I have always thought that Lucifer is Satan, but that it is just two different names.
After reading here though, I'm not so sure, so I was hoping someone could give me a summary about what is right and what is wrong? And if they are not the same "creature", who are they, and why is it commong knowledge that Satan and Lucifer is the same beeing?
God has Dissociative Identity Disorder. It's all him. He's an evil sonuvabitch, that God of ye olde bible.
shareLots of fairy tale talk here.
Yoda has it pretty dead on in terms of what Lucifer is and what he is not.
While even that can be considered a fairy tale by atheists and what not... lets just go with the assumption that we all believe in the prophets and the patriarchs and all that good stuff in the bible.
There is no such thing as Lucifer as the name of the Devil.
One part of the bible talking about a contemporary king was mistranslated into being called Lucifer.
Then in later revisions of the bible the editor took the view that the passage didnt mean a contemporary king but that it meant the Devil.
So if it that was the devil, then he could put Lucifer as the name in whatever other passage the bible was talking about the Devil.
That is why you have Genesis calling the devil Lucifer.
Its all retroactive editing.
Here is the fast and loose meaning of the bible when it comes to the Devil...
Satan is the balance.
The other side of the coin.
The opposite force to the force of Jesus if you will.
While Jesus role is to defend us and steer us in the right way, Satans role is to show us the opposite way via temptation, and then accuse us for falling into his trap.
Both are needed to keep gods balance.
Thats his job though, god appointed job.
Just like you cant fault Jude for what he did when he sold out Jesus, it was his destiny right, he had no choice... he had to sell out Jesus in order for things to pass as they were supposed to pass.
And who helped this happen? Exactly!
Without Satan there would be no Jesus dying on the cross.
Now in terms of names and what not... that ones easy.
Satan and all its derivatives is the Hebrew name.
Satan, Satanael, Satanel, etc... all are basically transliterations of the word accuser in Hebrew.
Devil and all its derivatives is the Greek name.
Devil, Diablo, Diabolos, etc... all are basically transliterations of the word accuser in Greek.
Lucifer is of course pure Roman/Catholic invention... kinda like Emperor Palpatine from Star Wars or Voldermort from Harry Potter or Morgoth from LOTR.
Actually he isnt like them, he like ALL of them, because thats what the terms Lucifer, Devil, and Satan became in the Catholic church.
By holy decree of Rome, all gods that were not the official god of the Holy Roman Empire were classified as Devils.
Anything bad, anything they didnt like = Devil/Satan/Lucifer.
So when you read the word Lucifer in your bible, remember that originally it never said that... the word was added much much later by the Roman Catholic church.
The funny thing is that the literal translation for the word Lucifer is actually a matchstick.
The Romans used the Greek word Phosphorus when coming up with their Lucifer word, and Phosphorus simply a combination of the word light and the word bringer.
And what is one of the best tools to bring light ? ... The match.
Which has traditionally been made mostly out of what? .... Phosphorus.
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Simply put, Satan = Hebrew for adversary. It is not a name so much as a title. It is not specific to Lucifer i.e. the fallen angel
share^^^ best answer. thx.
edit: actually, i take that back--just wikipedia lucifer and there's plenty of explanations. fascinating subject...makes me wonder if they can get so confused about lucifer/satan/devil how has time and misinterpretations corrupted the bible and jesus. haha.
Hang on a mimute......
Jude (Judah?) had no choice? It was his destiny?
I thought man was supposed to have free will.
Everyone except him, huh?
Strange.
And to answer the above comment, YES. The bible has a lot of things messed up. Like Jesus' name for starters. The name of the person you are thinking of is Yeshua, son of Yusef. There are many translations of Christ. There's the greek translation, the herbrew translation...... Everyone will tell you it means something different. One meaning is "The Annointed" It's a title, not a name.
This means at least two things:
1) saying "Thank Christ!!" as an expletive is no taking the lords name in vain (to christians)
2) If you're going to be so free with names, why not worship Brad Pitt? Not the movie star, but the one who died on the cross for our sins, then was re-born..... (i'm taking the piss here, just pointing out that if you're going to go ahead and change names in the bible, especially of the 'protagonist', then why not REALLY change it)
Interesting . . .
I'm actually writing a book on spirituality, and Satan is "kinda" a main character but whatever. I think that the two names are the same person. He simply had a "name change" due to the "fact" that he rebelled against God resulting in the beginning of holy war. He didn't want to carry the name this creator gave him. So he demanded people call him what he wants and not what God wants.
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To translate from Hebrew, using the Oxford English-Hebrew dictionary...
"Satan" = devil, fiend
"HaSatan" = The Devil ("ha" the letter "hey", means "the")
"ohyev, yariv" = adversary
"Hilel" = to praise, commend, glorify
"-el" = God ("elohim") names that end in "-el" mean "of god" (gabriel - god's strength, Daniel - God's Judgement)
NB: Lucifer is NOT hebrew, it's Latin.
I'm Israeli, and I study Tanach (Torah) in school. HaSatan is the constant tempter (or, adversary, if you want) throughout the old testament. It's really so easy to write on these posts if you have an exam on it next week
"Satan is the Christian Devil. Lucifer is an older pagan god."
What? Satan is the JEWISH devil, later adapted by Christianity (no, that's not and insult to Christians, chill out) "pagan" is a broad, broad term for any not set religion, later connected to polytheism(multi-godism). polytheists had all those many many gods.
"In Hebrew, 'Satan' is still an angel"
PLEASE don't translate if you don't actually SPEAK the language.
But yeah, other wise cool.
Anne Rice is brilliant, I just read Interview with the Vampire for the first time, awesome! But yeah don't believe everything a fantasy fiction author writes.
|"He's the Sun God,|
|He's the fun God, |
|Yay Ra! " |
|LOL LOVE IT!!!! |
but seriously, look it up yourself... try, if you can, get a translated Torah, it's the best to work from (most unedited, let's say?).
And yeah, I'm certain on everything I've posted here.
(and please, no hate posts... they're too boring)
Wikipedia :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer
Language explanation of Lucifer :
http://www.crivoice.org/lucifer.html
Morman explanation of Lucifer :
http://www.lds-mormon.com/lucifer.shtml
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***Funniest part of all this? about a month ago I chose to not believe. I believe in being a good person, and it works out well for everyone. Weird, huh?
Um ,
Satan-" Adversary " or " Accuser "
HaSatan-" The Adversary " or " The Accuser "
Correct, and he's not the "Jewish devil" -- there is no Jewish devil. He's an agent of God who, at God's direction only, tests the faith of God's people in very unsavory ways.
In Judaism, everything comes from God -- good and evil alike. There is no demonic source of evil in Judaism as there is in Christianity. There is no devil, in other words. And "ha satan" has nothing at all to do with the snake in the Garden of Eden or the Christian invention of Lucifer.
_Richard
Also,in Hebrew the name is supposed to be pronounced saton,not satan like Christians say it.
Well, according to demonology, Hell is ruled by four kings - Lucifer, Satan, Leviathan and Belial. All representing and element, Earth, Wind, Water and Fire.
When Lucifer and his followers where expelled from heaven, they came up with the ultimate way of getting back at God. Which is to corrupt the minds of men and convince them he doesn't exist. So the four kings built Pandemonium, the capitol city, if you will, of Hell. A place where all demons (Lucifers followers) reside.
So yeah, back to your question, Lucifer and Satan are different beings/angels/demons/kings of hell.
I think Christianity has them as the same person though.
*LAST 3 MOVIES SEEN*
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That idea was actually invented by Christian folklore writers such as Dante and Milton . The Catholic Church later adopted it to add an element of tragedy to the Satan character . It also had the added advantage of demonizing a Pagan hero god . Initially , Lucifer/Satan was portrayed as a tragic anti-hero . However , later interpretations transformed him into the ultimate supervillain , the lord of all things evil . Fun Fact : Before this change occurred , a number of holy men were named Lucifer particularly in the Latin countries .
share- After reading here though, I'm not so sure
Well, read some literature, that will help, cause you just saw a film where Gabriel was the bad guy, and Lucifer saved the day =S
" Look, there's two women fuc*ing a polar bear!" - Fear And Loathing in Las Vegas 1998
Hopefully clears things up.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer
"what's with all the cigarette butts?"
"I’m building a collection"
There isn't really any right or wrong answer. There are so many different variations of this character and his story. But keep in mind that most of the cultural depictions of the devil and his history don't come from Biblical sources.
share