Ridiculous


I just watched Pacific Heights for the first (and last) time last night. This movie was ridiculous from beginning to end. So, some random person can go into someone's house, lock himself into a room, and be considered a tenant? That makes no sense. This is called trespassing! The guy was never invited in, never paid rent, changed the locks, started destroying property, etc. The landlords should've called the police and that would be the end of it. Alas, that never happened and this is what made the movie so frustrating and preposterous. Time after time throughout the movie, Drake makes the most obviously bad decisions. And on top of that, the movie writer tries to justify everything that's going on by saying it's California law. It's a shame too because Michael Keaton plays a really good bad guy. The only redeeming part of the movie was when Keaton got a taste of his own medicine at the hotel. Also, the remodeled house was nice.

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I absolutely agree!! I stopped this movie after the police paid a visit. I tell you, if this is California law, I NEVER want to move to California. I've watched enough People's Court to know nothing in this movie makes sense!! Yes, it was against the law for him to shut off power and heat; that much is true. The officer said, "Whether he has a lease or not, he's still a tenant." ABSURD!! He has a right to change the locks? Who owns the building? The tenant? He doesn't own the place!! He's RENTING the apartment. The landlord has a right to enter the apartment in case of an emergency or to do repairs. Changing the locks is illegal. Drake has a right to start eviction proceedings. No rent has been paid. Keaton ADMITS there was a problem with the money. GO TO SMALL CLAIMS COURT!! You don't have to mess with attorneys!! There's landlord/tenant court, go through evictions!! This is the biggest piece of crap I've ever seen.

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i'm guess this reply is a either a joke or sarcastic because you think the movie is ridiculous as well.

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This film may not be great, but Michael Keaton definately deserves a film career.

I've always enjoyed his films, even if (like this one) it's just for his part.

Oh nad remember films are fantasy. Film would be avery boring medium if everything that ever happended was realistic. Suspend your belief occasionally.

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Have you considered an "Anger Management Course?" Jeez...this site is for opinions and discussions of movies. Ya don't have to be so mean!

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Yikes! Don't burst a vein mate...

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Jesus, IvanAtlas! Calm down, homie.

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Damn you're a douche Atlas

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The correct procedure is to have the prospect fill out a complete application, run a background check, and check out all the references. They didn't know anything about that. Carter just slid by them with smooth talk. He became a squatter when he changed the locks. Then all the police visits are useless. Drake and Patti would have had to legally evict him through the courts. Nobody told them anything about that. And although Carter frightened them, they were just short of terrorizing him. His whole goal was to push them into court on fake grounds, and be awarded their property as damages. It didn't unfold to his plan, so he demolished what he could in a way that hugely devalued the property and left a huge emotional toll on Drake an Patti. And he does make a fabulous sicko bad guy, Like Patti said to the new buyer, "no, I don't have much feeling for this place. It was just an investment."

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I have to agree with Rinkedo here. They should have educated themselves on the real estate laws, the correct procedures, etc, before investing that building in the first place...if they had known this, they would have avoided the entire nightmare in the first place. But then, there'd have been no movie. And that's true too, when she said, "It was just an investment." And she didn't mean just financially...she also meant an investment in their lives, and time, and relationship...all of which survived.

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People's Court!

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CA has the most ridiculous laws, it's the criminals that have all the rights.

Y'know, I could eat a peach for hours

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YOU PEOPLE OBVIOUSLY LIVE WITH YOUR PARENTS. Do you know anything about tenant rights? Do you own any buildings? I do. And I can tell you that this movie is in many ways very accurate. Do you know that all you need to do is receive a piece of mail at a house to be considered a resident? Keaton WAS invited into the house under the assumption that he paid deposit, so I'm not sure why you think it's trespassing. Or that the police have no power in evicting tenants? Never mind the fact that actually evicting a tenant can take months, and ALWAYS results in losses for the manager/owner. That's why it's so tough renting in California, especially L.A. or S.F. The rental application, background checks, credit checks, cosigners... all because of variations on tenant behavior that has been displayed in this movie.

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They should have locked the doors to the place to make sure Keaton couldn't enter in the first place, if they were suspicious at all.

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gregg: You are 100% right. Not to mention, I believe he signed a lease. Plus he could have easily said he did pay and they were lying while trying to get more money. The fact that he even admitted to the cops that there was a problem with one of the banks PROBABLY made him look more innocent, like saying "Why would he admit there was a problem with money unless he was telling the truth??" Plus the cops only saw proof of Drake being hostile and "Garrett" was always calm and upfront about things.

Plus I used to know someone who their spouse and them would sign a lease to an apt, intentionally not pay, sit there for months at a time until the landlord got a court order, forcing them out and then go on to the next one. Believe me, this kind of stuff happens more often than you think.

Real love is FOREVER!!!!

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"Garrett"? .. don't you mean Carter?

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[deleted]

This movie was ridiculous from beginning to end. So, some random person can go into someone's house, lock himself into a room, and be considered a tenant?
I guess you ridiculously missed the fact that he had a signed lease, which was mentioned to the sheriff.

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"If I've never seen it before, it's a new release to me."

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gregg-67 is right. There are definite technicalities when it comes to leasing an apartment. Basically, if you are living in a place you are considered the tenant. Lease or no lease. On the same note, even if you have signed a lease with a landlord, unless you actually move your stuff in and stay at the apartment, you have not officially "taken posession" and you are within your rights not to do so. The latter actually happened to someone I know.

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Right or wrong, this movie still sucked out loud.



"I'll bet you never smelled a real school bus before"

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It's obvious that most of the idiots on this board still live with their parents. This is a well acted and well directed suspense thriller , very underrated and realistic. Most laws protect tenants, not just in California, and it can literally take months to evict someone regardless of the circumstances. I've seen situations very similar to this movie, maybe worse believe it or not. I lived in an apartment a few years back and a "Carter Hayes" type moved in to the apartment above me. He seemed nice enough at first but quickly stopped paying rent and became a total nightmare for all involved. Several unsavory characters moved in with him and they proceeded to terrorize and destroy the property. The landlord was completely helpless, the police did nothing. Trust me, this movie isn't unrealistic.

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The most unbelievable point about this movie is this - how could a recently married young couple like Drake and his wife afford a property on Pacific Heights?

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They weren't married.

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The movie is definitely close to the mark on realism, I'm taking a Real Estate Law class right now, and one of our extra credit assignments is to watch this movie and point out all of the topics we covered in class about tenant rights! On a personal note, I think the LAW is what is ridiculous!

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so your saying i can just say im interested in an apartment in L.A. walk in under permission to check the place out with NO DEPOSIT, only interest in place, and when the superintendaent walks out before me i can run back in, lock the door and go "na, na, na, na-na, its my place now and im a bum with no money, now its my new home for FREE! I didn't know it was that easy to get a place! I DON'T THINK SO!

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that's exactly what i'm talking about, catmckay. glad someone sees how unrealistic the movie is!

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Obviously this is an old post, but I'll throw my two cents in. The key factor in this situation is that Drake allowed Carter to move in. He should have got the money first, but he didn't. Drake allowed him into the apartment and Carter assumed residency. In your example, you would be there illegally and subject to police ejection. Carter became a resident through permission of the landlord.

Like other posters mentioned, once a person is in, it's a very long and tedious process to get them out through the court. The renter is still supposed to pay rent before the court hears the case, but clearly Carter was a scam artist who never intended on following through with anything legally.

Here in SF where the movie takes places, there are dozens of web sites telling people how to screw their landlord. These ass monkey hippies will never stop.

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There is no Santa Claus, no Easter Bunny, and the law has nothing to do with what is right or wrong. As preposterous as the concept of this movie might seem, its basic premise is close to reality. The legal system in North America favors those people with the knowledge and inclination to exploit it.

It seems the crazy tenant-landlord laws were not much better in Vancouver Canada. 10 years ago, the house that I presently rent was once occupied by squatters,who took over the place from the actual tenants. The "legal" renters had moved out suddenly to go live with (and mooch off) a relative. Before doing so, they phoned their lowlife buddies to come live in the house. These fine specimens ended up living at their new party house for a few months with no intentions of ever paying the rent, or being respectful to property that was not their own.

The owner was even told to f@ck off when she came to evict them, and the police would not get involved. It took the legal owner of the property many weeks of "playing by the rules" to finally get the squatters out, and get her house back.

The end result; no jail time or penalties were imposed on the squatters. The owner did regain control of her house but albeit in much worse shape. She not only lost 2 months rent but had to pay out $10,000 to repair the damage done.

Was it fair? of course not. Does it all seem implausible? absolutely.

All this nonsense did have a very positive outcome for me though. When I moved in, I inhabited a newly refurbished house, and the landlord has gone out of his way to keep a good tenant happy.

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Dear Lagger7,
Sadly, this movie is not as "ridiculous" as one would like to believe. The laws, both civil and criminal, have everything to do with bureacratic procedures and inflexible iron-clad rules, they have little or nothing to do with "fairness". The "losers" in our society are those individuals who naively assume that the law has got something to do with fair-play, honesty and good faith. The guys who end up getting obscenely rich are the sleazebags and psychopaths who know how to exploit and manipulate the flaws in our legal system to their own advantage.
You sound like a nice person, I hope to God that you never have to learn the hard way just how unfair, predatory and basically evil some people are.
john

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I enjoyed the movie. I need to say I couldn't understand how he would manage to stay in that building without paying a dime for as long as he did. It may take time to go through the legal system and get a tenant out. BUt that's probably when someone has been paying and suddenly is thirty days late paying that would buy them some time like maybe a month. But a person who has not paid a dime? I don't understand why the landlord didn't call the cops when Carter was making all that noise late at night, that is against the law. Instead of turning off the electricity and water, he should of called the cops.

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for morons who keep saying that LA tenant laws in the movie arn't that far fetched, read my last post again and remember that is exactly how it happened in the movie. Find the official bylaw or a bylaw and post it here to try and prove to me that these tenant laws shown in the movie are for real and not full of s****.

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I just didn't see how the tenant had all the rights once he signed that piece of paper. He never paid the landlords and the tenant never let them into his appt. or even showed up when they were knocking at his door. That part i found annoying. I don't know how these things work.

Hello. My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die.

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"LA tenant laws"? Who is talking about Los Angeles? Pacific Heights is in San Francisco, a totally different jurisdiction, perhaps the tenant laws are different today, the question is: was the film far fetched in relation to the laws that prevailed in San Francisco up to the shooting of this film in 1990?

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I am stunned at how uninformed people are. As a landlord once you sign a lease with a tenent and allow the tenent to take possession then you must go thru the process of eviction to remove the tenent. It does not matter whether the tenent actually paid you money. The Lease grants the Tenent specific rights. The eviction process takes between 120 and 180 days providing the landlord follows all of rules. In the movie when the landlord shutoff the utilities this provided a legal basis for the tenent to conduct a rent strike. There was a scene in the movie where the landlords finally hired an attorney and it was explained to them that their actions up until this point was the reason an eviction would take so long.

BTW - Of course a Tenant can change the locks of his dwelling without consulting a landlord.

Here is the process for eviction (true of all jurisdictions in the US):
1. the landlord must issue a demand notice telling the tenent what they must do to cure the default (in most cases it is over money) and how long the tenent has to cure the default (there are specific state and local laws that dictate how long the tenant actually has to cure the default).

Now if the issue is over money and the tenant offers partial payment and the landlord accepts this payment, the notice is invalidated. A new notice would have to be issued with new dates.

2. once the notice expires without satisfaction then the landlord can file for an eviction with the Clerk of the Courts

3. the Clerk of the Courts issues a notice of a court date. typically the court will not hear the tenants side of the case unless the tenant deposits the amount of the defaulted monies with the clerks office; however it should be noted that this is not a hard and fast rule. the court will also hear evidence of landlord abuse and/or evidence whether the tenant actually paid. this is why following the rules is important because if your action is dismissed then you have to go back to step 1 and begin again.

4. the court issues an eviction for a date in the future, typically 30 to 60 days after the hearing date.

5. Once the date for eviction has elapsed this eviction goes on the list of evictions at the local sherrif's civi division. the deputies coordinate date/time with the lanlord for taking posseesion of the property.

6. At the eviction the deputy informs the tenant they must go. The landlord is ultimately responsible for removing the tenants belongings from the property. The landlord is not responsible for the security of the tenants belongings.

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If you remember when the couple were checking out Carter Hayes during the movie,once it became apparant he was bad news,they quickly learnt he was a master at this game and a con man in many respects.From the moment he moved into the apartment he set about stripping it of anything he could make money on.

Of course he knew the process of the courts and exactly when the young couple could legally have him evicted,that's why he vanished just before they gained access to his apartment.

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Yes, it is ridiculous but so are your comments. You think you know so much, however, you are painfully ignorant, lagger7. TENANTS RIGHTS! Learn it. Love it and live it. Welcome to the world of Democrats, the swine who advocate this garbage BS and pervert and twist the law to punish law abiding citizens in favor of the scum and dregs of society.

If you were an intelligent person, you wouldn't support Democrats but it is obvious you vote for politicians who enact ridiculous legislation, such as TENANTS RIGHTS. The only thing here more ridiculous than your comments...
...is you!

Now, go slap yourself, you bumbling ignoramus!

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In truth, though the OP has taken lots of abuse over the last couple of years, what he writes is mostly accurate. To begin, California Tenant Law includes (at: http://www.dca.ca.gov/publications/landlordbook/living-in.shtml) that: As a tenant, you must take reasonable care of your rental unit and any common areas that you use. You must also repair all damage that you cause, or that is caused by anyone for whom you are responsible, such as your family, guests, or pets. These important tenant responsibilities are discussed in more detail under "Dealing with Problems".

As for Hayes'/Keaton's "eviction":

It's very important for you to pay your rent on the day it's due. Not paying on time might lead to a negative entry on your credit report, late fees, and even eviction.

Source: California Department of Consumer Affairs

There's much more, but this "worst case" scenario is not simply absurd, I imagine that it would almost be impossible to pull off. Not to say that there aren't those who abuse tenant/landlord laws--there are -- but, as a landlord several times over, this incident in Pacific Heights looked then and looks now like way over the top.

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You are ALMOST right. Had they called the cops in the very beginning for trespassing, this movie would not exist. HOWEVER, it doesn't make the movie ridiculous. They were new landlords up against a very seasoned con artist. When Griffith first sees the man in the apartment, she is not going to call the cops because she is not sure of the agreement he made with her husband. So then when she talks to the husband, they start to realize that something isn't right. I hardly think their very first thought is "OH MY GOD THIS GUY IS GONNA MOVE INTO OUR PLACE, NEVER PAY RENT, DESTROY IT AND TRY TO KILL US!!!" No. They are going to approach the guy and ask what going on. He will come up with delay tactics like "Yes, I submitted the paperwork for the bank transfer (we all know bank transfers can take a few days)". After a reasonable amount of time, the landlord can't get payment or figure out a way to get this guy out. So he turns off the utilities which is where the real problem begins. It's very easy to explain to the cop that there is simply a delay in the payment reaching the landlord. Now it's starting to look just like your average tenant-landlord dispute. No way is a cop going to just side with the landlord. A judge will have to decide. Keaton knows he will be thrown out eventually....but he is just delaying it as long as possible..which is what this movie is about.

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now . All I have to do is go find a place I want to live in my old neighborhood in CA , look at it , sneak back in when no one is looking and I'll have the place I want . I wish I would've known so I wouldn't have been stuck here in Las Vegas for the last 20 years !

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Actually, at the time, California Cival Laws permitted Carter Hayes to do what he did. He played on a misunderstanding between the landlords, and took possesion. From that point on, every law was on his side. Only in California!

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