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Does anyone else think that Season 9 is one of the best seasons?

posted 8 years ago by ClayGorgon
22 replies | jump to latest

I just find that there's something special about this season.

Seemingly devoid of conflict, it's one of the coziest and most relaxing.
Now that the characters have settled, the show sports a more domestic groove.
The humor is more subtle, but it's ever-present.

What I like about it:The writing, of course,the focus on the family dynamic, but also the characterization- it's fantastic.

Even the simplest family scenes throughout this season gain resonance and meaning- such as Frasier and Martin's joined hunt for a cricket, or Martin's and Daphne's looking through Niles' childhood memorabilia, or Niles playing cards with Mrs. Moon.

The attention to detail is excellent.
Just one of many examples:

In Don Juan in Hell, Daphne says to Frasier- "when you love someone you have to feel it in your gut", and you see a queasy Niles in the background rushing to the restroom.

All the trademarks of the show are in full display- the farce of The Proposal , the brothers' rivalry in Sharing Kirby, the quirkiness of Deathtrap

Frasier's attempt to stick up for his father, even though born out of a misguided notion(we all know how ridiculous Frasier can be) in Bully for Martin ,
their normal family feuds realized in the fantastic Bla-Z-Boy, as well as the brothers' attempt to retrieve Frasier's 2000th tape in the superbly ironic The Two Hundredth , and Frasier having one of his usual ego trips in
A Room Full of Heroes.

The Cranes continue to entertain weirdos, only now from their joined clan- Lilith's half-brother in Wheels of Fortune ], and Daphne's family in Motherlode.

If anything, this season is sort of a like lesser, more dramatic season 6, but now with Niles and Daphne together.

I only really don't like War of the Words and the Cheers episode.
Frasier Has Spokane was also forgettable.

Even the regrettable Guilt Trippers is not too bad outside of the ending.

Part of the appeal for me, is that I've actually grown to like both Gertrude and Simon-they're not bad characters.

I also like Kirby- he's goofy but well-acted, and provides a nice contrast to Frasier.

[–] Deenglow 8 years ago

Sorry, but absolutely not - this season has too many misfires and additional characters who add nothing but take a lot away from the leads. In fact, what I feel most about this season is that the writers are finally really drifting, not sure what direction they want the show to go in.

[–] ClayGorgon 8 years ago

Not on par with the classics,perhaps but I think it's the best late season, after the first seven.It's very organic.

I'll have to rewatch Season 8 to compare, however Season 9 remains really enjoyable to me even on multiple viewings.

Seven 10 is a collection of B-plots, by comparison, and Season 11 is quite over-the top, with the characters more and more being sacrificed for laughs.

Plus, Daphne is indeed very mean in the last season, Martin and Ronee have no chemistry, in my opinion, and the relationships are no longer well-integrated into the family dynamic.

[–] 8 years ago

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[–] khowefl 8 years ago

I don't know about everyone else, but for me its the dad. He's a complete jerk. He's constantly complaining about something and is always very egotistical thinking his way is the right way. The biggest thing is when ever someone has a problem the dad isn't supportive or helpful at all. He instead attacks the person who's needing help and makes fun of them. They should of killed him off on the show. It would have made a lot of material for the writers to work with. They could have made ton of episodes off of it. So what is everyone else's favorites?

[–] 8 years ago

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[–] ClayGorgon 8 years ago

Martin's grumpiness throughout the show comes off as good-natured, really.
His numerous disapprovals are in good humor.

It's just the classic generation gap between parents and children.

Martin does wish his sons the best, he just wants them to be more like everyday people, lest they be hurt or get shut off by the environment.

It's only in the final season, that I've come to dislike Martin, especially the way he walks over Frasier to get to Ronee- that was very mean-spirited.

Then again, the characterization really went down in season 11.

[–] MedicJenny 8 years ago

I liked Season 9 more than Season 8, but I still didn't care for it much because of Daphnie's mother being so involved in the storyline. I guess I'm biased though because I hated the way they wrote her family from the start. I loved the "Daphnie snoops on Niles" episode though. It was the first time they really fought about something serious and it added some layers to their relationship.

[–] pritch636 8 years ago

hell no
there are some good episodes
but most if them wouldn't even be considered in the first few seasons.

[–] ClayGorgon 8 years ago

there are some good episodes but most of them wouldn't even be considered in the first few seasons.

I don't think most of these plots would fit the characters in the first few seasons, but they fit them at this stage of their relationships, especially after we've learned so much about them, and everything they've gone through.

I was happy to see them again as a family after all that transpired in the previous outing.

"Frasier" deserved a peaceful season like this. The interactions are more basic,yet still strongly written, and I think there's real warmth and sensibility to them, aided by the great characterization of the Cranes.
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Unfortunately, the above realization is also what ruins the final season for me. I just think that the family dynamic is at its weakest in the final season, along with the characterization.

For instance, Frasier pulling the chair out of Martin's reach, since he was expecting to meet that woman from the advertising agency in High-Holidays, or Niles cracking jokes at the expense of Freddy's girlfriend.

The writing no longer supports the characters, in my opinion, and vice versa- it's much more slapstick than before, and everything feels rushed.

I'd still regard The Doctor is Out as a classic, even though it doesn't have the charm of Out with Dad.

The first three episodes of the final season are fairly good, in general.(One of my favorite scenes from this season was Niles at the S bank.) But after that, my interest starts to wane.

I may still come around on Season 11 in a future viewing.
I guess I was so mellowed by Season 9 that I don't see how the final season is in the same league as the classics.

If anything, it's my least favorite.

[–] Gothish 8 years ago

I'm happy to find someone else who (mostly) shares my views on the later seasons. I loathed Michael Keaton's character in Wheels of Fortune and Julia's Sweeney's awful Ann Hodges in The Placeholder and The Ann Who Came to Dinner, but otherwise I enjoyed seasons 9-11 quite a bit.

Season 11 takes a lot of criticism, but I loved it for the most part, and it contains three of my favorite episodes: The Doctor is Out, Murder Most Maris (which features one of David Hyde Pierce's most hilarious performances), and High Holidays are all top notch. I also found the series finale quite satisfying.

"Two gin and Frescas"
"Shaken, not ridiculed"

[–] ClayGorgon 8 years ago

Favorite episodes in Season 9:

Bla-Z-Boy
The Return of Martin Crane
A Room Full of Heroes
The Proposal
Bully for Martin
The Two Hundredth
Deathtrap
The First Temptation of Daphne
Sharing Kirby
Moons over Seattle

Weakest episodes, in my opinion:

Cheerful Goodbyes( I always skip it )

War of the Words(poor characterization, and I don't like the dialogue)

Frasier Has Spokane(the drama around Roz is quite sour)

Juvenilla( don't have much to say about it. Just feels like filler)

The Guilt Trippers( the ending scene with Roz and her relatives is fairly ruinous)

And the rest is above average, I thought, which is pretty good for such a late season.

Not much in Season 9 touches the first seven in terms of comedy,but no matter , the show has established itself already as a classic.

I just really like this season for the warm vibe and the family scenes the most; the rest is just bonus.
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I like a fair chunk of Season 10 as well. Even the often maligned
Some Assembly Required.

The thing is, the humor in Season 10 is still drawn from the characters' traits and personalities which is what keeps it engaging for me.

There are stretches of character, but even at its goofiest, it remains light-hearted.
It's only the truly heavy-handed stuff that I skip.
===============================================================================

Right now I'm rewatching Season 7 for the umpteenth time. It's often the one I most gravitate to when I feel like watching the show out of order.

Man, it's so good. Even episodes that I initially found subpar like Rivals are just wickedly great.

Every scene and bit of dialogue between Niles and Daphne take on an extra meaning in this season, since I know what's going to happen in the end.

[–] ERThree 8 years ago

Favorite episodes in Season 9:

Bully for Martin

WOW, really? For me, that's one of the show's worst episodes. It had a really good premise (an episode focusing on Martin's new job, which unfortunately ended up being quite underused for storylines), but the writing is really poor; it's clear that the writers want us to side with Martin partway through the episode, but I was on Frasier's side right up to the end, as Martin's boss seemed like a complete jerk based on what we saw before the final scene. There are some funny moments (Frasier's bodyguard, Frasier and Niles in the closet at the end), but IMO, this episode stuck out like a sore thumb for how weak it was and wasted a good plot idea.

Favorite episodes in Season 9:

Bla-Z-Boy
The Return of Martin Crane
A Room Full of Heroes
The Proposal
Moons over Seattle

I agree with these. I would also include "Sharing Kirby" (Frasier and Niles are great in this one) and "The Guilt Trippers" (sorry! Even though the premise was a rip-off of Season 5's "Room Service," I thought it was a really well-done episode and one of Peri Gilpin's best performances).

Weakest episodes, in my opinion:

War of the Words(poor characterization, and I don't like the dialogue)

Frasier Has Spokane(the drama around Roz is quite sour)

Juvenilla( don't have much to say about it. Just feels like filler)

And the rest is above average, I thought, which is pretty good for such a late season.

I agree with those choices (especially the first one!), but I would also throw in the aforementioned "Bully for Martin" as well as "Three Blind Dates," which is a much less funny retread of "Three Dates and a Breakup" from Season 4. For me, the rest of the season is merely okay, but wholly watchable (including "Cheerful Goodbyes," which was alright for what it was).

I like a fair chunk of Season 10 as well. Even the often maligned
Some Assembly Required.

I like a fair chunk of Season 10 too, but we can't be friends if you find "Some Assembly Required" enjoyable. Granted, I suppose that was already established by me liking "The Guilt Trippers." :P

[–] ClayGorgon 8 years ago

The Guilt Trippers is alright,actually, but I don't like how they keep mulling about what happened in the end.

I thought Bully for Martin was just funny, and the delivery of the entire episode is spirited.
It wouldn't pass for a classic in any other season, and Season 9 is still below the first seven, but it's not as bad as people say.

The best episode is BlaZ-Boy, and the opening scene is one of my favorite in the series.

War of the Words was depressing to watch.One of the few episodes that I simply found unpleasant.

While Some Assembly Required is just goofy, yet light-hearted.
The show was definitely not devoid of some goofiness even in the early seasons.

Personally, I thought it was so much like Frasier to force his taste in interior design on that couple, just because he contributed in some minor way to the project.

Though the same concept was much more sharply written in the excellent Father of the Bride , in Season 7, where Frasier insisted on arranging Daphne's wedding

[–] ERThree 8 years ago

The best episode is BlaZ-Boy, and the opening scene is one of my favorite in the series.

War of the Words was depressing to watch.One of the few episodes that I simply found unpleasant.

I completely agree with both of these statements. Granted, "War of the Words" does have a funny moment at the end, but it sure as hell isn't worth the 20 dreadful minutes that come before it.

While Some Assembly Required is just goofy, yet light-hearted.
The show was definitely not devoid of some goofiness even in the early seasons.

Personally, I thought it was so much like Frasier to force his taste in interior design on that couple, just because he contributed in some minor way to the project.

Although Frasier believing that he was a qualified expert after his minimal contribution to the project was in character, I have a hard time believing that Frasier would take pride in being a handyman. Personally, I found that entire episode extremely annoying from beginning to end, not just for the Frasier plot, but also for the worst subplot of any episode (Daphne fussing with Gertrude over her getting a job at Cafe Nervosa), the extremely bad writing (the cow furniture gag that was as ridiculous as it was predictable, the children randomly going from hating Niles' assembly to loving it, the entire Daphne/Gertrude subplot, etc.), and for being the only episode that failed to make me laugh once.

Hey, if you like it, that's good for you. But yes, "Father of the Bride" is a MUCH better "perfectionist Frasier" episode than "Some Assembly Required" (I'm also quite fond of "The Focus Group"; I know some people don't like it because of the ending, but that episode was so deliberately over-the-top that it was impossible for me to take the outcome too seriously).

[–] ClayGorgon 8 years ago

Yea, I've mentioned Sharing Kirby in my opening post, I like this episode too. Really, all their rivalry episodes are amusing.

Funny you should mention The Focus Group. I love it, as it's funny and inspired, even though I'm glad that episodes like this are uncommon since they're pretty uncharacteristic of the show, when you think about it.

It's one of the very few episodes in the series which is more akin to a sitcom like "Seinfeld".It's just the manner in which the situation is treated and how it escalates into a disaster, which is so unlike "Frasier",

The other such episode that strikes me as fairly Seinfeldian is Hot Ticket in Season 6, where Frasier and Niles don't want to be seen standing in queue to the cancellation booth.
Specifically, Niles pretending to be a smoker.

[–] ClayGorgon 8 years ago

I'd watched it again, and yea, I'd defnitely take Sharing Kirby over Wheels of Fortune . The latter is fair , but a tad over-the top.Plus, Michael Keaton is not particularly convincing in his role.
It does provide some laughs, and features one of the funnier credit scenes.

I don't mind Three Blind Dates.It's nothing original, and gets a bit drawn out during the third sequence, but the first two are decent. The one with Frasier and Niles at the bookstore is especially good.

I enjoy all the episodes with Cam Winston as well.
I also think Deathtrap is a really underrated installment.

[–] pc-privconfounder 8 years ago

Like every season after the 7th, the 9th has more misses than hits.

[–] ClayGorgon 8 years ago

I don't mind Season 8 either; it's very watchable( and I think better than the final season) but it's not as good as Season 9 , in my opinion.

I held an opposite opinion before, but in truth, I'd watch Season 8 now if I'm rewatching the show in order; for the sake of continuity.

The best episodes in Season 8, I think, are:

Hooping Cranes(classic)
The Show Must Go Off(classic)
Frasier's Edge
Cranes Unplugged
And The Dish Ran Away with the Spoon(parts 1 and 2)
Taking Liberties
Daphne Returns(the clipshow, and the accompanying dialogue between Frasier and Niles are especially great)

Overall, Season 9 just feels more spirited,organic and better put together;the characters are better integrated in the plotlines.

When rewatching it, I only skip
Cheerful Goodbyes(technically, not a Frasier episode)

War of the Words( actually, I think it's the worst Frasier episode by far. and a rare dud, considering the high quality of the show as a whole)
Frasier Has Spokane-too drawn out, with an overwrought last act.

I mean, even the average episodes of Season 9 are salvaged by good characterization and spirited delivery. The majority of Season 9 is fairly above average and better, by the show's standards

[–] VanillaStarr 8 years ago

I liked the season a lot. Then again, there really isn't ANY season of Frasier I dislike.

Life sucks, Brendon. That's your lesson. Go enjoy it.

[–] jezfernandez 8 years ago

I agree with Deenglow. The examples you give just don't land for me. I can't quite put my finger on it - that spark of comedy genius disappeared completely by the end of Season 8. 8 was the last vestige of good writing and should have ended there.

[–] ClayGorgon 8 years ago

Season 8 is funny, and all, but more scattered in terms of plots: Roz and Martin dog-watching, Roz writing a book based on Heide? Frasier going out with that lawyer, Roz hosting her own show about space?

The characters are slotted into plots that do not fit them much, I think and are kind of just bumped around a lot, and shuffled with other characters.

I like the vibe in Season 9 more as well, it's zeroed in on the family a lot more.

And it's really one of my favorite things about Frasier: the Cranes as a family unit.

Which is why I think Season 11 is fairly lacking too; aside from the humor turning more random and less character driven, it becomes more concerned with who's Frasier dating, which would have been fine if it had meshed with the family affairs, but it feels separate.

[–] jezfernandez 8 years ago

Yep, a fair observation though there was good comedy in all the episodes mentioned. Frasier obsessing about his bill and and Marty rubbing it in about crooked lawyers. Also, Roz and Frasier swapping roles in Docu.Drama and the lovely bit with John Glenn. [sarcastically] "Yes...John Glenn, all American hero!"

Saying that, I've only recently bought Season 9 - looking through the episode listing, there's a lot in there I like.