MovieChat Forums > Memento (2001) Discussion > Not sure why people can't accept the fac...

Not sure why people can't accept the fact Teddy spoke the truth...


I mean it's right here in Nolan's own words that Teddy was telling the truth and that Leonard was confabulating his butt off:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memento_(film)#Interpretations_and_analysis
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confabulation

Why so much debate? No matter how manipulative/deceitful/whatever Teddy was, even a broken clock get the time right twice a day.

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Because Nolan also said the opposite, that John lied.

Nolan insists he and his brother have never given away the secrets of the film,

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OK, give me a quote of him saying that. I gave one stating the opposite.

Plus the whole nature of confabulation on Lenny's part supports that:
- Dude is forever lost and confused in present time.
- Dude cannot deal with the fact he killed his wife (anterograde amnesia is never 100% clear cut, patients do have occasional "echoes" of things they have done past the onset of their condition, they just can't place them in context or make sense of them)
- Dude admits himself in the end he's willing to lie to himself and kill an innocent (Teddy) to make himself happy.
- Teddy has no reason to lie about things Lenny still knows (wife's diabetes, which would be before the attack, or Sammy Jenkins not being married for Lenny knew him before his injury) since he's well aware Lenny has no retrograde amnesia and thus would call BS on any lie Teddy stated on his past.

What else do you need? He himself (when alone) admits to what Teddy said he's been doing the whole time (confabulating and deliberately altering his facts/clues/evidence/memories to give himself the illusion of purpose).

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Nolan's statements are fairly well-known.

Dude is forever lost and confused

But he can accurately remember his wife as well as Sammy.
He directly states "My wife wasn't diabetic."

Teddy has no reason to lie

He has every reason at the time.
His lies confuse Leonard and allow him to survive.
John has no reason to lie when he says, "I'm a snitch."
If he's a snitch, then he is not a cop.
Also, it makes it clear why John (in the hotel) says, "Why would I have a gun?"

What else do you need? there's a thread about John's character never acting like a police officer, not with Dodd, nor the tattoo lady, nor with dead Jimmy. Leonard never says he 'deliberately altering his facts/clues/evidence/memories", John says something like that. Again, another lie.



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"Nolan's statements are fairly well-known. "

Then you should have no problem coming up with one example. Unless there is none. You brought it up, the burden of proof is on you.

"But he can accurately remember his wife as well as Sammy.
He directly states "My wife wasn't diabetic." "

He can because they are past the injury. And when Teddy insists with "You sure?" Leonard hesitates and we see an "echo" of him indeed delivering insulin to his wife.

So unless he's the most manipulable suggestible person to ever walk the face of Earth, it's obvious Teddy is stating something true (and nope, people with this condition can't be made to misremember their past with a simple suggestion).

"He has every reason at the time.
His lies confuse Leonard and allow him to survive"
- He's not in danger at all, Lenny is not out to kill him and he admits it (how calmly removes the gun from his hands). His obvious lies are simply because others are listening to them at those moments (like Burt the clerk).

"If he's a snitch, then he is not a cop"
He's got an ID and badge, which look legit enough to Lenny, whom as insurance claim officer would be familiar with.

"there's a thread about John's character never acting like a police officer,"
Like a dirty one he sure is.

"Leonard never says he 'deliberately altering his facts/clues/evidence/memories", John says something like that. "
And Lenny does exactly that at the end, framing Teddy in order to have himself kill him.

Don't take my word for it, use your own eyes and look at what Lenny does at the end. You didn't address that...

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the burden of proof is on you.

After twelve years, i don't feel I have to provide proof every time someone new appears when it involves something the wrter or director or actor says. I don't keep links and things. I would never simply put faith in something he says. Goggle it yourself or don't believe it. but if you believe one statement and not the other, why bother discussing it (if Nolan answered everything, which he firmly denies. In fact all of his original films have twists and red herrings. there's always someone or even many who follow red herrings. Look how many people got tricked in the sixth sense.)

we see an "echo" of him indeed delivering insulin to his wife.

Leonard see his past then pictures what John suggests, and dismisses it as false. His memory from before the accident is accurate. Having a form of amnesia does not create fake memories.

He's not in danger at all

He's not in danger? with Leonard threatening to kill him with a gun to his head??? John also feels he isn't in danger right before he gets his brains blown out.

He's got an ID

which Leonard looks at very briefly. If John was 'pretending to be a drug dealer, would he carry a police id? No. Nowhere in the film is it established that he is a real cop. Leonard's report is also suspect. Just because John says it is from him means nothing again. You just believe everything he says, except when he says he's a snitch. When is he working as a cop? Mostly on the phone because he knows Leonard will talk to an officer on the phone, a perfect reason to lie.

framing Teddy in order to have himself kill him.

He does so in order to be angry enough to kill John, stopping him from tricking Leonard into killing innocent people like Jimmy. He seems to not trust John that the real rapist was killed. He didn't 'alter his memories'. he simply used his tattoo to find a John G. Teddy is a John G. Is that simply a coincidence? Why did he lie and call himself Teddy if his real name was John?

he (John) sure is.

There's nothing listed to suggest this. What evidence are you suggesting for this statement. I provided a good bit of evidence to the contrary, which you have tried to ignore with a statement like "he sure is".

look at what Lenny does at the end. You didn't address that

When he shoots John and takes a picture at the end of the story? or when he goes to the tattoo parlor at the end of the film? Address what?

He takes a picture to stop his hunt for John G. John lied when he says that Leonard wants to continue hunting John g forever. There's a lot more to write on this subject but I fear it is above your level and you won't be able to grasp it.

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"After twelve years, i don't feel I have to provide proof"

You do if I can provide contradictory proof. And I just did.

"Leonard see his past then pictures what John suggests, and dismisses it as false. His memory from before the accident is accurate. Having a form of amnesia does not create fake memories."
- That same echo can be seen in the movie BEFORE their confrontation, when he's on the phone with (we assume Teddy) blabbing away about Sammy and that is when Sammy suddenly becomes Lenny at the hospital. So that memory wasn't "created" by Teddy.
- His memory from before has become distorted (the [proof being Sammy's not being remembered as a fake despite failing the conditioning test, which was how he was found out, and that's when he's merged Sammy's memory with his own to offload onto Sammy the wife murdering by insulin). That happens even with normal people, and even Lenny himself states how unreliable memory is (witness identification at trials).
- Google confabulation (I already provided a link to its definition), here's just for you "memory disturbance, defined as the production of fabricated, distorted or misinterpreted memories about oneself or the world, without the conscious intention to deceive.[1] Individuals who confabulate present incorrect memories ranging from "subtle alterations to bizarre fabrications",[2] and are generally very confident about their recollections, despite contradictory evidence". It's fairly typical of people with anterograde amnesia.

"John also feels he isn't in danger right before he gets his brains blown out."
That's a different scene, where Lenny has already lied to himself about Teddy being his wife's killer (which Teddy does not know). Before he did not believe that.

"He does so in order to be angry enough to kill John, stopping him from tricking Leonard into killing innocent people like Jimmy."
Please, had that been the case he would have shot Teddy right then and there. Reaching much?

"He didn't 'alter his memories'. he simply used his tattoo to find a John G."
He burned the picture of Jimmy's body, that's altering what now passes for his memories.

And the rest you can ram up your keister sideways since you're down to condescending and playing dumb ("what's the end?"). I won't bother reading any further reply, but don't let that stop you...

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Me:

I don't feel I have to provide proof every time someone new appears when it involves something the writer or director or actor says. I would never simply put faith in something a director says.


You replied:
I just did

You did not prove he didn't say that 'Teddy lied', a known fact among film fans.
He did say both things, you ignore it. Point won.

Next:
Me:
Leonard threatened to kill him (John) with a gun to his head

You replied: None
Point won.

Next
Me:
John pretends to be a cop on the phone because he knows Leonard will talk to an officer on the phone

You replied: None
Point won.

Next:
Me:
What evidence are you suggesting for stating "He sure is (a cop)"?

You replied: None

You:
Look at what Lenny does at the end.

Me:
He takes a picture of (dead) John Gammell

You: ???
What don't you get about the end of the story?

You:
He's merged Sammy's memory with his own to offload onto Sammy the wife murdering by insulin). That happens even with normal people.


What? That never happens with normal people. Do you believe you've done something that you saw on the news or that happened to someone else you know? Insanity!

You:
He burned the picture of Jimmy's body, that's altering.. his memories.


No, that's forgetting, completely different.

You said some other things as well, all very unclear and vague.
Then you stoop to childish insults because you've lost your entire argument.
I didn't think you would get anywhere, but I gave you a fair chance.
Sorry if you feel humiliated. That wasn't my goal, just trying to reply to you.
Hope some of these answers will help you. Give it some time.


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