guarantee that if you forced schools to get better or close because parents didn't want to enroll their kids there, they would get better. Those schools that weren't good enough to attract students would close, and that's a good thing.
For two decades I've been urging politicians to open the schoolhouse doors and let parents decide which schools are best for their children. Professional educators look to claim that doing so would be the end of good public schools. Better charter or magnet schools would drain the top kids out of that system, or hurt the morale of those left behind. Suddenly, the excellence that comes from competition is being criticized.

So, he wants the schools to do more with less... That's not new. That is the same policies that republicans have been using 4ever.

This is new: kids should compete to get into the best public schools. Now, what does this mean exactly? How are the poor kids from bad schools going to get the opportunity to learn anything? They don't. Pretty clear about that.
...such an inclusive man though. He sure is ready to help everyone in the US. Oh, and what has he based his opinions on? What works in the sleazy real estate market is how he wants everything in the US to be run. Let the special needs kids get left in a terrible school. That's fine with you, Mr. I Have a Private Education and Superior For It.

I read that stuff. I could go on. But it's so pathetically disgusting.
I still think Trump hates people...just like you. You are exactly who should vote for him. You obviously have a lot of spare time and no real world experience.

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http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/e3b0475219/your-drunk-neighbor-donald-trump?_cc=__t___&_ccid=51e8c012bae39635

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/cody-cain/how-fox-news-destroyed-republican-party_b_9644594.html?
"Propaganda is powerful stuff"

Lol, if anyone else happens to read this, note: a collection of disparaging remarks about education is not a policy. And, educating the children of illegals is not the "largest cost to taxpayers". In fact, nothing that @bartender says is true. He claims to have a fancy degree and private education- his claim as to why he is better than others- but, yet, just remember, he is probably drunk. Don't be a hateful person like Trump and his faithful follower the bartender, like Hitler and the Germans who blamed the Jews for all their problems. Remember: War costs our economy more than peace. A collection of quotes and criticisms from Trump while he sits in his office reading the newspaper is not a viable, educated basis of running a our country... unless you want to run it in the ground. Just ask yourself, when exactly was our country great according to a Trump? And, now that we have the internet and our lives are very different than they were just 15 years ago, do you think it is possible to turn back the wheels of time? Do you want to? Or do you want to look to the future and build on what we have that is great? The past is only perfect to those who remember it that way. The future is perfect for those with the vision to embrace it. Blaming illegals for all your problems is not going to help you get a better job unless you aspire to work in the fields picking fruit for less than minimum wage.

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brtndr, none of the links you mentioned provide concrete guides to Trump’s education plans. His website is arguably more informative (https://www.donaldjtrump.com/policies/education), but it still pales in comparison to the information and details Clinton provided on her website (https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/early-childhood-education/, https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/k-12-education/, https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/college/).

The OP is not the only one to criticize Trump for his flimsy stance on education. A recent article in USA Today is similarly critical of his vague position on school choice: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2016/11/18/trumps-school-choice-proposal-mandate-never-talked/94063318/

I am not trying to advocate Clinton’s proposals per se, but she was arguably more persuasive when she referred to her past commitment to reforming education as a senator, first lady, etc. Trump, on the other hand, just agreed to a $25 million settlement in a lawsuit filed against Trump University, which has been justifiably maligned in the press.

Also, the USA Today article you linked above claimed 51% of immigrants are on welfare, not 51% of illegal immigrants. Even if you were to use it to justify some stance against immigration in general, which was not your original purpose, the headline seems more damning than the actual article, in which Linda Chavez points out that second-generation immigrants tend to fare better and a large portion of native-born households are on welfare, too.

As for your other data, I question the reliability of statistics from Center for Immigration Studies and the Federation of American Immigration Reform, both of which have explicit agendas regarding immigration that would potentially compromise their objectivity. I am not the first to question their integrity (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/05/15/inside-the-center-for-immigration-studies-the-immigration-false-fact-think-tank.html), but if you think The Daily Beast is a poor source of reliable information, consider how information is presented at the CIS.org home page. Most sites attempting to present some modicum of objectivity do not have a stance or slogan like “Low-immigration, Pro-immigrant” or use the data gathered to support partisan plans in such a provocative, hyperbolic fashion (e.g., introducing an article with the headline “Trump’s Plan to Deport Criminal Aliens will address the most disastrous failings of the Obama administration’s faux-enforcement regime”).

It’s fascinating when you consider the different ways data from ICE and DHS have been interpreted by the Pew Research Center, The Migration Policy Institute, and the Center of Immigration Studies. Like CIS, I think you are drawing conclusions from a selective interpretation of the data. You claim that FAIR “has estimated that the cost of annual government benefits for illegal immigrants is $113 Billion a year.” The source you provided actually claims the following: “Illegal immigration costs U.S. taxpayers about $113 billion a year at the federal, state and local level. The bulk of the costs — some $84 billion — are absorbed by state and local governments.” Politifact had a bit to say about this statistic when Donald Trump gave the $113 billion figure in one of his speeches (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2016/sep/01/donald-trump/donald-trump-says-illegal-immigration-costs-113-bi/). Regardless, neither Trump nor FAIR is claiming illegal immigrants are receiving $113 billion in Medicaid and other welfare benefits. FAIR estimates that fraudulent use of Medicaid by illegal aliens amounts to a net loss of about $2.5 billion but acknowledges that “only anecdotal information is available about the amount of Medicaid usage by illegal aliens who use stolen identities.”

The articles about identity theft are only peripherally related because they mainly focus on the burdens identity theft imposes on its victims. In other words, you are inaccurately representing unrelated statistics from different sources and combining them to make a false claim: “The most common way that 51% of illegal immigrants are receiving an estimated $113 Billion annually in government tax payer funded benefits (despite not having a legal social security number) is to obtain an illegal social security number.(DUH!)”

Are you supposed to be showing the OP how to construct “a reasoned argument based on empirical evidence”? If so, you’ve failed miserably. Immigration is incredibly complicated. It is both misleading and counterproductive to ignore the struggles both Democrats and Republicans have faced while working to reform immigration, and there are quite a few reports available that explain the nuances campaign speeches, slogans, and tweets miss, including but not limited to the following examples:

http://www.migrationpolicy.org/research/understanding-potential-impact-executive-action-immigration-enforcement
http://www.migrationpolicy.org/news/unauthorized-immigrants-criminal-convictions-who-might-be-priority-removal
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/09/21/unauthorized-immigrant-population-stable-for-half-a-decade/
http://www.pewhispanic.org/2015/09/28/modern-immigration-wave-brings-59-million-to-u-s-driving-population-growth-and-change-through-2065/

More important, both parties have different priorities that are worth considering. None of this has anything to do with Trump, a wealthy businessman/reality TV star/president-elect who wooed voters using the same ridiculous antics that attracted Apprentice viewers. Some would argue his approach does not exactly promote reasoned, rational discourse on the issues. Personally, I think the entire election was a farce.

Finally, while I would agree that it's a good idea to support one's conclusions with examples, I would not assume someone's reasons for not supporting a candidate are unfounded simply because the person assumes his or her conclusions are obvious and can't be bothered to provide supporting examples or sources in a casual forum like this. For example, I will assume you have legitimate reasons for dismissing the entire public school system even though you have not explained your position (don't bother). Similarly, a number of political scientists did not bother to support their petition against Trump with specific examples (https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2016/11/07/a-group-of-political-scientists-says-trumps-attacks-on-our-democracy-are-unprecedented-and-dangerous/?utm_term=.fbf021c09ce6). In their case, they backed their claims with their names and positions. In my case, I simply assume Trump's buffoonery is self-evident and that the large number of people who have spoken out against him can provide ample clues as to how he has alienated them.

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Only disgusting person I see is the OP.

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I watched every single episode of every single season of 'The Apprentice' and never got the impression that Donald Trump had no patience for things that didn't go his way. What gave you that impression about Trump after watching 'The Apprentice'?


Are you basing your opinion of Donald from the Apprentice? Wow. Go out and educate yourself. Watch some news programs. Watch for yourself how he behaves in an unedited conversation. Don't base your opinions on something Trump uses to market himself.



...............ZING!

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Bro-- you're a *beep* fool. You're the joke. A successful businessman running for president and captivating the nation is not a joke. A prominent individual that calls for strong borders, putting an end to the ridiculous illegal influx of ugly uneducated criminal dirtbags pouring into our country, for more competent international dealmaking, for measures that protect us from the deluded fools that blow themselves up on trains, kill gays and beat their shawled slavelike wives so they can become shawled slavelike wives under their violent rules, all to enjoy supposed carnal pleasures (sins) in heaven, is NOT a fool. It's unbridled courage and unapologetic executive decision making. It's a joke that we would have a man and later, his son in office. It's a joke that we would have a man and later, his fake wife in office. It's a joke that people continue to support the globalist clinton political machine. Those are the demons. Those are the devil. You've got to take a step back and wonder why the media doesn't have it in for these criminals like they do Trump, but you don't, you take it at face value. Hating Trump is cool among the know-nothing leftist legion, and you haven't thought into why that is at all. You're just buying into the narrative, wholesale, and it's honestly disgusting. Pissant

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How is Trump any different than GW Bush. They are identical candidates. Trump respects the Bush's so much that he has hired his top guys from GW's advisors! Lol. You really should spend more time reading more than just what Fox News says. There is a lot of news out there that you are missing.
Why do you think Trump is the ONLY person who will fight terrorism? You realize that the President relies on the House to pass legislation, right? That includes budgets for new programs. Trump can't just build a wall or send troops to kill Muslims. You imagine that Trump is infallible (despite his many failings and the fact that his success is owed to his father, just like Bush). I don't want an oranges-faced Hitler to use "unapologetic decision making" and "unbridled courage". You talk like you are getting geared up for WW three! It has nothing to do with being "cool" and everything to do with the fact that I agree with all the policies laid out on the website dedicated to detailing the positions of the Democratic front runner Hillary Clinton, and I disagree with everything the Republican front runner says. I don't accept your view that the sky is falling and we need to close ourselves off from the scary dangerous foreigners. Lol. I recognize that I'm more likely to die at a school shooting or in gun fire from a police officer than I am from a Muslim terrorist.

And, a word of advice, don't use words like pissant to describe people with varying political opinions. It makes you look a little like a radicalized terrorist. And, you should also refrain from calling politicians "demons" or "the devil" because it further makes you look like a crazy nut case.

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Yeah, it's his goddamn job to convince the legislatives to pass the bill so he can sign it. It's that simple.

>I don't want an oranges-faced Hitler to use "unapologetic decision making" and "unbridled courage".

Whoops! He's not entirely comfortable with an inferior culture illegally seeping in from the southern border & having to foot the bill for several million unskilled lifelong low-earners.

Ut-oh! woopie-pies! He's not so keen on an ideology fundamentally antithetical to ours that has got a bunch of unibrowed pube-bearded stone-age suicidal runts blowing their dirt-flesh all over your local airport's 6th terminal.

Oh boy, he's got no problem with your poly-identitied xymkin fairweather-gendered friend using the ladies' room if it gives em the same gratification as a few new tumblr follows.

HITLAAAAR!

Meanwhile the *beep* left, smearing themselves in proverbial excrement, & eternally misguided by an obsession with identity politics, are the ones that have been lathering in hateful imagery. Among their ranks are the unmotivated human leeches stomping on the American flag then waving others that aren't ours. A new social meritocracy has damned your knee-jerk feelings-based perspectives & nanny-state pipe dreams. Take them the *beep* somewhere that isn't this country. We hate you

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Along with the rest of us Americans, Trump doesn't like those things. That doesn't mean that he is prepared to deal with them. Most Americans aren't "keen" on our problems, doesn't mean they are prepared to be president either. The man is a buffoon.
His racist attitudes have plunged our country into a race war!! Before the mayhem we see today everyone was saying that Trump needs to tone it down and stop accepting endorsements from racist organizations. He was warned that his open acceptance of endorsements from the k.k.k. (Kay-Kay-Kay) and his racist agenda was fueling race tensions. But, instead of toning it down he amped it up for attention. Even Paul Ryan called his rhetoric irresponsible. Next you know there was violence at his rallies and now there is violence everywhere. I'm not saying this is the sole reason, but as he gets more and more media attention, his remarks are emboldening those like him- people like you- the hate-filled population. You can't have a peaceful nation when you have someone like Trump spewing his hate and anger on television everyday. I don't like what his message is. It is basically, "make America white again". It is not only a terrible message that is tearing our country apart, it is also tarnishing Americans' reputation all over the world. Meanwhile, Hillary Clinton is loved all over the world. Having travelled as SOS, she was met with cheering crowds when she travelled overseas. As the only former First Lady with a political career, she is an international symbol of freedom and prosperity. That is the symbol of our country that will restore our credibility and garner support from our allies. Bush's lie about wmd's destroyed our credibility, but HRC restored it as SOS. Now Trump is destroying it again and he isn't even president.

Google: Play The Donald Trumpet. There you will see and interesting layout of my opinions of Trump's campaign policies.

Luckily, Trump has already started to self-sabatoge his own campaign. As the election wears on his ability to stay in the press is wearing on too. I will be surprised if he emerges from the RNC as the candidate. I know that Republican senators from my state have pledged to offer their support to a candidate of Ryan's choosing. The fact that his own party doesn't want him is telling. Everyone, except Trump's sheeple, has one reason for not liking Trump: he constantly says stupid things that rile up stupid people. He doesn't seem to have a filter that tells him not to shoot off at the mouth. No filter = bad president.
I won't even have people with no filter as my friend, I'm certainly not going to vote for one as president. But, after reading your post, I can see why you would like someone like that. Call it a difference of opinion. It happens in politics. I want what is best for everyone in the country, Trump supporters just want what is best for Trump. May the best candidate win! (Im sure she will.)

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When did race come up? You are a leftist fool and you, and all of the other entitlement grabbing dirtbags sucking on the teat of the govt should be separated from civilized society and that goes for white or black people. Get out of here. Same people like you who voted for Mr. Barack YesWeCan Obama, and did he give you any thing? No, infact he spent the MOST out of any President in recent history. You think that 80 year old commie Bernie or that Criminal Hillary is gonna do a good job? You are completely nuts and so is their supporters. Trump is a business man and a Capitalist, and thats what our country needs. When he becomes president he's going to dismantle all these b.s. bureaucracies just watch.

BTW I recommend this vid it's good.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LibRNYJmZ-I

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Legislature does the budget dimwit

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You're the one that thinks he's racist so zip the lip.

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From the beginning, people have been criticizing Trump for his bigoted messages regarding Muslims and Mexicans. They also wanted him to denounce the white supremacists who have endorsed him. Instead, Trump chose to publicly accept the endorsement from leaders of the neo-Nazi groups on Twitter. This is why so many big companies have pulled out of the RNC. They don't want their brand's reputation sullied by Trump's ugly, destructive rhetoric.
But of course you know this. After all, he is your candidate. You are simply choosing to support him and his bigotry by ignoring it. You are simply a liar just like Trump. We all know that Trump's campaign has been denounced by many leaders in US and by the President of Mexico, not to mention that England's parliament had an emergency session and collectively agreed to denounce him, as well as China's President denounced him. Refusing to admit the reality that his campaign has been heavily criticized for associating with white supremacists on his Twitter feed and for his statements against Mexicans as well as his unconstitutional suggestion that we deny people who are Muslim, well, that's just your way of being a bigot yourself.
I'm pretty sure you are exactly the kind of people that helped Hitler rise to power.

Bottom line, you know he is a bigot and you support him because you are too. One only needs to turn on the tv, read the news, or listen to the radio to know people are accusing him of being racist. A leader shouldn't be denounced by the President's of our allies for being a racist. We are the United States of America. We don't want more inequality. We want less. We don't want more stupid people running around fanning the flames of racial intolerance. Sadly, Trump revels in the chaos. He refuses to denounce his new-Nazi supporters, retweets neo-Nazi messages, and calls Mexicans rapists and killers. That is not what we need right now. Even if he decides to reign it in a little, the damage is done. You can't have a leader who is only interested in support from white males. By the way, if Trump's message is so inclusive, then why is it that polls show his only lead is with the white males?

The problems we face are huge. We have a very old Supreme Court, likely to need more than just Scalia's seat filled in the next 4 years. There will be a whole lot more race riots if Trump continues to stoke the hatred in his supporters. He is emboldening white supremacists. He is supporting hatred. His entire message is negative and hate-filled. It's not a political platform, it's a playground bully name-calling. Why would anyone stoop so low as to support that message, I can't understand. The only explanation is that people just want someone to kick when they are down and being a bigot fulfills that need. Like I said, it's the same reasons that Hitler rose to power. And that brought us WWII. I'm not looking for WWIII.

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Can you say television show? These are scripted TV shows that do not guarentee you a peep of knowledge of what someone's character truly is. If you are going to base your vote on fiction, then you really don't need to be voting at all. That's like saying, "I'm going to vote for Arnold because he was a good terminator and I'm going to go with him because "I want to live." Jeez......

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Donald did the show for 14 seasons and it was about him. He is a personality. That is entirely different than being a professional actor. You and many other Trump supporters who are fans of his show are the ones who can't tell the difference between a show that relies on someone's real life professional experience as a greedy old business man vs tv show like A-Team. Donald is the one campaigning on the same persona. He's the one who has told both his fans of his show and voters that his business experience is his qualifications. Pretending that Trump is anything like a professional actor who only plays parts that are fictional is just another lie that Trump supporters tell themselves. Funny how Trump supporters call HRC a liar. Politifact found that 86% of the things Donald says are either untrue or opinions that he contradicts himself on later. (Hillary is just a fraction of that).

Don't pretend that the Apprentice is completely irrelevant. Trump is trading on his experience as a business man. Too bad his business practices are to stiff the little guy, use the courts to bully people, and enrich himself off the hard work of others. He is a con man. I bet you people imagine that Trump would be your friend or that your just like him (if only you had that $200 million from your daddy to start a business like he did).

The only thing most of you people know about Trump is that he had his own tv show and that he is rich. Go ahead, besides having his own tv show and being rich, tell me what has he done for his community? How does be stack up in his experience of public service? What exactly are the traits and characteristics that you see from his actions that make you convinced he will make a good President?

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Good thing he won't become presi- Oh, never mind!

"Think of it. 90% of the population united against a common enemy. We'll be unstoppable!"

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So many words, and he still won. That's sad. You feel like you've been wasting your time?

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Personally I am not voting for either of them. My friends and I are all writing in Ted Cruz because it matters not which of those two clowns get in --- this country will be destroyed. Hillary has proven she cannot even run so much as an embassy without getting everyone killed and Trump has been involved in over 5,000 lawsuits. When he finds out that he cannot sue a country that insults him but he can bomb them it will be game on.The ONLY chance we and this country has is a huge write in campaign thereby making sure neither of the others have enough votes to win and sending it to Congress of which Ted Cruz is a member. Due to social media this is the first time in history that this can be accomplished. Write in Ted Cruz 2016. You will not be alone. #PrayforAmerica #WriteinTedCruz #NeverTrump #NeverHillary #NeverJohnson #NeverMcMullian #NeverCastle

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