Here is this young man suddenly saddled with 4 kids to care for, including a baby!!
I loved this show, but I thought the other kids were often lazy and dumped it all on Charlie.
"I'd say this cloud is Cumulo Nimbus."
"Didn't he discover America?"
"Penfold, shush."
What kids aren't lazy? Especially in the USA? We're all spoiled here and not only were the Salingers spoiled they lived in SF. The cost of living in San Francisco is a nightmare. They didn't really show that aspect of the town, it takes a hella lot of dinero to live there in the heart of the city. Even if their parents left them a nice nest egg (which wasn't the case) they would have had to make big bucks just to pay off the taxes each year for that gigantic home. I suppose we can write that off to big money coming into the restaurant but they never really suggested that was the case either.
Besides, Charlie had many many difficult times just trying to control that houseful of kids. He wasn't much more than a kid himself. Charlie became quite a nightmare himself when he ran into his health problem.
I've only seen the first season so far, but Charlie really hasn't been the pillar of responsibility. He seems torn between two directions. His old partying life vs. guardian role.
Yes, the kids sometimes get out of hand, but there is a reason the kids give him a hard time.
Somebody stop the world. I'm scared and I want to get off.
True, but what young man would immediately take on a fatherly role after both parents had died? I'd say a small percentage of boys/young men could handle that kind of tragedy and immediate responsibility. Charlie's youth was stolen without any choice other than to become the one in charge. All five of the party wound up making mistakes just like any normal kid would. The problem with them was they had almost no adults to help guide them through their mistakes.
shareYes at times they were brats but they did love each other and its true Charlie's life certainly changed after the deaths of their parents.
shareI thought Charlie was an ass when I initially watch the show back in the day when it was on. Watching it now as the age that Charlie was when he took on the responsibility of raising his siblings, I can see why he was an ass. He was really young and had to put his youth on hold and become a father and run a restaurant. I couldn't imaging taking that on in my 20's.
shareHe wasn't young! He was 24, that's not a young kid by any stretch. Many people have long since started their own families by that age. So no, in that regard, I don't think he got shafted. Now having to go from just looking after himself to looking after four siblings? That would not be easy and I think his character handled it well. I also think his parents left them a really large chunk of money. The fact that they can write checks and spend money with very little consequence pretty much makes that clear. And the restaurant may not be bringing in a ton of money, but it's steady income. They don't have a mortgage, that's mentioned in the first season.
share24 is still a baby. Just because some people marry that young doesn't make them more mature than others, far from it. And young men are generally much more immature than women at any age. So yes, Charlie had a hard time of it but it took all of them to make that household work.
The fact that they wrote checks and spent money is just typical television fantasy. Countless series had/have the cast living on peanuts yet living high on the hog. That American fantasy has been delivered on the boobtube for decades. The city of San Francisco isn't just difficult, its nearly impossible to live there without a big wallet and/or income, mortgage or not. Even if there was no mortgage the property taxes alone would be staggering. The cost of just living in that town is outrageous. Its almost comparable to living in the city of New York. The restaurant HAD to be generating lots and lots of money.
The Salinger home sold for over 6 million dollars at the turn of the century. Little (closer to NONE) of that value is from Party of Five, its that the home had many more improvements than seen in the series. Either way the property would have still been valued at well over 4 million as seen in the television series. Just toy with the taxes on that monster. The Salinger kids would have to scrape up plenty of money just to pay off the yearly tax bill, let alone all other costs of surviving with three very young children who have zero income. They never described a big fat will from mom and dad though they had to have left something with such a huge financial structure in place before they died.
Regarding your comments about San Francisco? YEP!! I've lived here since I was a child, and the cost of living is outrageous... I make a decent living as a professional librarian, have no kids (just pets) or revolving debts, and can barely afford the rent on my 1br apartment. :-(
FYI - The Zillow estimate on their home (exterior shots were filmed at 2311 Broadway Street) is a whopping $8,272,667 today - so even in the mid-90s it would have been worth a pretty penny. Here's the Zillow page for that home: http://www.zillow.com/homes/2311-broadway,-san-francisco-ca_rb/
If this were a real life situation, they would have sold that house within months of the parents' deaths, and bought something more reasonable in a less expensive neighborhood. For those who don't know SF, they were in one of the swankiest parts of town! Then they could invest the remaining cash, and use that to cover living expenses, tuitions, etc.
Similar thing happened to my friends who were twin sisters, and lost both parents by their late 20s... the parents didn't have much "cash," but did own outright a mansion in Hillsborough (extremely rich suburb south of SF) with a couple acres of property. The girls sold it within a year for around $10M, and I assume split the profits. Sadly, one of THEM died of cancer just recently, leaving the other twin as their only surviving family member. No amount of money can replace a family.
lolo, i just visited san francisco in may from NC. I visited the salinger house (oddly enough the mrs. doubtfire house is literally right around the corner). I probably would've moved from pacific heights to mission or noe valley. That neighborhood didn't suit them.
sharelolo, i just visited san francisco in may from NC. I visited the salinger house (oddly enough the mrs. doubtfire house is literally right around the corner).
Both of those house are towards the end of broadway. That house looks twice as big in person.
share24 is still a baby. Just because some people marry that young doesn't make them more mature than others, far from it. And young men are generally much more immature than women at any age. So yes, Charlie had a hard time of it but it took all of them to make that household work.
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Only a very young person would say 24 is "all grown up" - LOL. As a 36 year-old myself, I can tell you it IS practically a child! I'm still not mature or stable enough to care for 4 kids etc, and would have failed miserably attempting that 12+ years ago. Oh, and I live in the San Francisco area (lived in SF itself for a number of years), so I also understand the cost of this region.
shareMy husband and I just got a new cable service and found seasons 1-3 of POF on its streaming service. Thus, I watched a couple episodes this morning.
It's funny, when the show first came on, I never really took Charlie's plight too seriously. I, too, was young, had young children and, therefore, just saw his responsibilities as a mere plot device. Flash forward too many years ahead(haha), and two of my own children are now Charlie's age. I CANNOT imagine either of them (both responsible, but 24 and 25) having to deal with his plate.
The following is dialogue from the episode that dealt with Charlie and Kirsten's wedding-that-never-was. Hearing it again, today, really made me feel sorry for him. It's like it all just got away from him, and the wedding was just the culmination of that greater problem.
KIRSTEN BENNETT: "You're scared. Well, hello...Yes, it's scary. I'm scared, too. Getting married is scary. You're panicked. Well, who isn't the morning of their wedding? But, you make a choice. You either decide that it's second thoughts, or if you love me, Charlie, you decide that it's nervous anticipation and you go back downstairs. And when the minister asks 'Do you take this woman?', you say 'I do'."
CHARLIE SALINGER: "No! No, you don't understand! I say that and I'm married, and I will be with the last woman I'm ever going to have and that I've got all the kids that I'm ever gonna have. And, I live in my father's house. And every day I go to my father's job at the restaurant. And any one of those things on their own, I can deal with, but...you add them up, Kirsten. The wife and the kids and the house and the job...and that's every decision that I'm ever gonna make in my life! I've got no choices left! I'm 25 years old and I know my whole life."
If you think about it, the kids - especially Bailey and Julia - were incredibly ungrateful. Yes Charlie slipped up and made a lot of mistakes but the alternative was social services splitting them all up to live in foster care
I'm gonna die of long hair!
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When I was a teen watching the show on TV, I probably thought Charlie was an ass... but boy was I wrong. Watching this show again at age 30, I realize that Charlie was a godsend. Definitely got shafted. He was my favourite character on this show by a mile!
And I`m not going to place any blame on Bailey, Claudia and certainly not Owen. They were kids themselves and tbh, have done plenty for their family. Especially Bailey. I agree that Bailey may have acted ungrateful at times, but he took on a lot himself and at 16. I think he deserves a ton of credit as well.
As for Julia... I`ll just refer you to my Julia rant in one of the other threads. Worst character ever? I think so.
Kind of but I thought he was a selfish jerk a lot of the time too.
shareI know this is old. But I just finished watching the series again. I agree. Charlie was young to have four children. Yes,some people have children as teenagers or in their early twenties. However,that does not mean they are grown up. It just means they have grown up responsibilities. I just can't figure out why they kept saying Bailey was the one that did everything for the family. He gave up his college money and that was all he did in my opinion. Him taking Owen was just not practical. He could have come over to the house and did helped him with his homework. So I seriously can't figure out why the writers kept writing it in that Bailey was basically the care giver. I'm not missing anything because I watched the series straight through and didn't watched anything else. Maybe someone else knows.
shareI agree. Charlie was the one who always held that family together while Bailey was off getting drunk or bouncing between women, sure Charlie had his share of women, but he never abandoned the family to go off with one and he was always stable when Kirsten was in his life, they always yelled at Charlie and called him the screw-up, but Bailey and Julia were the worst and the most selfish people ever. Charlie never got the credit he deserved.
shareFully agree with you. I think Baily being a cute guy allowed him to get away with sh!t that others wouldn't have. Same with Julia.
shareYes without question
I didn't always like Charlie but he missed out on a lot. I'm 32 never been married and no kids. I would be a disaster if my parents died and I had to deal with 4 kids. The finale was sad because his 3 siblings leave to start a new life and you can tell he's happy for them but I'm sure that would also sting that he never really got to do it himself.
Currently rewatching the series. I think Julia and Bailey didn't really respect Charlie as a parental person. At 15/16 I think its normal to try to push the rules. They are looking at Charlie as the cool older brother. I think the problem is that Charlie is not consistent in the parent aspect with them... Only when they are doing something that is already a major problem.
For example - Julia gets detention and needs the slip signed how many teenagers do you know who would just volunteer that information to their parents with out some sort of diversion?
I think Claudia was often ignored. Can you imagine being 11 and be left to do whatever and then Charlie (or the other two) steps in when things get out of control. Of course she going to find it hard to think of Charlie as the parental figure and listen to him. She seems to only get any attention when things go wrong or when really annoying/seeking attention.
For example, when Claudia starts JR high she doesn't want to go back to school because of the height issue. Of course she not going to just come out and say why. However, Charlie takes it as her just not want to listen and doesn't see a bigger problem. He think sulks that no one respects him as a parent. I remember faking ill because of issues in JR high so I don't think her feelings/actions are unusual. I would think that Kristin could have help more in that area to steer Charlie in the right direction.
Also, when Charlie gets sick Claudia starts skipping school but its no different then Julia or Bailey at that age. They don't seem to remember that at all.
I think when Bailey and Julia are over 18 they should be more mature and help Charlie out more.
Overall, I think he gets shafted because he has to become a responsible grownup with out guidance from other parents.
Based on everyone's replies I think everyone is failing to realize that the other kids AREN'T lazy and that Charlie is in fact the lazy one. When the show starts the parents have been gone already 6 months (I believe). That means it took him 6 months to decide to move in and do what he should have done from the start. THIS is why the other kids don't treat him with respect.
I think Bailey was the one carrying everything from the get-go. It seemed like Charlie dropped in now and then but wasn't really involved. The other kids fell into a "routine" and got into a comfortable way of life and then Charlie decided to show up and act like he suddenly cared and wanted tell them what to do, but at first caused more problems then he solved (i.e. just taking a check and losing thousands.) He wasn't even willing to step up and get a real job at first.
It took him a long while to mature and really act in that "parent" role, and his failure to do so adequately to begin with resulted in what the kids did and got away with.