MovieChat Forums > Undisputed (2002) Discussion > Did Iceman throw the fight?

Did Iceman throw the fight?

posted 16 years ago by pndferpnd
16 replies | jump to latest

Just watched this movie on cable tonight and thought I'd come on here and ask. We get the scene where the mobsters ask the old mobster's sidekick to ask Iceman to lay down in the fourth. We get the scene where Iceman's lawyer is telling him how screwed up his finances are. Then Iceman, after spending the past 10 years beating the best the sport has to offer without ever even getting knocked down, loses in the fourth to a guy who spent the last 10 years in prison beating up on conficts with questionable boxing skills. Now, back in his day Monroe clearly had skills...he was undefeated at the time of his incarceration...and I don't doubt that he could have beaten the champ....but in the fourth round? By an overwhelming knockout?? I believe the Iceman took a fall and the cash and got out of prison. Agree? Disagree?

"True wisdom comes from knowing that you know nothing. That's US, Dude!"

[–] dooki667 16 years ago

i agree with your logic pndferpnd that iceman getting knocked out the way he did by monroe in the fourth roundis ridiculous,especially after he totally dominated monroe for two rounds putting him down twice,this would not happen in real life.However i do not belive he was throwing the fight in the movie, i belive he was to lose because he was so brash and overconfident,and monroe the better man"?" i guess was supposed to comeout on top in a fair fight.

[–] 16 years ago

[deleted]

[–] al666940-3 16 years ago

I'm surprised how no one seems tor ealize that.

The mobsters are doing this for the money they'll get betting against Iceman.

If Iceman wins, they lose their betting money.

You think they will keep their word and get Iceman out then?

OF COURSE NOT.

So clearly Iceman better loose the bout. That don't mean he's gonna loose it right away, since he clearly showed Monroe that he could own him if he wanted to. THEN he can loose the fight.

Wasn't that hard to loose anyway.

1.- The rules were designed to HELP Monroe's and HURT Iceman' s style (no rounds, light gloves and no time limit, who do you think will wear himself out first?).

2.- EVERYONE is out to get Iceman. Having a 100% hostile crowd doesn't help much.

3.- Who's to say nobody mixed something into his food, regardless of what Monroe told them (to him is personal, but to everyone else is about money, thye don't care how Iceman gets beat as long as he does).

[–] KryptoKO 16 years ago

Iceman, it would seem, did in fact throw the fight. Following the fight, a couple of mobsters at ringside have knowing looks and whisper about something obviously confidential into each other's ears.

I think that's a good indication that Iceman threw the fight according to plan. And as a previous poster said, if Iceman lost and cost the mob guys millions there is no way they would help him out of jail.

Iceman threw it.

[–] lil_Nicky-94 16 years ago

damn, i'm glad somebody cleared that up for me.

i was watching that movie too. at the end where they give Monroe the "Undisputed" title, i was feelin a lil moody. lol Iuno, they was all like "...but we kno who the REAL undisputed champ is!! YEAH!!!".

Monroe had ALOT of dudes on his side, one/half of the cellmates was behind him 100%. rest jus wanted Iceman to lose anyway. way i see it, Monroe had alot on his side, while Iceman was 100% by himself in that cell...imagine EVERYBODY under the same roof as you praying for your downfall. even if he won, nobody would still like em, and they'd prolly try to kill em for winning.

if Iceman didnt lose, there prolly wouldnt have been any hope for em. and as egotistic as he is, he "threw the fight". and you all saw it, Monroe was gettin his a$$ handed to em. last round all of a sudden Iceman a rookie in comparison. so the way i see it..."Iceman" is the "Undisputed" champ, because he had NOBODY to back him, and Monroe did.

“I am YuLaw!! I am nobody’s b`tch…” -/The One

[–] koffeenkreame41-1 14 years ago

I remember wondering the same after I watched it again if Iceman threw the fight.

"I am the ultimate badass, you do not wanna `*beep*` wit' me!" Hudson in Aliens.

[–] manofsteel4455 13 years ago

I'm sure people thought that Ali beating Foreman and Shavers was unrealistic too you guys.

You want to play the game, you'd better know the rules, love.
-Harry Callahan

[–] al666940-3 13 years ago

First, Ali didn't do an upset, he waited for Foreman to wear himself out, and that took him 8 rounds.

And Foreman didn't whip Ali a couple rounds before that.

Here it's OBVIOUS Iceman has to loose the fight if he ever wants an early parole. Which he indeed did get. No way that would happen if he wins and makes the mobsters lose their betting money.

[–] hoboboxerjoe 10 years ago

Ali didn't pull an upset? Are you kidding me?

[–] denthegod 12 years ago

Everybody here makes great points but I really think you guys are just thinking waaaaay too much into it. There is nothing wrong with that, though. Thinking outside of the box is always a good thing and more and more people ought to be doing that. However, for the type of movie it is and the audience it is supposed to appeal to, I highly doubt the director nor the writers ever intended for the Iceman to lose on purpose. Again, I do want to emphasize that this is a very interesting discussion, though.

[–] toky-world 12 years ago

I agree. Iceman was overwhelming at the beginning but then something happens in the 3rd round and Monroe comes on top.

He threw it. My only question is who lost (regarding the gambled money).

Mobsters seem that they won money, Monroe won money, Iceman won the early parole. Who bet for Iceman?

[–] prospectboy05 11 years ago

I never thought that the Iceman threw the fight, but this is indeed an interesting thought that makes logical sense. I personally don't think he threw the fight though. I think that Ripstein wanted a fair fight, and he genuinely believed that Monroe could beat the Iceman.

As far as the money goes, the way they talked was that Ripstein had millions stashed away, so losing money on the fight wouldn't have affected him too much. Again, I'm not saying that the Iceman didn't throw the fight, but if he did he's a good actor. That knockout looked real to me.

[–] tex1978 10 years ago

What a lot of people seem to forget is that Iceman's lawyers met him in prison and told him his finances were a mess. He owed the IRS millions and the lady who accused him of rape was filing a civil suit that could cost millions to settle. He needed money bad and the only way to get it was to get out of prison and start fighting again. It was better for him to lose to Monroe and get out as soon as possible instead of winning a prison fight. Therefore, I think he threw the fight to get out of prison.

Hamburgers, the cornerstone of any nutritious breakfast. - Jules Winnfield.

[–] jasperparker 10 years ago

I have a question for those of you who think the Iceman may have taken a dive. Why was he so angry after Monroe floored him?

[–] FightingConch1970 9 years ago

Pride.

[–] al666940-3 8 years ago

And common sense (can't make it too obvious that he took a dive, or the bets would be called off, along with his parole).

Jake LaMotta once did that to get a title shot (taking a dive for mobsters), and got almost kicked out of boxing because he was way too obvious about it (refused to go down and just stood there taking the beating, he even stared at the clock while at it).