MovieChat Forums > Quigley Down Under (1990) Discussion > Ok Gun Buffs..... Is it Possible?

Ok Gun Buffs..... Is it Possible?

posted 13 years ago by SteveM-1
15 replies | jump to latest

I'm not a Huge Gun Enthusiast (however, I do support Gun Owners' Rights in the USA), so I don't know much about the mechanics of firearms.

Quigley's Rifle has always intrigued me, however. I hear that it was an 1874 Sharps Buffalo Rifle, but would it be possible to modify such a rifle (and the ammunition) to give it the same qualities as the rifle was supposed to have in the movie?

I'm mainly talking about a period piece rifle, not today's modern weaponry with advanced sight technology.

Just wondering if it was possible to modify a late 19th century rifle to perform as Quigley's did in the movie or if it's more Fantasy than Reality. I know that many times the Hollywood Writers will bestow qualities on weaponry that actually defy the laws of Physics here in the real world (as many episodes of "Mythbusters" will attest), so I'm curious if the Hollywood writers actually determined if Quigley's Rifle would be feasible or not.

Also curious as to how much of this would be the Rifle, and how much would be the Skill of the Shootist. It would seem that Quigley had exceptional eyesight and also a good working knowledge of Physics and Bullet Trajectory (testing the wind, leading the shot, etc) to make this Long Distance Sharp Shooting work. So, how well would Quigley do with just a standard rifle, and how well would an average rifleman do with Quigley's Customized Rifle?

[–] 13 years ago

[deleted]

[–] SteveM-1 13 years ago

yes it did. Thanks.

[–] Kimball_James_Lee 13 years ago

Yes. Historically, it is accurate for the times. The Sharps rifle was designed in 1848 as a Slanting-breech loaded rifle, and by 1874 (the point in time specified in the movie) the Sharps rifle was able to fire the metallic ammunition that is the 45-70, which had recently been developed. People commonly upgraded their already existing Sharps rifles to fire the round. Contrary to popular belief about the Wild West, Colt Peacemakers weren't exactly the most popular guns. Most people used the older model 1860's pistols with Richards-Masons conversion kits to fire .45 Long Colt, so what Quigley did was perfectly reasonable, as well as common for the times.

The gun was capible of everything in the movie. As a matter of fact, I bought one myself. The 45-70 round is a masterpiece. You just have to be a good shot to get the full use of it.

http://www.uberti.com/firearms/1874-sharps.php
It's only $2,309 from Uberti, lol..

[–] 13 years ago

[deleted]

[–] 13 years ago

[deleted]

[–] smokehill retrievers 9 years ago

I don't dispute for a minute that any of the shots made in Quigley Down Under are entirely possible with a custom Sharps as depicted. Of course they are. However, the likelihood of anyone pulling them off most of the time, off-hand and especially under some of the circumstance depicted, is highly doubtful to me. Without a very accurate optics, depending solely on the eyesight and skills of anyone, I tend to think of Quigley's skills as being more mythic than based on the real skills of anyone who ever lived.

The sheer number of shots he made successfully in the film, often with virtually no time to estimate distance or wind conditions, or properly support the rifle .... no, one simply has to suspend our disbelief and enjoy the show for what it is -- entertainment.

Those of us who have spent a lot of time shooting, and especially for distance, can tell stories of all-but-impossible shots we HAVE made, but that doesn't mean we expect to do them with any regularity -- especially quickly and under stress. I have made three "impossible" distance shots that immediately come to mind. Yes, I aimed, and very carefully, but the amount of luck involved vastly exceeded my skills. The toughest part, often, is appearing quite nonchalant after making one of these shots, hoping that the witnesses may swallow the impression that you do this all the time, no big deal -- when, in truth, if I had immediately had to duplicate any of these shots right away, the odds against me would be astronomical.

I'll admit it here ... just don't tell my wife or my friends.

[–] trickg1 12 years ago

That's what gives the character a mythical quality. Yeah, that degree of accuracy at that point in time would have been pretty much superhuman.

Regarding the weight of the rifle, for a guy the size of Quigley/Selleck (He's listed on IMDB as 6 foot, 3 and a half inches, but I've met him and he's substantially taller than me, and I'm 6'1") it would be easier to handle. Still, the offhand/unsupported shot at the bucket at that range would have been pretty much impossible - a wiggle by just a smidge at the gun magnifies out to inches in lost accuracy the further out you go.

Regarding the 1874 Sharps rifle, it would have been available in any number of cartriges and callibers - the 45-110 wasn't uncommom. If Quigley had special ordered the rifle to have a 34" (as opposed to the stock 30") barrel then it would make sense that he could have specified the cartridge as well.

(Note: at the time, the 45-110 wasn't actually designated that way on the headstamp of the cartridge. I would have been known as a 45-2 & 7/8ths.)

My name is Gladiator - Maximus Decimus Meridius

[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] dippy_in_dc_1 12 years ago

Even if the man was capable, the consistancy of black powder was not (homogeneity, grain size by screen range, moisture content consistancy with ammo carried on trans-Pacific ship voyage), and the bullets were blunt lead rather than modern jacketed boat-tail with carefully polished pointed bullets.

[–] Randy-144 11 years ago

In a famous battle between whites and Indians in 1874 Texas an Indian was hit by a bullet from a Sharps rifle at a distance of 1538 yards (7/8 mile).
http://www.rodbeemer.com/2013/03/billy-dixon-and-the-sharps-big-fifty/

In 1992 forensic scientists at the Army Yuma Proving Grounds tracked by radar the flight of a bullet from a .50-90 Sharps. As the article linked below states, "One of the forensic scientists wrote an article in their newsletter saying that the Billy Dixon shot at Adobe Walls in 1874 could not possibly have happened." Then they duplicated the Billy Dixon shot -- the bullet landed 1,517 yards away.
http://powderburns.tripod.com/sharps.html

[–] ledge12-1 11 years ago

I would think the "Big 50" would be more common as the .45-110 was less common, most long range hunters (ie buff hunters) used the .45-70 the army had plenty of it and it was free

[–] 11 years ago

[deleted]

[–] 11 years ago

[deleted]

[–] foster1234 10 years ago

I am not an expert

Just a guy who likes guns

The sharps was originaly developed as a 50 caliber useing a paper cartridge, useing primer caps similar to the old rolls of caps

Brass center fire shells were don developed untill after the Civil War

The 45-70 govt wasn't developed untill around 1872 or 3 for the trapdoor Springfield rifle, the carbine was not approve for cavalry use until 1876 in the 45-55 caliber

The 45-70 govt. was developed specifically for the govt and even today it is known as the 45-70 govt

In a world where a carpenter can be resurrected, anything is possible.

[–] 9 years ago

[deleted]