Tickerage, I have to ask are you gay? I only ask because if that's you in your avatar it's a dead giveaway, it screams "I'M GAY!" I don't say that to put you down, I'm gay myself. I just think you saw what you wanted to see based on bad personal experiences - because yes, on the surface it might look that way because in a way gays are looked at as second class citizens in certain parts of the world and the U.S. even so that internal victimization that a lot of us carry around might be what you're projecting onto the screen. And to be honest, that's too easy especially for a movie of this caliber.
My interpretation of that scene is as follows: Ouisa goes to make sure Paul is awake and is caught by surprise and up until that point she thought she knew all that she possibly could about Paul and regardless of who Paul found attractive she trusted him as a guest, a guest that she didn't know from Adam, in her home. She felt like a fool and was scared on top of it because what if he wasn't who he said he was (which would turn out to be true) and that that man was his crime partner there to help rip them off? And she didn't know if anyone else was in the house either. Burglaries go wrong all the time and people end up dead. What if she thought that was the person who stabbed Paul? He did have a knife on him.
What does living in Manhattan have to do with anything? Yes New York City is "liberal" but two out of the three mayors it's had in 20 years have been Republican. And yes, they make their living in the art world but they don't witness or have seen any of the LGBT people they do business with have sex either it's strictly business. And they weren't living in the Chelsea neighborhood. These people are sheltered. We're all sheltered in some way. That's the whole point of this movie - that we're all hypocrites and "phonies" not on purpose, even the most so called "open-minded" people are just as judgemental if not moreso than the rest of us. Take the rich kids they hated their parents for shallow reasons acting like they received a raw deal in life while not earning a thing. At the end Ouisa was finally liberated despite having money and all the material possessions she could buy it wasn't feeding her soul. It finally clicked for her in the end with or without Flan.
Look at Cher, one of the biggest gay icons of all time, she made a career off the backs of gays ala the pink dollar but when her daughter came out as a lesbian (long before becoming a man), Cher flipped out. It's different when it's your own child. Take your parents, you love them and support them when they need it but you also know that you exist because they had sex and you don't want to think about that much less walk in on them doing it, right?
I also think you're dead wrong trying to justify a guest bringing in another guest without permission from the host(s) that's disrespectful and rude. Growing up my brother used to invite his friends over all the time, sometimes just walking in like they owned the place - no knocking, ringing the doorbell, eating us out of house and home until finally my parents had to lay down the law because my brother couldn't say no to his loser friends, some I didn't even know so they were "strangers" to me. Take it from me it's infuriating. Unless it happens to you you have no clue what you're talking about. It also tells us what kind of person you are, good or bad.
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Tickerage
10 years ago
Okay, Ouisa could have been scared by a stranger in her home. BUT who barges in on the bedroom of a sleeping guest?!? Protocol dictates that knocking until someone answers is standard and being a Manhattan art dealer's wife, she would know this. At that point in the story there is absolutely no reason to assume that Paul or his lover were there to rip them off or steal from them in any way whatsoever. Why on earth would she think that the person who stabbed Paul would be sleeping with him? That's just silly.
You do have a point that everybody in Manhattan isn't necessarily as enlightened as I might have said. But, for God's sake, "An Unmarried Woman" was 15 years earlier and the players, also on the Upper East Side, certainly would have treated a gay man and his lover if not with respect than at least an acknowledgement that Okay this exists and moved on without hysterics.
Keep my avatar out of this. If it looks "gay" to you, well, I fail to see what exactly that has to do with my opinions or my comments. I have a right to express my legitimate opinions on here as does everybody else and if you think personal attacks enhance the opinions of yourself then you obviously have been away from both academia and personal achievement for too long and it speaks volumes about your lack of substance and actual points.
At least there will be plenty implied.
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HaddonfieldMemorial
10 years ago
She didn't exactly barge in and he was expected to be awake and dressed already, he had to be up early. And her mindset was that he was still asleep and she didn't know if he was a heavy sleeper or not so if he overslept she would've felt guilty about it because she felt it was her responsibility not only as a mother but as a host to make sure he was awake. Oh and it was HER house, she could do whatever she wanted. Case closed.
Because, she doesn't know him from Adam, how did she know that they weren't in on it or maybe Paul's attacker got in the house and tried to kidnap him, blackmail him or finish what he started? Quisa didn't know anything so her mind was going a thousand miles a minute. She wasn't thinking clearly. That whole night was like a dream evening catered to and made perfect by a complete stranger so nothing was entirely "protocol" was it? It wasn't a typical evening for them. Also, being a Manhattan art dealer's wife had nothing to do with anything.
You're assuming she's anti-gay because she freaked out about a STRANGER inviting another STRANGER into her home.
Hey, I used your avatar to ask if that's you and if you were gay. Because it has everything to do with your argument because you're gay so you're more sensitive to her reaction nobody else is agreeing with you, including myself who's gay. Did I say you didn't have a right to express yourself and your opinions? You're being defensive for no reason at all. Perhaps it has something to do with our interactions on the Meredith Vieira board but regardless you seem to have a chip on your shoulder and a lot of pent up hostility. Life is beautiful once you stop caring about the foolish things. Personal attacks? From the one who bashes Meredith Vieira? I guess it's ok because she's not there to defend herself. Get a grip. Your hypocrisy speaks volumes about you academia and accomplishments or not, the very things you're accusing me of you're doing the very same thing. See a reflection of yourself? Glad I could help bring you to the forefront. Nobody likes it when they're the ones being criticized.
The problem with you is that you think you're better and smarter than everyone else. How is that working out for you? Because I see a bitter, shallow old man dying alone with nobody and nothing to show for it at the end of the day. And our community is a lonesome place as it is. It's not too late to find happiness and purpose. I leave you with that.
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Tickerage
10 years ago
HaddonfieldMemorial, I knew you'd respond within the day. Back off. Jack off to my avatar that you're obsessed with on two imdb boards and get it over with.
This is a site about media. We react to and profess our opinions about the field. List EXAMPLES of what you are referring to or have issues with. That is what intelligent conversation is all about. Morons like you try to make everything personal. You had no counterexamples to what I said here or on the other board, so you stray way off into attacking me for my avatar. It looks "gay" to you, so I must be gay, with all the negative hangups that you aspire to that realm of humanity.
Trying to dime-store analyze me based upon a picture that apparently intrigues you is the highest form of laziness in regards to movie critique.
Of course it was Ouisa's house. Could she do "whatever she wanted"? Well, no. She couldn't have murdered Paul. If she didn't "know him from Adam" then why did she invite him to stay? The whole point of this movie was that Paul was so charming and disarming that they knew him better in one night than they knew their own children.
You've told me multiple times that you are gay. I don't care. I'm not going to say either way because these forums are about points and I stand upon my arguments. You wear your otherness on a sleeve and try to project that onto me. My points stand for themselves. There's nothing wrong with being a gay man. But your campaign to pigeonhole me based upon your assertion that I am gay, therefore xxxxxxxx, says more about you than it does about me.
At least there will be plenty implied.
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HaddonfieldMemorial
10 years ago
I respond when I see fit. Looks like your intuition is off seeing as though it's been a week and a half. And you posted your avatar, so expect people to comment on it positive or negative. I don't jack off to bean pole twinks. Sorry.
LOL you made it personal because you're gay and you see anti-gay sentiments from the female lead character. You still don't even see your own flawed logic that you repeatedly keep tripping over and I don't have forever and a day to explain it to but I also find it funny, yet typical how fast you became hostile and started throwing out insults. You already lost by resorting to juvenile behavior. And no sh-t this place is discuss media, who'd a thunk? I never attacked you, did I say "you look ugly/deformed"? No, I just said/implied that you looked effeminate and you do, and if you are there's nothing wrong with that, did I say there was? No. I know my own "people" (fellow gays) when I see them. And that's your underlying argument, you're gay so you saw something that wasn't there because of your sexuality just admit it. You haven't denied that you're gay so I must be right. Gee, I guess I'm not such a moron after all now am I?
Intrigues me? I've seen selfies before. But the fact that you like the golden age of Hollywood and are obsessed with actresses from the 40s onward and that avatar tells me everything. Still you never denied that you're gay.
She still didn't know him, the guy charmed them and dropped their kids' names. He was still a stranger no matter how well they "knew" him for one night.
At least I can admit that I'm gay. Yes, this place is to argue and discuss points but when you're gay and accuse the main character of being anti-gay it becomes personal and you're drawing on your own personal experiences more so than if a straight person pointed it out. Don't be mad at me for figuring you out so effortlessly. Where did I say there was anything wrong with being a gay man? You're so defensive it's quite scary. I never meant any malicious intent. But I see I've upset you enough and clearly there can't be a civil conversation when only one person is being civil.
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