MovieChat Forums > State of Grace (1990) Discussion > A few thoughts on this film

A few thoughts on this film


Amidst all the thugs, scumbags and murderers you have our undercover cop, the good guy, supposedly. But he's conflicted, because he cares deeply about his old friend Jackie, who he hasn't seen for all of his adult life. He just can't help but feel for Jackie, who is a thoroughly despicable character that outside of killing and beating up people and getting pissed does absolutely nothing that can be considered even vaguely redeeming. He inflicted potentially life-threatening injuries on a poor guy who was chatting to his favourite hooker. Terry doesn't seem to mind all that much. Even upon fresh reminders of how awful his old friend is, he still beats himself up over bringing the law or potential harm upon Jackie and the gang. So we understand that not even Terry really values goodness and decency, but rather the friendship is the central thing here. But it just isn't conveyed in a believable or engaging way. Terry has lived almost half his life without seeing Jackie and he first goes back to see him only when sent on a mission that he fully understands the implications of, and yet we're supposed to believe that he's the dearest thing on earth to him?

What I'm saying isn't that a film in order to be good has to tell the story of likeable characters, but if all the key characters are immoral or not quite deserving of my sympathy (as is often the case, naturally, in gangster films), they have to be intriguing and engaging on some other level. What is it that drives them, what do they live for, what are their passions? I find it hard to care about a guy who's portrayed as constantly getting drunk and whose drives and passions in his life as a gangster are completely unexplored. Is it the money? Hardly, they're a bunch of bums. Is it the gangster prestige and honour? Hardly, they're a bunch of bums. So we have this mindless, hollow character as the main preoccupation of our main character. I find that the inner turmoil that should make Terry a somewhat complex character is completely undermined by the nature of the Jackie character. The rest of the characters are mostly one-dimensional thugs, idiots or hysterical. John Turturro's character was smooth and had an interesting beard.

As for Gary Oldman's performance that everyone raves about, I recognize that it is a big (and loud) performance, but I'm not that enthusiastic. I don't know if it's overplayed or if it's the sheer mindlessness and hollowness of the character that annoys me, but it's a routine constisting of hysterical, drunk, drunk, hysterical, yelling, drunk hysterical slob, drunk, drunk, hysterical with a few moments of sad interspersed. It's so cartoonish.

In fewer words: poor characters, little depth, ineffective emotional dynamic.

I've never ranted on the imdb boards before, thought I should try it at least once.

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So just bcuz Jackie is beating the crap out of the guy at the bar, terry is supposed to compromise his cover for that? LoL. If an undercover cop were to stop the first crime he comes across, he wouldn't get very far now would he? It's called deep cover for a reason.

We don't know how many years he's been away so it's not unbelievable that he's so conflicted. Maybe Jackie has gotten that much worse since Terry left and he wasn't emotionally prepared to see it firsthand. Maybe he was hoping he could find a way to help them even tho he knew his superiors wouldn't go for it. He obviously never wanted to leave Boston and return to Hell's Kitchen but he was forced to. it worse by delaying the hit.

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"So just bcuz Jackie is beating the crap out of the guy at the bar, terry is supposed to compromise his cover for that? LoL. If an undercover cop were to stop the first crime he comes across, he wouldn't get very far now would he? It's called deep cover for a reason."

That's obviously not what I said. Of course he shouldn't break his cover, after all it is to expect that they threaten, assault and kill people. What I'm saying is that if anything he should become even more commited to following his mission through. But he doesn't, because his true feelings are getting in the way. In fact, he wants to quit, but not because he can't stomach the gangster stuff, but because he feels guilty for working on taking down the Flannerys and Jackie in particular, also because going along pretending and working under cover is emotinally taxing in general, I guess. His guilt is not part of the cover, it's getting in the way. So what I was discussing was basically why he feels such guilt over going after the Flannerys and Jackie, who are rather horrible people. Even taking their old friendship and childhood/youth bond into account, the extent of his guilt seemed unfounded to me, based on what the film showed me.




"We don't know how many years he's been away so it's not unbelievable that he's so conflicted. Maybe Jackie has gotten that much worse since Terry left and he wasn't emotionally prepared to see it firsthand. Maybe he was hoping he could find a way to help them even tho he knew his superiors wouldn't go for it. He obviously never wanted to leave Boston and return to Hell's Kitchen but he was forced to. it worse by delaying the hit."

Twelve years had passed. And yes, he does tell the girl about his deluded dream of coming back making everything alright with everybody. One could of course imagine that his ties to them were super strong from before he disappeared, it's just that the film doesn't explore that. It doesn't paint that background properly. I don't know enough about the guy's story to buy his breakdowns later on. Maybe he's just very unhappy in general, for several reasons, his past and his memories among them, and the new situation becomes the catalyst that makes it all fall apart for him. But again, it's not explored deeply enough in the film.

I realize that creating believable and engaging characters is a fine art. Any kind of subtlety can be crucial to making a character "work" and making the story more nuanced and complete.

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