Claude and His Dad...Anybody else notice this? *spoilers* - Ken Park (2003) Discussion

[–] 18 years ago

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[–] 18 years ago

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[–] 18 years ago

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[–] gorehound311 17 years ago

...... you can't turn gay. you're born gay.

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[–] imdb_junk 17 years ago

i believe you are correct however Claude may be a heterosexual guy going against his nature because of his father. Surely many gays go against their nature and try het because of manipulation by society or childhood experiences, only realising their true nature (homosexuality) later in life.

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[–] TaintedinaSense 17 years ago

How is that relevant to the movie? Anyways...
Being gay can happen both ways. If a person is raised believing that they are a guy or vise versa..If a person was/is being sexually molested.

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[–] 17 years ago

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[–] IForgetMyUsername 17 years ago

become gay

That's funny. You just go to bed straight one night, when you wake up the following morning... "I think I'm gay."

R.I.P. Chris, Nancy & Daniel Benoit. I hope all three are in a happier place.

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[–] s26197449 16 years ago

he he he :)

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[–] mjkoftool 16 years ago

Being conditioned and a product of your environment is also possible.

A person goes to prison on a 25 year sentence one day and is having sex with a guy the next.

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[–] IForgetMyUsername 16 years ago

A person goes to prison on a 25 year sentence one day and is having sex with a guy the next.

However, I think that's particularly circumstantial. One can't be turned gay. I believe the reason they would have sex with men (if they are, in fact, straight) would be because they have sex drives and "needs" but don't have the option to have sex with women as they are incarcerated with only men.

"But the good news is; the whiskey works." -Bob, Lost In Translation

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[–] 16 years ago

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[–] golden_filament 15 years ago

i disagree.

For every time your gun goes off,a new rebel is born

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[–] stjeff 17 years ago

Molesting as a method of turning people gay is an urban myth that has never been substantiated. That's not to say it has't confused a few people. On the other hand most abusers were abused and that has been proven. So if he was an abuser that would make sense. Just being gay doesn't.

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[–] northern_dirt 17 years ago

Im gay because of molestation..
But not 100% gay.. I just like to shop at Ikea
The sex with guys part never changed..

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[–] c-eriksson82 15 years ago

Your a *beep* idiot...

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[–] 15 years ago

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[–] PoisonKeyblade 15 years ago

That's really interesting and probably true; I got the impression that he was definitely not comfortable with his sexuality.

4 8 15 16 23 42
Live together, die alone.

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[–] IForgetMyUsername 14 years ago

Sneak in the back door, we'll do something, have fun or something.

With that metaphor, he must be gay. Hahaha.

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[–] Viltrumite 13 years ago

"You can choose your friends, but not your family". The irony of the dad's statement completely eluded him. As if anyone would choose a father like that.

"Why do you say this to me when you know I will kill you for it?"

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[–] crushstation 17 years ago

I didn't notice that, but I will watch it again

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[–] born_with 17 years ago

yea I noticed too, and wondering the same thing...

But anyway.. I think claude's dad is gay, but because he's old school and never got out of the closet, he ended up marrying a woman. But over the years it's getting more and more difficult for him to hold down his real fealings, and as a result he ends up molesting his son.

I dont think claude is gay, but he has a open view on sexuality and dont have any problems having a treesome with his two friends..

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[–] rationalandpsyched2 17 years ago

He was never shown actually doing anything with Sean... just Peaches taking turns.
(Unless I'm wrong.)

I am pretty sure it was a guy on the phone as well, but not 100%.

I also assumed that it was his dad's first time pulling something like that because he was drunk and seemingly at rock bottom and also how he kept saying Claude looked like his mother.

I don't think it had happened before because I don't think Claude would have stood for it, and also he was defensive about being called a fairy, because he wasn't completely gay (maybe he was just "Utopian"...)

Ya'll ever think that Larry Clark left it ambiguous on purpose? Ha.

(pS. Yes I know people can hide things, but I feel as though this film was meant to show climactic revelations rather than to hide anything.)

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[–] 17 years ago

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[–] bb602797 17 years ago

I think he was talking to a girl. He said the name Robin. i know that could be either. Maybe that was Larry clark being ambiguous again.

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[–] honeypeach 17 years ago

it's been proven that some people are "born" gay and some people "choose"/"become" gay. I don't feel like arguing it, but both have been shown to happen, so whatevs.

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[–] thecyberwasp 17 years ago

Proven by who? When?

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[–] illmatic718 17 years ago

It's like when the dad is drunk in the car and he's like "sam's a guy's name." and his friend says it could be both.

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[–] electrique 17 years ago

Maybe he's bi... (Meaning Claude not his father)
I'm surprised no one has come up with that.
Le temps détruit tout.

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[–] n_lien21 17 years ago

You guys are missing the entire point...
Claude's sexual preference really doesn't matter! The point of this movie is that sex serves as an escape for these kids. It doesn't matter if it's sex with a guy or a girl or both; it's still sex, and just that.

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[–] electrique 17 years ago

People interpret movies in different ways...
You're right though his preference wouldn't have affected the movie at all.

Le temps détruit tout.

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[–] clemenceforester 17 years ago

interesting observation about leg hair etc, I don't think the sex of the kid on the phone is important I think the point is that Claude and his Father are both lonely, but the theme I saw was that of the parents abusing their power by treating their children inappropriately either due to their own issues or using them to serve their own needs (sexual etc):
Claude clipping his mothers toenails
Shawn's girl's Mum using Shawn for sex

the thematic veins in Ken Park aren't simple though, Tate is difficult, His parents abuse by neglect maybe? They simply aren't there, what happened to them? Who cares they simply aren't.

I think my favorite was Ken Park himself, his girlfriend asks 'arent you glad your mother didn't abort you?' bringing to light the fact that sometimes it would be unfair to have a child and people still do, which ultimately, is the first abuse, a selfish act, bringing a child into a world that is unsuitable for it, to parents (or parent) who are unsuitable. And Ken aborts himself. I liked that.

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[–] nfaust1 17 years ago

I don't understand the question about Claude being gay. It never occurred to me that he's gay. If he's gay, wouldn't it be clear in the final threesome?

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[–] lstnsublime 17 years ago

I agree, I think Clark would have made it clear in the threesome.

I also dont think Claude's dad was necessarily gay. I think he just wanted to be close with his son and in his drunken stupor thought that maybe if he attempted to be what he thought his son was and approach him that way his son would be closer to him.

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[–] lovecharlotteshannon 17 years ago

i don't understand why you guy's think claude is gay and why you think it was a guy on the phone??

I didn't get any clue that it was a guy on the other end of the phone, and as for the hair stroking thing i totally noticed that too! I also didn't feel that claude was gay?? As for the moron who sad he was turned gay, get a grip you don't just wake up one day andthink "well i think i'll be gay today!" its a preference your born with, some people can be open minded to explore both male and female relations but you are ultimately born gay thats my opinion on that anyway! :)

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[–] chuckmeister94 17 years ago

how can he be gay?! he *beep* that girl at the end!

DON'T FXCK WITH CHUCK

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[–] Mystt 16 years ago

and why you think it was a guy on the phone??
I didn't get any clue that it was a guy on the other end of the phone

He called the person on the other end of the phone "Man" and "Dude" Both those terms were used in such a way to imply he was talking to a male and not just using slang in conversation.

Shop smart. Shop S-Mart.

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[–] MissLisa1970 16 years ago

as a mother i hear my kids calling anyone dude, man, dawg or niga (take that censors!) matters not if one is male or female...hell even i've been called "dude" a time or two by a kid.

as far as the leg hair pulling, i believe this was shown to prove the point that this had happened before. Claude was pulling his leg hair when on the phone and his dad did the same to him when he snuck into his room.

few things to suggest his father was gay
Some closet homosexuals go out of their way to name call someone else they think is also homosexual. thus the reason why he picked on claude so much and called him names. however, when the skateboard breaking scene was over, you can clearly tell that he was upset at the things he had said to his son.
When out with his friend, he wasn't interested in picking up any of the women seen on the street. any other red necked beer swilling drunk man wouldve in a heart beat!
The fact that his wife (claude's mother) basicially looked like a man herself, with the butchered hair and no makeup.
these are a few of the things i picked up, i could be over analyzing but hey, it was brought up here by another poster, and i was indeed thinking along the same lines.

as far as claude's sexuality, i would assume he is bi-sexual...to my knowledge from what i've heard from my daughters and from their friends, there are quite alot of bi kids out there, experimenting with whatever they can just because they can..so claude's being bi sexual is certainly not unheard of.

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[–] zarathustra_777 16 years ago

I totally missed the part where the girlfriend asks if he's glad he wasnt aborted! The version I saw starts with him walking into the park and shooting himself, without dialogue.

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[–] Mystt 16 years ago

missed the part where the girlfriend asks if he's glad he wasnt aborted!

Its not at the beginning. Its the very last scene of the movie.

Shop smart. Shop S-Mart.

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[–] russtray 16 years ago

The suicide takes place in the beginning, the dialougue about Ken not being aborted is at the end...

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[–] viamber 13 years ago

It was at the very end of the movie, zara. After the narrator tells us that Ken's girlfriend was pregnant.

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[–] generouspalmstroke 13 years ago

Yeah I liked this scene too, because not only is Sam a unisex name but so is Robin, the name of the person Claude was talking to on the phone.

I personally think it was another boy Claude was talking to on the phone, but like many posters here said it doesn't really matter either way the gender of Robin.

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[–] [deleted] a year ago

His dad was really pathetic, a fat, unemployed, child-molester alcoholic piece of shit, who's contantly trying to prove his manliness while struggling to even bench press 135 lbs. The role was a great caricature.

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[–] spikaia 16 years ago

He was flirting with a guy over the phone.

**********
"I hold a PhD in Horribleness. See ya in the aftermath! PEACE!... but not...literally"

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[–] russtray 16 years ago

I noticed the same thing and have to agree.

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[–] velocirrober 15 years ago

I don't think Claude is bisexual. He is just being happy having sex with whomever. Shawn is his friend, and friends mess around sometimes like this. And that doesn't make them gay or bisexual... eventually, they will stop doing it together.

Even if Claude is bisexual, I don't think he knows it just yet.

About the leg hairs... I know (because I was one, and had friends as well) that teenage males, when they start growing facial and body hair, are so proud of it, that they often touch it, and feel it. When I was in junior high I knew many guys that had a few hairs on their upper lip and they would play with them all day long... Same thing with hairs on the chin, arms, upper chest, legs, etc.

As for the father... Maybe he's gay, maybe he's just desperate because of his very pregnant wife, but I think he sees the hairy legs as a symbol of his son being all grown and full of hormones. He is probably attracted to him...

The other possibility regarding the father is that he is so insecure about his son growing up and becoming a man, that the only way he (the father) can feel he is still the alpha male in the family is by mounting him. This also relates to his challenging him when they are lifting weights, and harassing him to the point of breaking his skateboard.

Anyway... I have thought about this before, but since the thread calls for it, I am changing my signature today:

It's OK, Claude... it's me... Dad...
-Ken Park

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