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What is your stance on Mitchum's comment about Rory?


What is your stance on Mitchum's comment about Rory starting a career in journalism do you agree with it or indifferent?

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I am pretty indifferent I mean what did it matter whether he though she had it or not? Rory was too friggin sensitive by the end of the series. Season 1 Rory was so much stronger mentally than later Rory it didn't matter to her that head master Charleston was intimidating, uptight and judgmental she knew she could succeed and she wasn't shaken. College Rory was prone to hysterics every time she received criticism or felt overwhelmed. She could have asked others what they thought her weaknesses were and worked on them.

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He didn't handle it the best way and the criticism seemed to come out of nowhere, but he wasn't the type of guy to sugarcoat stuff and Rory knew that. I felt like Lorelai encouraged Rory's breakdown at first by acting like Mitchum's comment was the worst thing anyone could say.

Lorelai was really her own worst enemy when it came to parenting. She coddled and babied Rory and then couldn't handle it in Season 6 when Rory become this fragile piece of glass.

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Sure, Mitchum did not handle it in the best way, but he was not a type to sugarcoat things- something Rory knew. I agree with people that Rory became too sensitive by the end of the series. She couldn't handle any criticism, which was a complete disconnect from her original character. Season 1 Rory stood up to authority figures, like Headmaster Charleston, because she knew she could succeed.

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I think your forgetting the time she flipped out over one bad grade. It mirrored when she was told to drop a class freshman year and panicked. She was just as afraid of failure as she was later on. But when she became more comfortable in a situation she became stronger as she did with Chilton and Yale. This was her first time ever working for a real paper and if she had had more time to get used to the atmosphere and do some real work I don't think Mitchum's comments would have thrown her as they did. I'm sure they still would have but she would have bounced back faster.

"Ich lüge" is German for "I'm lying".

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So I can either agree or be indifferent? What about actively disagreeing with it? haha.
I thought Mitchum was a smart, focussed, business oriented man who was used to running things. However, when he offered Rory the internship, he offered her a shadow placement. Not an active internship so in her head (and anyone who knows the term "shadow placement") she expected to do nothing more than shadow him. Yes, her initiative skills are lacking but her apparent brilliance in writing (or at least as we're always being told) and her organisation and intelligence are her born talents. She can work on her ability to take the initiative and it was ridiculous that Mitchum worked with her two weeks and told her that she didn't have it. Maybe she won't be a foreign correspondent but she can still work in journalism. His attempt to crush her was, in fact, an attempt to crush her. Or maybe he's just never learned how to appraise employees properly? If he were my manager, I'd have given my frank opinions right back at him.

My teenage angst has a body count

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Rory should've defended herself with comments about the nature of the internship and someone like Paris or Lorelai would've done just that in the conversation. I don't believe Mitchum cared enough about Rory to crush her at all. It just happened and he also didn't think highly of her writing. The writers did a poor job showing Rory as a talented writer because she came off at least in my opinion as someone who was blissfully unaware of the impact of her words. We saw this with the ballerina article and again with her article mocking the rich people making connections in season 7.

"When life gives you lemons"
Jessica D: sleep with their fathers and have secret lemon children 

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I agree, entirely. She should have had more balls to stand up for herself against Mitchum and the writers definitely missed a trick when they only ever told us how good Rory was.

My teenage angst has a body count

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It is very painful to be in wrong profession, here is an article about a young woman studied journalism and has decent writing skills but could not gain employment: http://www.smh.com.au/comment/pass-it-on-give-gen-y-more-than-a-foot-in-the-door-20130708-2pm8v.html. The young woman even thinks the system is rigged against someone like her. The article gained quite a lot comments (more than 400), but in the end I think she should have talked to someone worked in the industry and also could be honest with her, someone like Mitchum, before deciding to study journalism. These people know how competitive the field is and have seen a lot of people making it also those who didn't, a lot of times they can tell.

A cynic is what an idealist calls a realist - Sir Humphrey Appleby

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Point well taken about the nature of a shadow placement, and I probably wouldn't have approached it any differently from Rory (at her age, certainly). Then again, I don't claim to have what it takes to be a foreign correspondent.

It's a tough standard to be held to, but Mitchum's view is that someone gutsy and driven enough to really succeed in that field will naturally speak up and take initiative no matter what the "official" nature of the internship. It's like what he said to her when he first offered the internship and she tried to turn him down. I paraphrase, but he said it doesn't matter why or how you got the opportunity - it's what you make of it when you get your foot in the door. She got her foot in the door, and in his view, she didn't make enough of it.

He has a point. Rory wants a gold star for being smart and diligent and good at following instructions. He wanted her to show what she was made of, and to hell with the instructions. Given the nature of the job she wants, I'm not sure that's so unreasonable. (Of course he could've been nicer about it and treated it more as an experience she could learn from. But, well, that's not Mitchum.)

Edit to address the part about "crushing" her: I absolutely don't think Mitchum had any particular vendetta against Rory. He's not a passive-aggressive mind-game player. If he wanted Rory out of Logan's life, he would've said so bluntly - because that's what he does - not dithered around with some sneaky plan to make her run away crying. For all his objectionable traits, I think Mitchum is actually a very straightforward character to understand.

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It's just really bad practise to, at the first sit down with an employee, say "You're *beep* and that's just how it is."
I entirely agree, though, she should be more driven but as I said, that's something you can learn through trial and error. I did. I was terrible at speaking when being asked to, I hated contributing unless needed. Now I will be as vocal as possible but that's only through feedback that was constructive.

My teenage angst has a body count

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It was his opinion. She should of been able to shake it off. There really wasn't a basis for it, he was being a jerk and it was her first real opportunity other than writing for a school paper. But if you can't have confidence in your abilities then why are you even doing it? Honestly, after working for him she probably could of got another internship and gained even more experience. Realistically, she should of expected him to be that way, he only gave her the job as an apology. But it was a way to set up Rory leaving Yale.

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She shouldn't have accepted the internship in the first place. I don't understand how Rory could think that taking the internship which she only got offered because she was Logan's girlfriend would lead her to anywhere good in her career.

I also find it hypocritical as she always prized herself someone who likes to earn things with hard work and struggle like the average folk. In the real world no one takes you seriously at a workplace if you're only there because of your boyfriend.

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In the real world, nobody who wants to be a journalist (or has other ambitions) would turn down an internship with a professional paper (or any other company) and the chance of real credentials, real life work experience and maybe even the chance to write pieces after the internship or getting others through that internship and connections.

In saw many people getting a job through connections and yes they have to prove them even more and have to work harder (often), so that co-workers take them seriously, but if you are a hard worker and ambitious you can achieve that.

That she pretended to be the average folk and has to struggle was always an issue, because she never was, she had everything handed to her, but she doesn't´t realize it, bc Lorelai made her believe that when growing up. Lorelai always ranted about rich people and how bad they are, yet took money from them anyway and also enjoyed it and Rory is the same. She rants about that dude from the party in season 7 and I loved that Logan told her the truth.

Also, despite everyone praised Rory for being supersmart, I think she is average, but everyone told her how smart she is, because she read a lot and got straight A´s - Well, I think it is not that hard to get straight A´s, if you don´t work besides school or have a sports or other time consuming hobbies. She barely did anything else than study, yet struggled at Yale and in the internship.
I also think she choose a pretty easy major. For someone who is constantly reading, English literature is not that hard, however I think it is not the best major if you want to be a journalist. I mean there are Bachelor degrees for journalism, politics, business, foreign languages and other maybe with a double major in journalism - But of course, this would have been harder than studying English literature and re-reading tons of books you already read.*

* That does not mean English literature in general is an easy major, just for someone like Rory, who read tons of books even before high school.

Rory is not that hard of a worker and tended (past here, bc I havent´seen the new episodes and maybe that changed) to give up easily and broke down when she was criticized - That is not journalist material, as journalism is very competitive and you will be criticized by a lot of people during that.


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Rory's more studious than intelligent for sure. She basically studied 24/7 growing up and didn't have any activities as you said in your post. One of my biggest gripes was that Rory just got pushed into everything. Paris had to tell her that she needed extracurriculars for Harvard but she supposedly knew everything about Harvard, she had an interest in the paper so I'll give her that, debates were always pushed by Paris, and so was the student council. Wouldn't someone so obsessed with Harvard know what they look for in applicants?

"When life gives you lemons"
Jessica D: sleep with their fathers and have secret lemon children 

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Also true, everything extra thing she did was after Paris told her she had to, to have a shot getting into Ivy league.

But Rory herself had a tendency to make the bare minimum, for someone who says loves to travel and wants to become a foreign correspondent, you would think a semester abroad is definitely on the to do list and with money not being an issue, she could have definitely done that. But as this wasn´t mandatory in her major, she didn´t even consider it.

Rory was never proactive, taking the initiative or doing more than required - Yes, she was on the paper, but for someone wanting to be a journalist I´d say this is necessary and in Chilton Paris pointed that out to her (or made a comment about joining the paper, bc she wanted to be a journalist, before Rory even thought about this) - She also never did extra things back at Stars Hollow high - as headmaster Charleston pointed out.

I´d think if you go to public school and want to get into Ivy League University you would take every extra thing you can get, to show ambition, thrive, hard work. I mean she couldn´t be sure to get into Chilton and as money was somewhat of an issue to pay for Ivy league, I´d think you might also choose something that could get you a scholarship, such as sports, or extra academic classes.

I think Rory knowing about Harvard is the same with knowledge about Christiana Amanpour - If she´d read more than just surficial things or pieces of her, she w(c)ould have know that a journalism degree might make her life after University easier and maybe even double majoring would be better for her future career than just English Lit - I mean Christiana was her role model, and she even talked about working on the frontline for CNN a couple of times.

You´d think that someone with such ambitions would not scream like a little child, just because you mother threw a little onion bulb on you. - You would harden and maybe work on overcoming fears of insects, or nature or something - At least learn different languages that are not that common and might be useful in such situations, like frontline gulf war reporting. And also take a look at what your role model has studied to become that successful.

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I agree that connections matter, but there is a big difference between getting an internship/job with nepotism or with being somebody's girlfriend. When you're born into wealth, status and a powerful family it's natural for others that you get ahead with your life using it to your advantage and your supervisors (who are there to give you feedback on your work) won't mess with you, because they know it can hurt their career or damage important connections.

When Emily confronted Shira? Huntzberger she said to Emily:
"there is your money and there is our money."
Mitchum wouldn't have dared to give an honest feedback to someone whom he considered his equal status-wise and could cause any unpleasantness in his business. Rory is considered privileged when you compare her to the average folk but when you compare her to the top 1% she's not. Mitchum knew that Rory didn't have the status to be a threat to his business and that being somebody's girlfriend is not a permanent, important status, in their world only marriage would have given her that status, like it did to Shira who was a waitress before marrying Mitchum.

In saw many people getting a job through connections and yes they have to prove them even more and have to work harder (often), so that co-workers take them seriously, but if you are a hard worker and ambitious you can achieve that.


That doesn't reflect my experience. It doesn't matter if your co-workers on your level take you seriously or not especially if you're an intern, what matters is that your supervisor/boss knows who you are because they're the ones who determine your position, not the ones you're on the same level.

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Oh thank goodness for this thread. I didn't want to start a new one on this topic.

I'm a GG fan, but by the later seasons I was working all the time and going to school, so I lost track of the plot on granular level. So my rewatch is rectifying this.

I knew that Mitchum said something that made Rory go off the deep end, but having just finished the episode, I am utterly confused as to why his feedback made her spiral out of control. It wasn't even that bad. He just told Rory that she was acting like a high school student, waiting for be rewarded for following the rules. I expected Rory to digest this and immediately stand up fot herself. Instead, she acted like her world crumbled. I know she's used to being praised, and Mitchum's opinion meant a lot to her, but his criticism wasn't that harsh! It totally left room for improvement.

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Yeah when I first saw the episode when it aired, I was shocked by Rory's reaction and I didn't really react to Mitchum's comments at the time. As an adult, I'm honestly not surprised by his review. Rory approached the internship like a high school student. Why is it important for her to memorize facts about Mitchum? That just came off as Rory trying to be a suck up to get brownie points and it was just unnecessary. Rory not immediately speaking up makes sense but his review as you said left room for improvement. Basically she needed to put herself out there more and not overthink it. She did act like an assistant so I thought his comments were pretty accurate and those were all things she could've fixed if she wanted to but I think Rory was having doubts before then used his review as an excuse to just take a break. The writers could've planted the seeds a little bit more with her professional doubts earlier in the season.

"When life gives you lemons"
Jessica D: sleep with their fathers and have secret lemon children 

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As soon as she dropped out I thought she was being an idiot. He's just one guy, and she's supposed to be great.

That being said, I'm the same age/grade as Rory, and a part of me knew if the same thing happened to me, I'd give up on my major. But that's because deep down I knew a detractor was right, it would confirm my own doubts. I wouldn't have committed a felony and dropped out though. But Rory was always so sure she was great, never seemed to doubt her abilities (and sorry, but I don't really count that one time in the car with Jess where he questioned it for two seconds).

I've chanced stances: Mitchum was right. Rory doesn't have it, and she should have reflected on that more and considered what she needed to do to improve, or what else she should do with her life. It's frustrating that she doesn't.

And now, after the revival, I look at it all through a new frame- it was the driving force behind Rory going to the grandparents, and then her leaving them. Thus, making Rory Lorelai 2.0. Really. I think that was the whole point. And I find it even more pointless than ever.

It was all for nothing and didn't matter. Since, apparently, Rory was always doomed to stay in SH and be a single mom. This, also apparently, is what happens to people who have kids, they're stuck where they are. At least, that's what ASP said about her disappointment in Lane/Zach having kids. They had to stay in SH.

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But Rory was always so sure she was great, never seemed to doubt her abilities (and sorry, but I don't really count that one time in the car with Jess where he questioned it for two seconds).


A lot of Rory's more "vulnerable" moments fall into this category and I tend to feel hollow watching them. Her little freak outs are so poorly written that it never really makes sense and then they don't come back into the fold later down the road. Lorelai, Emily, and Richard dismissing Mitchum's opinions just ruined Rory even more. They could've said that he was harsh but his comments had some truth or at least ask questions about what happened while she worked there so they could give a well rounded opinion. Richard said she was a great writer and Mitchum casually dismissed it. Maybe she could've gotten him to read more of her stuff and critique it some at least to see where he was coming from or analyze her behavior because she did act like an assistant. Agreed that the season 6 storyline was forced to repeat the Lorelai leaving home plot and nothing getting resolved. I felt this way watching Friday Nights Alright for Fighting when I first saw it. They spend their whole time screaming at each other and nothing gets fixed. That episode is basically the full circle nonsense. I hate that Lane couldn't escape SH and her criticism of her season 7 storyline was so ridiculous when she did absolutely nothing with her character.

"When life gives you lemons"
Jessica D: sleep with their fathers and have secret lemon children 

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It always seemed like Mitchums assessment wasn't based on Rory's writing ability or how she was actually doing at the paper. Do we ever even know if she wrote anything for him? I would assume he would of read some her stuff before hiring her but then again he only gave her the job as an apology. All we saw was her be his assistant and follow him around a lot. She helped work on the layout of the paper and that was about it. His criticism was that she didn't speak up in a meeting they were in. To him that meant she was too passive and didn't seem to have the drive to make it in the business. I can see his point but then at the same time I think he could put a much more positive spin on things. Like saying "Hey kid, if you want to make it in the industry you got speak up in a meeting like that. Next time I want to hear your voice." He also could have told her to feel free to speak up in these meetings and be vocal. I'm not sure why he thought she would feel comfortable she was only supposed to be shadowing him. If nothing else you could argue that Rory learned from the experience. Not even a year later she takes the lead on getting the paper out that night when nothing was done and then she gets voted editor and shows she can be a leader. It was advice she could learn from and apply. I know people try to say that this incident proves Rory truly didn't have it and she was a bad writer. But I think it just shows she had room to grow. The Stamford Gazzette hires her back later and the guy saw all kinds of examples of her work. Although I dont think she would ever be a foreign correspondent...

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Oh she definitely had room to grow, I agree with that. But there's no acknowledgement of that from Rory or anyone else. Then she got indignant when Mitchum dared to mention her in the WSJ for giving her a start. So there was zero awareness that he had a point and she needed to speak up and do more than what was asked.

As far as Mitchum reading some of Rory's writing goes, he told Richard he'd read some of it when they had their confrontation in the bathroom at that USO function. Richard called her a talented writer with the potential to be the next Ben Bradlee, and Mitchum was like, Eh. He said he read her stuff too and knew great writing, and hers wasn't.

They were always so focused on the writing, but the reporting is more important in journalism (from what I've found on the topic). An editor can fix the writing. Rory was not an aggressive reporter. Her biggest "investigation" was on the Life & Death Brigade, and Logan handed that to her.

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I agree she probably didn't have the guts to go after big stories which I think was Mitchum's point. Rory probably could write okay but lacked the attitude needed. She seemed to do well editing other people's work and also just taking assignments given to her, like when Doyle has her review the ballet. She could cover an assignment given. She wanted to be a feature writer but maybe that wasn't her calling. Although occasionally we heard of her writing things that were probably her idea. In Come Home where she tries to get a date with Logan to his Dad's party she tells Doyle she just wrote a piece about the dissatisfaction of the faculty with the tenure system. Even if Mitchum read her stuff and thought she was only okay it is just one opinion. With the Life and Death Brigade Rory did pursue that. She researched it and confronted Logan about it. Hunted the story down. He was kind of a jerk about it since they keep outsiders away from the group. The only way she would of got an upclose look would of been for him to invite her along. Of course it wasn't that hard to go after stories happening at your own school in general. Paris one time stole a Ravbis flip flops.

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