MovieChat Forums > The Good Shepherd (2006) Discussion > Has the C.I.A. really murdered people?

Has the C.I.A. really murdered people?


Sorry if this is a stupid question, but it seems like this is the elephant in the room that you won't hear politicians address. Have there been incidents just like the (*spoiler alert*) the girl getting thrown out of the airplane simply for being an enemy spy? I know all about the C.I.A. plans to assassinate Castro (which obviously never materialized into anything of substance), but has the alleged excesses of the C.I.A. been reigned in?

Of course, we still have drone strikes today...

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Is the Pope a catholic?

Do bears defecate in arboreal areas?

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The CIA have not only murdered people, but Presidents.

You know...for kids.

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Possibly the most inappropriate use of that quote from Hudsucker ever...

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Interesting question. The funny thing is that in all the stories I've read about where the U.S. government got its hands bloody in a black op, the CIA never actually killed anyone. Even when they were involved neck-deep in the operation, they left the actual killing and bruising to others - either U.S. military units, or locals (insurgents, criminals, even cops and soldiers if it's a friendly country) hired for the occasion.

The CIA was neck deep into the hunt for Che Guevara, but they didn't kill him, the Bolivian Army did. The CIA was neck deep into the hunt for Osama Bin Laden, but they didn't kill him, they left that to the Navy SEALs.

You can say it's a distinction without a difference because they're clearly involved in these operations from head to toe, but I nevertheless find it interesting that their personnel aren't the ones getting their hands dirty in any of these cases. If there's a real world 00-section or IMF or Treadstone, it's kept pretty well under wraps.


That man is playing Galaga! Thought we wouldn't notice. But we did.

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Interesting points made. Remember Charles Mansion and Adolf Hitler (in the Second Word War)didn't actually kill anyone either. In fact Manson made that same point at one of his parole hearings. So comes to the question of ethics and morals and complicity. As you quite rightly phrase it, a distinction without a difference.
The person who engineers the death is as guilty as the one who does the deed IMO.

Kind of like James Bond really, but sorry to joke as it really isn't a laughing matter.

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Interesting points made. Remember Charles Mansion and Adolf Hitler (in the Second Word War)didn't actually kill anyone either. In fact Manson made that same point at one of his parole hearings. So comes to the question of ethics and morals and complicity. As you quite rightly phrase it, a distinction without a difference.

Sure. Let me clarify: I'm not talking about morality and responsibility here. I'm just saying, that the actual "killing" part doesn't seem to be the CIA's end of the business. I'm not saying it's not a cog in the same machine as the soldiers or the hired help for whom it is the job.


That man is playing Galaga! Thought we wouldn't notice. But we did.

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Guns for hire, for sure you are right about who actually does the deed. Hard to imagine Edward in TGS pulling out a gun, but his menace is more chilling, because it is so cold-blooded even though justified under the blanket of patriotism.

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You're being to literal.
"did/does the CIA kill?" isnt as much a question about who pulls the trigger, wields the knife or pushes the piano. Its about if they have the authority to sanction killing, do they have the power to order unaffiliated groups, shuch as the military to commit assassinations?
Yes. Yes they do.


Do they have their own Bonds as trigger men? Maybe. Probably. But largely, when they have the power to direct all of Americas Special Forces as they see fit, its really not necessary.
The CIA isnt direct action, they just gather, analyze and deseminate information.
Their word is golden, just remember the WMD's in Iraq (lol), a war was started because of their intelligence..

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Well the best killers in the world are Delta and maybe Devgru. The most elite from both are picked to work for the CIA as operators. My guess is that they kill people. I think one of the first casualties of the war in Iraq/Afghanistan were CIA operators. It was actually in the news, which I am surprised of to be honest.

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There was a law past that they weren't allowed to assasinate anyone... I can't recall the details, but think about it. If it hadn't happened would they need a law?

The CIA often works through external operators including rebels in other countries; rather than directly acting.

There were several attempts on Castro's life, how many were "encouraged" by the CIA is unknown.

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RIGOLETTO: I'm denied that common human right, to weep.

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I would tell you, but then I'd have to kill you.

Love's turned to lust and blood's turned to dust in my heart.

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Three weeks before JFK was killed the C.I.A. took part in over throwing president Diem in South Vietnam. Diem was killed in the coup and supposedly LBJ later told RFK after his brother's assassination that being JFK ordered the coup against Diem what happened to him in Dallas was "divine retribution".

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You answered your own question with the drone strike thing. The CIA has its own drones and uses them, so yes they kill people.

And as others on this thread have said, even when they don't directly dirty their own hands, it's a distinction without a difference because they usually have others take care of the killing for them. In that way, they've killed many, many, many people.

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I have no doubt the CIA has murdered people before, but it's unlikely that knowledge of these killings would ever reach the eyes and ears of the public. Most of their targets would probably simply vanish into thin air. I think Snowden actually released some information showing the complicity of the CIA in targeted killings sanctioned by the government, which you could probably find on Google. You can also find a lot of interesting articles on the Wikipedia detailing some of the CIA's biggest scandals or alleged involvement in shady activities.

These days the guise of "national security" is used to cover up all sorts of horrific crimes committed in the name of the state, and the CIA does have a pretty shady record with past incidents (ex. helping to arm and create terrorist groups like Al Qaeda that later attack America and kill thousands of innocent people, smuggling drugs into the United States in the 80s to help fund the war in Nicaragua etc).

The list goes on and on, and those are only the things that have leaked out to the public. The true extent of what goes on behind the veil of secrecy that is National Security will never be known.

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