MovieChat Forums > Spy Game (2001) Discussion > Redford calling her out, jeopardized the...

Redford calling her out, jeopardized the mission worse!!

posted 15 years ago by saybow69
6 replies | jump to latest

I think this movie is very underated, but dont make sense how he acted like she might "bring down the whole operation"? He is the one who just let her know Pitt was planning something? (Wasnt Pitt who he said he was someone else) So his speech at the table would have only put Pitt in joepardy, if she was a ratical or bad like Redford assumed? So made no sense calling her out in front of Pitt? THAT WOULD JEOPARDIZE THE MISSION MORE! Then he takes her away after they kill the Shiek? She didnt ruin it? Or tell anyone at least, was Pitt fault for sleeping with her that night, but that should have proved she wasnt bad at least towards thier operation there. And Pitt tells Redford he is on way with his radio when he is goin to get doctor, yet Redford or Pitt never contact each other again, like were are you? Why they never talked to each other again was huge hole? I LOVE MOVIE and deserves more credit, but just dont understand those 2 parts? Redford calling her out was worse for mission, not better! And takin her away? I know he used people, but it seems that she did not do anything like Redford said "jeopardize" the mission. Was Pitt's fault, she didnt tell anyone. So seemed a little strange he would do that to her, cause she didnt ruin it. Was Pitt`s own fault. I know how his character was, using people, but just seemed a little odd and not talking on radio again? Only 2 issues, but loved movie!

[–] figuratively_red 13 years ago

He didn't call her out in front of her (in a way that would jeopardize the mission), he talked with Pitt after she had left angrily. Mostly I think he would have come across as a jerk who uses his position in the embassy to find out secrets and hold them over others - and in terms of the mission, Redford was (I'm sure) hoping to kill the relationship between Pitt and her so that she no longer would have position to jeopardize the mission (and we see that it did kill their relationship until Pitt broke the ice again). Also it wasn't necessarily her that Redford was worried about - more the Hezbollah guy who she had dealings with - and what she told him.

And I don't find it unreasonable that Pitt and Redford never talk again throughout the rest of the movie. Pitt delivers what is ultimately a huge insult to Redford, telling him that he doesn't want to end up like him. That statement would put a huge damper on their relationship, cutting it off seems most realistic to me. Redford is something of a father figure to Pitt in the movie, and having his protege tell him that he doesn't value his way of doing things - the investment Redford has been making in Pitt to teach him this methodology - would make it hard for Redford to initiate contact with Pitt, and Pitt probably wouldn't want to talk to Redford (or maybe just doesn't want to rub salt in that wound anymore). Pitt's capture actually gives the possibility that their relationship can be restored a little bit after the movie ends (since now Pitt can see that Redford actually cares about something).

[–] padzok 9 years ago

What we see in the movie is consistent with Muir being gay and in love with Bishop.

As you say, the scene in the restaurant does not really make sense from the point of view of Muir being a master manipulator who is just out to get the mission done.

Also, it is not 100% clear why he needs to have her kidnapped and taken to China. (Although maybe he gets some favour in return from the Chinese).

However, the restaurant scene could be explained if his jealousy causes him to lose his normal cool, calm and collected thought processes.

And, of course, the abduction fits in with him wanting her off the playing field.

By the end of the movie, he has realised that neither Bishop nor Elizabeth deserved the predicaments he put them in, and also that Bishop is unattainable, and so relents and saves the day.

[–] tanncord 9 years ago

What we see in the movie is consistent with Muir being gay and in love with Bishop.

As you say, the scene in the restaurant does not really make sense from the point of view of Muir being a master manipulator who is just out to get the mission done.

Also, it is not 100% clear why he needs to have her kidnapped and taken to China. (Although maybe he gets some favour in return from the Chinese).

However, the restaurant scene could be explained if his jealousy causes him to lose his normal cool, calm and collected thought processes.

And, of course, the abduction fits in with him wanting her off the playing field.

By the end of the movie, he has realised that neither Bishop nor Elizabeth deserved the predicaments he put them in, and also that Bishop is unattainable, and so relents and saves the day.

Wow, Padzok, I totally agree. Next time I watch, I'll keep this in mind; it adds a lot of depth to the movie and to Redford's performance. Someone like Muir WOULD have a deep secret, I'd think. He was indeed trying to get Tom to back off from Elizabeth. When I first saw the movie, I thought the contempt Muir showed for Elizabeth meant he too was attracted to her and he was jealous of Tom, not of her, but I agree; it seems like jealously that she is with Tom. I used to think Muir and Bishop were father and son archetypes but this adds a cool twist, especially given Redford playing the role. Of course some of Muir's decisions went far beyond being attracted to Bishop. The set up of bringing Schmitt guy across; Muir's attraction to Bishop doesn't explain Bishop supposedly killing Ann Cathcart or sacrificing the poor sweet doctor in Beirut with the car bomb.

Muir is so secretive about his personal life - of course, he's old school. Well spotted.

[–] cero_chris 9 years ago

Interesting idea, but: No. 

If you check out the deleted scenes, you find out that when he is asked whether he knew Hadley and he solely replies with "Our paths crossed; that's about it." the backstory was cut: Muir indeed had a history with her. Tony Scott in an interview told that they had to cut the sequence because it would make Muir look far too cold hearted. In another cut scene, when Muir and Folger exchange glances: Folger urges him to deal with her.

I can recommend everyone who enjoyed the movie as much as I did, to watch the deleted scenes on the DVD. It explains so much and sometimes sheds a different light on some of the scenes. Would be worth a directors cut! 🎬

[–] 9 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Mighty_Michael88 9 years ago

Cero_chris! Thanks for the insight. ... I should review the DvD again. ..